Replacing A20 audio speakers in 2017 C300 coupe
05-18-2017, 10:23 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
Replacing A20 audio speakers in 2017 C300 coupe
I am looking for advice regarding upgrading my A20 speakers in my 2017 C300.
Has anyone done this upgrade and what speakers did you use? Did you change the sub as well? Did it make a difference in the sound?
The speakers in the doors look like they are 4 inch. There doesn't appear to be a big selection of speakers of that size. One has to wonder why MB would use such a small speaker when 2 years ago they had 6 inch in the doors.
Would appreciate any advice.
Mike (Canadac300)
Has anyone done this upgrade and what speakers did you use? Did you change the sub as well? Did it make a difference in the sound?
The speakers in the doors look like they are 4 inch. There doesn't appear to be a big selection of speakers of that size. One has to wonder why MB would use such a small speaker when 2 years ago they had 6 inch in the doors.
Would appreciate any advice.
Mike (Canadac300)
05-19-2017, 09:29 AM
#2
MBWorld Fanatic!
There are a lot of issues with the A20. As you pointed out, the lack of any 6" mid bass drivers is a problem. Your whole system consists of one 7" ish "sub" in the foot well and 4 very flimsy 4" midrange speakers in the doors. No tweeters. Power is meager, coming directly from the head unit rather than an amp. As a result, adding more robust, power hungry speakers will have little effect.
There's a link in my sig with a write up on an A20 upgrade. If you don't want to go that far, I'd find an inexpensive, efficient 4" coaxial speaker for the front doors so you get the tweeters in there, and add a sub in the trunk. Since you'll want the sub to play up into the mid bass range some, I'd stick with an 8" sub (or two) in a ported box. There's one in my Burmester write up that would work.
You could also just pick up a set of 1" tweets for the front door sail panels and pull signal from the front 4" to avoid replacing the door speakers. The Burmester uses a widely available tweet that's standard in virtually every car audio system, so a set of tweets on EBay from any Benz or BMW will work.
There's a link in my sig with a write up on an A20 upgrade. If you don't want to go that far, I'd find an inexpensive, efficient 4" coaxial speaker for the front doors so you get the tweeters in there, and add a sub in the trunk. Since you'll want the sub to play up into the mid bass range some, I'd stick with an 8" sub (or two) in a ported box. There's one in my Burmester write up that would work.
You could also just pick up a set of 1" tweets for the front door sail panels and pull signal from the front 4" to avoid replacing the door speakers. The Burmester uses a widely available tweet that's standard in virtually every car audio system, so a set of tweets on EBay from any Benz or BMW will work.
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whkento (06-02-2017)
05-19-2017, 10:03 AM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
Thank you for your reply.
There is no easy solution which I kind of guessed but I wanted to see what other owners had done. I guess my next step is to go to a good car audio installer and see what can be done and how much. Again, thanks.
Mike
There is no easy solution which I kind of guessed but I wanted to see what other owners had done. I guess my next step is to go to a good car audio installer and see what can be done and how much. Again, thanks.
Mike
05-19-2017, 12:11 PM
#4
MBWorld Fanatic!
First decide what it is about the sound you dislike, and focus your efforts on mitigating those issues.
For example, the sound is very thin and overly bright. Cut the mids out of the factory EQ. Not enough lows, put the bass to full. Lack of presence, boost treble. If you use an IPhone for local files or Apple Music, set the IPhone's internal EQ to Bass Booster, Rock or R&B.
I had an A20 in a loaner and got decent audio just by using a $3 app, EQu by Elephant Candy. There are lots of options if you use your mobile device as a source.
For example, the sound is very thin and overly bright. Cut the mids out of the factory EQ. Not enough lows, put the bass to full. Lack of presence, boost treble. If you use an IPhone for local files or Apple Music, set the IPhone's internal EQ to Bass Booster, Rock or R&B.
I had an A20 in a loaner and got decent audio just by using a $3 app, EQu by Elephant Candy. There are lots of options if you use your mobile device as a source.
05-25-2017, 11:09 PM
#6
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Canadac, can you please share your findings after visiting an audio installer? I'm in the same boat as you.
05-26-2017, 11:03 AM
#7
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You need to find an installer who has done a system or two in a W205. Otherwise they're just poking around in the dark and spending your money. The problem is not so much with the quality of the speakers. It's with the speaker array itself, where the Frontbass needs to play up into the mid-range because there are no 6" mid-bass speakers, and where there are way too many 4" midrange speakers.
Basically, however you go about it, you need to repurpose the Frontbass and Door speakers to become conventional 2-Ways, by changing the crossovers to cut out the low bass frequencies to the Frontbass speakers. (They're actually perfectly sized to be conventional woofers).
Then you need to add a sub in the trunk to pick up the lows you pulled out of the Frontbass.
Lastly you need some form of equalization to clean up the brightness of the mid-range and to tighten up the low and mid bass. That's how we ended up with a combo DSP Integration Amp, since it handled the crossover duties and the EQ duties, and the power amp duties all in one package. (Because the Burmester is fiber optic from the head unit to the amp in the trunk, there is no way to pull low voltage signal. You have to come off the high (powered) side of the amp, which means the voltage needs to be stepped down before it can be processed, then the signal re-amplified before it goes out to the speakers. The DSP/Amp handled that as well.
Personally, I'd keep the OEM speakers and just add the DSP amp and the sub, and then reevaluate whether or not to get into the speakers.
Basically, however you go about it, you need to repurpose the Frontbass and Door speakers to become conventional 2-Ways, by changing the crossovers to cut out the low bass frequencies to the Frontbass speakers. (They're actually perfectly sized to be conventional woofers).
Then you need to add a sub in the trunk to pick up the lows you pulled out of the Frontbass.
Lastly you need some form of equalization to clean up the brightness of the mid-range and to tighten up the low and mid bass. That's how we ended up with a combo DSP Integration Amp, since it handled the crossover duties and the EQ duties, and the power amp duties all in one package. (Because the Burmester is fiber optic from the head unit to the amp in the trunk, there is no way to pull low voltage signal. You have to come off the high (powered) side of the amp, which means the voltage needs to be stepped down before it can be processed, then the signal re-amplified before it goes out to the speakers. The DSP/Amp handled that as well.
Personally, I'd keep the OEM speakers and just add the DSP amp and the sub, and then reevaluate whether or not to get into the speakers.
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05-27-2017, 03:36 AM
#8
Member
I have purchased some 1 inch tweeters to fit into the a pilar speaker covers on the front doors. My intention is to connect them to the front door speakers, does anyone know how to remove the a pillar covers and do I need to fit a capacitor to filter out the lower notes?
Thanks in advance
Greg r
Ps I have the Audio 20 system
Thanks in advance
Greg r
Ps I have the Audio 20 system
05-29-2017, 06:04 PM
#9
Junior Member
You need to find an installer who has done a system or two in a W205. Otherwise they're just poking around in the dark and spending your money. The problem is not so much with the quality of the speakers. It's with the speaker array itself, where the Frontbass needs to play up into the mid-range because there are no 6" mid-bass speakers, and where there are way too many 4" midrange speakers.
Basically, however you go about it, you need to repurpose the Frontbass and Door speakers to become conventional 2-Ways, by changing the crossovers to cut out the low bass frequencies to the Frontbass speakers. (They're actually perfectly sized to be conventional woofers).
Then you need to add a sub in the trunk to pick up the lows you pulled out of the Frontbass.
Lastly you need some form of equalization to clean up the brightness of the mid-range and to tighten up the low and mid bass. That's how we ended up with a combo DSP Integration Amp, since it handled the crossover duties and the EQ duties, and the power amp duties all in one package. (Because the Burmester is fiber optic from the head unit to the amp in the trunk, there is no way to pull low voltage signal. You have to come off the high (powered) side of the amp, which means the voltage needs to be stepped down before it can be processed, then the signal re-amplified before it goes out to the speakers. The DSP/Amp handled that as well.
Personally, I'd keep the OEM speakers and just add the DSP amp and the sub, and then reevaluate whether or not to get into the speakers.
Basically, however you go about it, you need to repurpose the Frontbass and Door speakers to become conventional 2-Ways, by changing the crossovers to cut out the low bass frequencies to the Frontbass speakers. (They're actually perfectly sized to be conventional woofers).
Then you need to add a sub in the trunk to pick up the lows you pulled out of the Frontbass.
Lastly you need some form of equalization to clean up the brightness of the mid-range and to tighten up the low and mid bass. That's how we ended up with a combo DSP Integration Amp, since it handled the crossover duties and the EQ duties, and the power amp duties all in one package. (Because the Burmester is fiber optic from the head unit to the amp in the trunk, there is no way to pull low voltage signal. You have to come off the high (powered) side of the amp, which means the voltage needs to be stepped down before it can be processed, then the signal re-amplified before it goes out to the speakers. The DSP/Amp handled that as well.
Personally, I'd keep the OEM speakers and just add the DSP amp and the sub, and then reevaluate whether or not to get into the speakers.
It would be awesome if someone finds an installer in the GTA area who has the knowhow and also doesn't charge an arm and a leg for the installation. I'll keep looking too and share if I find someone. Until then i'll try to focus on the drive.
Last edited by raihak; 05-29-2017 at 06:06 PM.
05-29-2017, 06:41 PM
#10
MBWorld Fanatic!
My installer belongs to this association of professional installers around the country (MESA) who share detailed information about specific cars they've done. My 205 is written up in there in specific detail.
Audison installers:
http://www.elettromedia-usa.com/dealer-locator
MESA shops:
http://mespecialists.com/locate-specialist/
Cross reference to find an Audison dealer who is also a MESA member in your area.
Audison installers:
http://www.elettromedia-usa.com/dealer-locator
MESA shops:
http://mespecialists.com/locate-specialist/
Cross reference to find an Audison dealer who is also a MESA member in your area.
Last edited by Mike5215; 05-29-2017 at 06:48 PM.
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whkento (06-02-2017)
06-25-2017, 09:54 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
MB C300 A20 audio
Okay I went to my recommended auto audio installer and his overal view was this was going to cost some money and how much did I want to put into it. Also the installer was of the opinion that all MB, BMW and Audi cars use optical connections. At the time I had doubts that this was correct when it came to the A20. It turns out the optical connections pertain to the Burmiester system.
Anyway after thinking about this I went in the direction of replacing the front door 4" speakers. With the help of my installer we auditioned a few different speakers and I ended up using Hertz 4" speaker model number ECX1004 2 way speaker.
The problem for me with the stock MB speaker was how scratchy they sounded which related to the mid tone reproduced by the speaker. The new Hertz did smooth that out as best it could for a 4" speaker. So by adjusting the EQ down to an acceptable level while keeping the highs close to level 0 the sound is much improved. By the way I could not achieve that with the stock speakers. When inspecting the removed stock speaker I was blown away at how cheap they were.
I have not replaced the rear speakers. So I just balanced the sound all to the front and the sound is way better than it was.
My disappointment with MB on this is their slogan "the best or nothing". They put nothing into the A20 as a standard audio system.
I hope this will help you and is not too late. If I'm late what did you end up doing?
Mike
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-25-2017, 10:45 PM
#12
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Originally Posted by Canadac300
Sorry for my late response back.
Okay I went to my recommended auto audio installer and his overal view was this was going to cost some money and how much did I want to put into it. Also the installer was of the opinion that all MB, BMW and Audi cars use optical connections. At the time I had doubts that this was correct when it came to the A20. It turns out the optical connections pertain to the Burmiester system.
Anyway after thinking about this I went in the direction of replacing the front door 4" speakers. With the help of my installer we auditioned a few different speakers and I ended up using Hertz 4" speaker model number ECX1004 2 way speaker.
The problem for me with the stock MB speaker was how scratchy they sounded which related to the mid tone reproduced by the speaker. The new Hertz did smooth that out as best it could for a 4" speaker. So by adjusting the EQ down to an acceptable level while keeping the highs close to level 0 the sound is much improved. By the way I could not achieve that with the stock speakers. When inspecting the removed stock speaker I was blown away at how cheap they were.
I have not replaced the rear speakers. So I just balanced the sound all to the front and the sound is way better than it was.
My disappointment with MB on this is their slogan "the best or nothing". They put nothing into the A20 as a standard audio system.
I hope this will help you and is not too late. If I'm late what did you end up doing?
Mike
Okay I went to my recommended auto audio installer and his overal view was this was going to cost some money and how much did I want to put into it. Also the installer was of the opinion that all MB, BMW and Audi cars use optical connections. At the time I had doubts that this was correct when it came to the A20. It turns out the optical connections pertain to the Burmiester system.
Anyway after thinking about this I went in the direction of replacing the front door 4" speakers. With the help of my installer we auditioned a few different speakers and I ended up using Hertz 4" speaker model number ECX1004 2 way speaker.
The problem for me with the stock MB speaker was how scratchy they sounded which related to the mid tone reproduced by the speaker. The new Hertz did smooth that out as best it could for a 4" speaker. So by adjusting the EQ down to an acceptable level while keeping the highs close to level 0 the sound is much improved. By the way I could not achieve that with the stock speakers. When inspecting the removed stock speaker I was blown away at how cheap they were.
I have not replaced the rear speakers. So I just balanced the sound all to the front and the sound is way better than it was.
My disappointment with MB on this is their slogan "the best or nothing". They put nothing into the A20 as a standard audio system.
I hope this will help you and is not too late. If I'm late what did you end up doing?
Mike
I think doing the two ways in the front doors and a small sub would be the way to go on the A20. There's an A20 write up using a Match DSP amp (link in my sig below) that would give you more control over EQ and crossover if you wanted to go further.
06-25-2017, 11:51 PM
#13
Junior Member
Sorry for my late response back.
Okay I went to my recommended auto audio installer and his overal view was this was going to cost some money and how much did I want to put into it. Also the installer was of the opinion that all MB, BMW and Audi cars use optical connections. At the time I had doubts that this was correct when it came to the A20. It turns out the optical connections pertain to the Burmiester system.
Anyway after thinking about this I went in the direction of replacing the front door 4" speakers. With the help of my installer we auditioned a few different speakers and I ended up using Hertz 4" speaker model number ECX1004 2 way speaker.
The problem for me with the stock MB speaker was how scratchy they sounded which related to the mid tone reproduced by the speaker. The new Hertz did smooth that out as best it could for a 4" speaker. So by adjusting the EQ down to an acceptable level while keeping the highs close to level 0 the sound is much improved. By the way I could not achieve that with the stock speakers. When inspecting the removed stock speaker I was blown away at how cheap they were.
I have not replaced the rear speakers. So I just balanced the sound all to the front and the sound is way better than it was.
My disappointment with MB on this is their slogan "the best or nothing". They put nothing into the A20 as a standard audio system.
I hope this will help you and is not too late. If I'm late what did you end up doing?
Mike
Okay I went to my recommended auto audio installer and his overal view was this was going to cost some money and how much did I want to put into it. Also the installer was of the opinion that all MB, BMW and Audi cars use optical connections. At the time I had doubts that this was correct when it came to the A20. It turns out the optical connections pertain to the Burmiester system.
Anyway after thinking about this I went in the direction of replacing the front door 4" speakers. With the help of my installer we auditioned a few different speakers and I ended up using Hertz 4" speaker model number ECX1004 2 way speaker.
The problem for me with the stock MB speaker was how scratchy they sounded which related to the mid tone reproduced by the speaker. The new Hertz did smooth that out as best it could for a 4" speaker. So by adjusting the EQ down to an acceptable level while keeping the highs close to level 0 the sound is much improved. By the way I could not achieve that with the stock speakers. When inspecting the removed stock speaker I was blown away at how cheap they were.
I have not replaced the rear speakers. So I just balanced the sound all to the front and the sound is way better than it was.
My disappointment with MB on this is their slogan "the best or nothing". They put nothing into the A20 as a standard audio system.
I hope this will help you and is not too late. If I'm late what did you end up doing?
Mike
I'm in the second month of ownership and I guess I'm not disturbed enough to make an impulse decision. I'm hesitating because;
1. Fear of letting an inexperienced audio-shop mess with the Merc audio system no matter how crap the A20 is. I've never had audio work done before so I don't have a guy i trust.
2. My car is a lease and as yet I don't have a figure in my head that i'm comfortable with. I was hoping to hear about costs from you so i could judge whether i'm comfortable with the cost or not.
These 2 things mean that it's probably going to be a while (if at all) before i get any work done. It's also not the top of my list right now. I need tints, then need to wrap in black the part of the roof above the rear windshield, need to put spacers on the rear wheels then maybe think about a spoiler... yes cosmetics first, just cannot do it all together.
I'd like to know what type of speakers are currently installed in the A20? Are they 2 way speakers? does the tweeter sit on the cone like for the Hertz? I also haven't seen where the rear speakers are. Did you take any photos of the discarded speakers or the process of replacing the front speakers?
Do you mind sharing the cost?
Why did you only go for 2 speaker upgrade and not 4?
What sort of figure did your guy quote for the whole nine yards?
What other speakers did you audition?
The solution that Mike5215 is referencing is my preferred one but I may not be able to afford it esp. for a leased vehicle... so still trying to investigate the possibilities. Thanks for sharing once again.
06-26-2017, 09:42 AM
#14
MBWorld Fanatic!
Currently in your A20 are four 4" paper coned midrange speakers, one in each door. There are no tweeters at all. The 4" have to cover all of the mids and highs.
There is one 6" midbass woofer in the right front passenger footwell. It has to cover anything else.
I get not wanting to put to much into a lease. Mine is a lease as well. Before turn in I'll have my shop pull it out and go back to stock. So far I've gotten five years over two cars out of the gear and it'll probably end up in my next car as well.
I'd go pretty cheap on the A20...a small sub in the trunk and a set of tweets in the front doors would make a huge difference.
For me audio is a huge priority and I've given up on manufacturer's "premium" systems to get it done. But it's not cheap and if you can tolerate the A20 and think you'd enjoy the car more doing cosmetic stuff do that.
There is one 6" midbass woofer in the right front passenger footwell. It has to cover anything else.
I get not wanting to put to much into a lease. Mine is a lease as well. Before turn in I'll have my shop pull it out and go back to stock. So far I've gotten five years over two cars out of the gear and it'll probably end up in my next car as well.
I'd go pretty cheap on the A20...a small sub in the trunk and a set of tweets in the front doors would make a huge difference.
For me audio is a huge priority and I've given up on manufacturer's "premium" systems to get it done. But it's not cheap and if you can tolerate the A20 and think you'd enjoy the car more doing cosmetic stuff do that.
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-26-2017, 12:40 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
Hi Mike (Canadac), thanks a bunch for sharing this info. It's an interesting alternative to what Mike5215 has suggested.
I'm in the second month of ownership and I guess I'm not disturbed enough to make an impulse decision. I'm hesitating because;
1. Fear of letting an inexperienced audio-shop mess with the Merc audio system no matter how crap the A20 is. I've never had audio work done before so I don't have a guy i trust.
2. My car is a lease and as yet I don't have a figure in my head that i'm comfortable with. I was hoping to hear about costs from you so i could judge whether i'm comfortable with the cost or not.
These 2 things mean that it's probably going to be a while (if at all) before i get any work done. It's also not the top of my list right now. I need tints, then need to wrap in black the part of the roof above the rear windshield, need to put spacers on the rear wheels then maybe think about a spoiler... yes cosmetics first, just cannot do it all together.
I'd like to know what type of speakers are currently installed in the A20? Are they 2 way speakers? does the tweeter sit on the cone like for the Hertz? I also haven't seen where the rear speakers are. Did you take any photos of the discarded speakers or the process of replacing the front speakers?
Do you mind sharing the cost?
Why did you only go for 2 speaker upgrade and not 4?
What sort of figure did your guy quote for the whole nine yards?
What other speakers did you audition?
The solution that Mike5215 is referencing is my preferred one but I may not be able to afford it esp. for a leased vehicle... so still trying to investigate the possibilities. Thanks for sharing once again.
I'm in the second month of ownership and I guess I'm not disturbed enough to make an impulse decision. I'm hesitating because;
1. Fear of letting an inexperienced audio-shop mess with the Merc audio system no matter how crap the A20 is. I've never had audio work done before so I don't have a guy i trust.
2. My car is a lease and as yet I don't have a figure in my head that i'm comfortable with. I was hoping to hear about costs from you so i could judge whether i'm comfortable with the cost or not.
These 2 things mean that it's probably going to be a while (if at all) before i get any work done. It's also not the top of my list right now. I need tints, then need to wrap in black the part of the roof above the rear windshield, need to put spacers on the rear wheels then maybe think about a spoiler... yes cosmetics first, just cannot do it all together.
I'd like to know what type of speakers are currently installed in the A20? Are they 2 way speakers? does the tweeter sit on the cone like for the Hertz? I also haven't seen where the rear speakers are. Did you take any photos of the discarded speakers or the process of replacing the front speakers?
Do you mind sharing the cost?
Why did you only go for 2 speaker upgrade and not 4?
What sort of figure did your guy quote for the whole nine yards?
What other speakers did you audition?
The solution that Mike5215 is referencing is my preferred one but I may not be able to afford it esp. for a leased vehicle... so still trying to investigate the possibilities. Thanks for sharing once again.
Okay we auditioned Clairion, Kenwood and the Hertz. To my ear as well as the tech the Hertz had a better sound. The MB stock speakers are only midrange, no tweeter. The Hertz had a top mounted tweeter which probably made the difference. By the way my installer added sound deadening material around and behind the speakers. My total bill was $400.00 plus tax which for the results was worth it to me. I didn't do the rear as no one will be sitting there unless it's the grandkids and sound would not be any issue. A quick quote to replace the rear speakers was around $700.00 because to get the side panels off the seat must come out so lots of labour. It just wasn't worth it. However if one was to spend $3000.00 to $4000.00 or more for a complete redo then it would be done. That was just too much money considering most of it is labour. For now I am happy with the current results.
If I may say, since you are leasing your C300 I would not consider doing all the things you spoke of. You may have pushback from the dealer. We have leased many cars and have done changes but the dealer wants the car back as delivered. It could cost double having things installed then taken off. We purchased our C300, that made it easy to change speakers and not worry about the dealer. We have in the past had the dealer do the tinting to the leased car. When we returned it, they removed the tinting. I guess not everyone like tinting.
As for a local auto dealer make some phone calls and ask questions concerning any experience with MB. I would like to point out that the factory installed Burmiester system is all connected by fibre-optic cables. Not the A20 because there is no other amps connecting to the MB head unit. These fibre-optic connections are a problem for installers as the 3rd party audio manufactures do not accept fibre-optic connects, yet. They will soon I would expect then the price goes up again.
I hope this helps.
Mike
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-26-2017, 12:57 PM
#16
Junior Member
Currently in your A20 are four 4" paper coned midrange speakers, one in each door. There are no tweeters at all. The 4" have to cover all of the mids and highs.
There is one 6" midbass woofer in the right front passenger footwell. It has to cover anything else.
I get not wanting to put to much into a lease. Mine is a lease as well. Before turn in I'll have my shop pull it out and go back to stock. So far I've gotten five years over two cars out of the gear and it'll probably end up in my next car as well.
I'd go pretty cheap on the A20...a small sub in the trunk and a set of tweets in the front doors would make a huge difference.
For me audio is a huge priority and I've given up on manufacturer's "premium" systems to get it done. But it's not cheap and if you can tolerate the A20 and think you'd enjoy the car more doing cosmetic stuff do that.
There is one 6" midbass woofer in the right front passenger footwell. It has to cover anything else.
I get not wanting to put to much into a lease. Mine is a lease as well. Before turn in I'll have my shop pull it out and go back to stock. So far I've gotten five years over two cars out of the gear and it'll probably end up in my next car as well.
I'd go pretty cheap on the A20...a small sub in the trunk and a set of tweets in the front doors would make a huge difference.
For me audio is a huge priority and I've given up on manufacturer's "premium" systems to get it done. But it's not cheap and if you can tolerate the A20 and think you'd enjoy the car more doing cosmetic stuff do that.
Audio is very important to me as well. Right now I'm still in the honeymoon period with my first Merc, first luxury car to be honest and maybe that's why i'm not overly bummed with the audio as yet. But a phased approach might work well for me, e.g. getting better 2 way coaxial speakers to begin with and then take it from there. I know I will want a sub but i can see how far the new speakers get me on the road to satisfaction.
I have a 2017 coupe and i'm not 100% certain if it has 6" mid-bass woofer in the footwell. I'll check if it does. It certainly doesn't feel like it has any sub-woofer.
I saw that another C300 owner posted a photo of a sub he got installed in the trunk where the spare wheel should go and that too relatively close by in Aurora! That's very intriguing...
Questions
- Does a setup like that (sub in the trunk) necessitate 100% an installation of a DSP?
- Can the woofer in the passenger footwell be improved to negate the need of a separate sub in the trunk? Would that require a DSP as well?
Thank you so much for your help.
06-26-2017, 03:13 PM
#17
Junior Member
Hi,
Okay we auditioned Clairion, Kenwood and the Hertz. To my ear as well as the tech the Hertz had a better sound. The MB stock speakers are only midrange, no tweeter. The Hertz had a top mounted tweeter which probably made the difference. By the way my installer added sound deadening material around and behind the speakers. My total bill was $400.00 plus tax which for the results was worth it to me. I didn't do the rear as no one will be sitting there unless it's the grandkids and sound would not be any issue. A quick quote to replace the rear speakers was around $700.00 because to get the side panels off the seat must come out so lots of labour. It just wasn't worth it. However if one was to spend $3000.00 to $4000.00 or more for a complete redo then it would be done. That was just too much money considering most of it is labour. For now I am happy with the current results.
If I may say, since you are leasing your C300 I would not consider doing all the things you spoke of. You may have pushback from the dealer. We have leased many cars and have done changes but the dealer wants the car back as delivered. It could cost double having things installed then taken off. We purchased our C300, that made it easy to change speakers and not worry about the dealer. We have in the past had the dealer do the tinting to the leased car. When we returned it, they removed the tinting. I guess not everyone like tinting.
As for a local auto dealer make some phone calls and ask questions concerning any experience with MB. I would like to point out that the factory installed Burmiester system is all connected by fibre-optic cables. Not the A20 because there is no other amps connecting to the MB head unit. These fibre-optic connections are a problem for installers as the 3rd party audio manufactures do not accept fibre-optic connects, yet. They will soon I would expect then the price goes up again.
I hope this helps.
Mike
Okay we auditioned Clairion, Kenwood and the Hertz. To my ear as well as the tech the Hertz had a better sound. The MB stock speakers are only midrange, no tweeter. The Hertz had a top mounted tweeter which probably made the difference. By the way my installer added sound deadening material around and behind the speakers. My total bill was $400.00 plus tax which for the results was worth it to me. I didn't do the rear as no one will be sitting there unless it's the grandkids and sound would not be any issue. A quick quote to replace the rear speakers was around $700.00 because to get the side panels off the seat must come out so lots of labour. It just wasn't worth it. However if one was to spend $3000.00 to $4000.00 or more for a complete redo then it would be done. That was just too much money considering most of it is labour. For now I am happy with the current results.
If I may say, since you are leasing your C300 I would not consider doing all the things you spoke of. You may have pushback from the dealer. We have leased many cars and have done changes but the dealer wants the car back as delivered. It could cost double having things installed then taken off. We purchased our C300, that made it easy to change speakers and not worry about the dealer. We have in the past had the dealer do the tinting to the leased car. When we returned it, they removed the tinting. I guess not everyone like tinting.
As for a local auto dealer make some phone calls and ask questions concerning any experience with MB. I would like to point out that the factory installed Burmiester system is all connected by fibre-optic cables. Not the A20 because there is no other amps connecting to the MB head unit. These fibre-optic connections are a problem for installers as the 3rd party audio manufactures do not accept fibre-optic connects, yet. They will soon I would expect then the price goes up again.
I hope this helps.
Mike
Thanks for explaining the selection options and why you didn't opt to change the rear speakers (makes total sense and now I wont bother with those either).
Please tell me, is there a 6" woofer in the passenger footwell in the coupe?
Also, i couldn't find the speaker model you mentioned listed anywhere on any website, similar speakers to those you mentioned at roughly $100/pair. Were any additional components installed? New wires etc? Or did the installer just unplug the OEM speakers and plug the new ones in using the existing cables? I'm trying to understand if it was $300 or thereabouts in labour.
$400 does sound reasonable to me and i'm definitely going to pursue this with local installers with the knowledge i've gained thanks to you and Mike.
Thanks for the advice on the other mods too. I have a 45 months lease, it's a long time, i definitely want the tints, that's a pretty standard expense. The wrap is something I will do myself, so total cost is $25... the roof panel is very straight, barely any heating involved and it's also easy to peel off. The spacers are roughly $165... i might combine that with winter tire change later this year or maybe even next year. The spoiler i will probably hold off on. So the cosmetic changes are minor, inexpensive and easily removed.
The audio will probably end up costing more than the others combined.
06-26-2017, 04:17 PM
#19
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
WOW! Thank you for the detailed response! this is very valuable information for me!
Thanks for explaining the selection options and why you didn't opt to change the rear speakers (makes total sense and now I wont bother with those either).
Please tell me, is there a 6" woofer in the passenger footwell in the coupe?
Also, i couldn't find the speaker model you mentioned listed anywhere on any website, similar speakers to those you mentioned at roughly $100/pair. Were any additional components installed? New wires etc? Or did the installer just unplug the OEM speakers and plug the new ones in using the existing cables? I'm trying to understand if it was $300 or thereabouts in labour.
$400 does sound reasonable to me and i'm definitely going to pursue this with local installers with the knowledge i've gained thanks to you and Mike.
Thanks for the advice on the other mods too. I have a 45 months lease, it's a long time, i definitely want the tints, that's a pretty standard expense. The wrap is something I will do myself, so total cost is $25... the roof panel is very straight, barely any heating involved and it's also easy to peel off. The spacers are roughly $165... i might combine that with winter tire change later this year or maybe even next year. The spoiler i will probably hold off on. So the cosmetic changes are minor, inexpensive and easily removed.
The audio will probably end up costing more than the others combined.
Thanks for explaining the selection options and why you didn't opt to change the rear speakers (makes total sense and now I wont bother with those either).
Please tell me, is there a 6" woofer in the passenger footwell in the coupe?
Also, i couldn't find the speaker model you mentioned listed anywhere on any website, similar speakers to those you mentioned at roughly $100/pair. Were any additional components installed? New wires etc? Or did the installer just unplug the OEM speakers and plug the new ones in using the existing cables? I'm trying to understand if it was $300 or thereabouts in labour.
$400 does sound reasonable to me and i'm definitely going to pursue this with local installers with the knowledge i've gained thanks to you and Mike.
Thanks for the advice on the other mods too. I have a 45 months lease, it's a long time, i definitely want the tints, that's a pretty standard expense. The wrap is something I will do myself, so total cost is $25... the roof panel is very straight, barely any heating involved and it's also easy to peel off. The spacers are roughly $165... i might combine that with winter tire change later this year or maybe even next year. The spoiler i will probably hold off on. So the cosmetic changes are minor, inexpensive and easily removed.
The audio will probably end up costing more than the others combined.
Do a Google search for Hertz speakers. The model I have is the 1004 which I see has now been replaced with the 1005. I believe it's just a model number change.
My installer just replaced the standard speaker and added some sound deadening material to help get as much sound out of these speakers. No wire changes. The Hertz speakers were $129.99 for the pair. Plus a $30.00 cost for doing the sound deadening material. Having the tech change out different speakers to compare was a great advantage. I sure there are other speakers out there but you are usually restricted to the line of speakers the dealer carries. No one carries every brand.
Don't hesitate to adjust the eq controls. You can maximize the sound to your liking, treble, mid range and base sounds. With the standard MB speakers I turned the mid range way down to smooth out the mid tones. I am very pleased with the speaker change I did. If you just do the fronts adjust the balance to the front seats as the rears speakers will degrade the overal sound.
As for the tints, have your dealer do it. Let me say their price was very competitive and the car looks great with the tinting. The tinting we did is street legal by the way and that's what any good installer should apply.
Canadac300 (Mike)
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-26-2017, 06:42 PM
#20
MBWorld Fanatic!
Just to clarify, you don't lease your car from a dealer and they don't have a say regarding the condition the car is when the lease ends.
When you lease a car, MBFS buys that car from the dealer, who is paid in full for the car up front as if you'd bought it from him for cash. They're out of the deal the moment MBFS funds the lease. Your duty (and contract) then is to MBFS, who requires that the car either be returned to them (not the dealer) with mileage no greater than agreed upon, and with no excessive wear and tear.
Or, you can write them a check for the residual and keep the car. They don't care. So for turn-in the car has to appear stock, and everything has to function normally. In the US, turn in inspections are usually done by an independent 3rd party. They're not going to catch an aftermarket sound system if the interior looks stock with no damage. Just remember that anything you do to a leased car can be undone without a visible trace. You can either leave it in there, or pay to have it removed and the stock gear reinstalled.
In either case, the dealer you actually turn the car in to couldn't care less. It's just another used car to them. They can either buy it from MBFS if they'd like to keep it and sell it on the lot, or let MBFS know it's there so it can be shipped off to auction.
For me, if I'm writing a fat check every month I'm going to, within reason, set the car up as a like it. (I never do mechanical mods, mainly to protect the warranty). But do whatever you need to do to the audio, wheels, cosmetic body bits, etc that makes you happy and the payment worth it to you. Just don't do anything irreversible!
When you lease a car, MBFS buys that car from the dealer, who is paid in full for the car up front as if you'd bought it from him for cash. They're out of the deal the moment MBFS funds the lease. Your duty (and contract) then is to MBFS, who requires that the car either be returned to them (not the dealer) with mileage no greater than agreed upon, and with no excessive wear and tear.
Or, you can write them a check for the residual and keep the car. They don't care. So for turn-in the car has to appear stock, and everything has to function normally. In the US, turn in inspections are usually done by an independent 3rd party. They're not going to catch an aftermarket sound system if the interior looks stock with no damage. Just remember that anything you do to a leased car can be undone without a visible trace. You can either leave it in there, or pay to have it removed and the stock gear reinstalled.
In either case, the dealer you actually turn the car in to couldn't care less. It's just another used car to them. They can either buy it from MBFS if they'd like to keep it and sell it on the lot, or let MBFS know it's there so it can be shipped off to auction.
For me, if I'm writing a fat check every month I'm going to, within reason, set the car up as a like it. (I never do mechanical mods, mainly to protect the warranty). But do whatever you need to do to the audio, wheels, cosmetic body bits, etc that makes you happy and the payment worth it to you. Just don't do anything irreversible!
06-26-2017, 07:18 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
Just to clarify, you don't lease your car from a dealer and they don't have a say regarding the condition the car is when the lease ends.
When you lease a car, MBFS buys that car from the dealer, who is paid in full for the car up front as if you'd bought it from him for cash. They're out of the deal the moment MBFS funds the lease. Your duty (and contract) then is to MBFS, who requires that the car either be returned to them (not the dealer) with mileage no greater than agreed upon, and with no excessive wear and tear.
Or, you can write them a check for the residual and keep the car. They don't care. So for turn-in the car has to appear stock, and everything has to function normally. In the US, turn in inspections are usually done by an independent 3rd party. They're not going to catch an aftermarket sound system if the interior looks stock with no damage. Just remember that anything you do to a leased car can be undone without a visible trace. You can either leave it in there, or pay to have it removed and the stock gear reinstalled.
In either case, the dealer you actually turn the car in to couldn't care less. It's just another used car to them. They can either buy it from MBFS if they'd like to keep it and sell it on the lot, or let MBFS know it's there so it can be shipped off to auction.
For me, if I'm writing a fat check every month I'm going to, within reason, set the car up as a like it. (I never do mechanical mods, mainly to protect the warranty). But do whatever you need to do to the audio, wheels, cosmetic body bits, etc that makes you happy and the payment worth it to you. Just don't do anything irreversible!
When you lease a car, MBFS buys that car from the dealer, who is paid in full for the car up front as if you'd bought it from him for cash. They're out of the deal the moment MBFS funds the lease. Your duty (and contract) then is to MBFS, who requires that the car either be returned to them (not the dealer) with mileage no greater than agreed upon, and with no excessive wear and tear.
Or, you can write them a check for the residual and keep the car. They don't care. So for turn-in the car has to appear stock, and everything has to function normally. In the US, turn in inspections are usually done by an independent 3rd party. They're not going to catch an aftermarket sound system if the interior looks stock with no damage. Just remember that anything you do to a leased car can be undone without a visible trace. You can either leave it in there, or pay to have it removed and the stock gear reinstalled.
In either case, the dealer you actually turn the car in to couldn't care less. It's just another used car to them. They can either buy it from MBFS if they'd like to keep it and sell it on the lot, or let MBFS know it's there so it can be shipped off to auction.
For me, if I'm writing a fat check every month I'm going to, within reason, set the car up as a like it. (I never do mechanical mods, mainly to protect the warranty). But do whatever you need to do to the audio, wheels, cosmetic body bits, etc that makes you happy and the payment worth it to you. Just don't do anything irreversible!
I've had my 2017 C300 for 6 weeks and I love the car. It's just too bad that MB degraded the base audio system from 6" speakers to 4" speakers so that a water bottle could be placed in the door. I've had Lexus cars whose base audio system is 8 to 10 speakers with separate tweeters, surround sound and a sub in the trunk. That's my delema I assumed MB would have a really good system. "The best or nothing" really doesn't apply in this case as they really put in nothing to listen to.
Canadac300 (Mike)
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-26-2017, 08:28 PM
#22
MBWorld Fanatic!
Yes, advertising slogans are rarely full of heartfelt sincerity. The Ultimate Driving Machine actually is a nice car that is not close to being the "ultimate" anything. Audi quietly retired "Truth In Engineering" when parent company VAG was caught defrauding emissions tests. The advertising word for it is "puffery". I never take it literally.
I do get your reservations about putting $5k into the audio on a leased car. The alternative though is 36 months of regret. $5000/36 months is $139 a month. Would I have paid an extra $140 for an optional Audison/Focal/JL audio package when I chose the car? If I hated the manufacturer's audio, um hell yes. And that's presuming I leave most of the system in the car when I return it. (It'll cost me about $500 to have the shop put it back to stock. I have to decide if, after enjoying it in two cars over five years, have I gotten my money's worth? The gear is five years old at that point. Its cash value is minimal. Is it worth $500 to get it back? The question is, could I replace it for $500? If the answer is "no", I'll probably salvage it for my next car (or put it in one of my kid's cars)
All things being equal, the C meets my expectations in most respects with the exception of the audio which I totally agree with you is an insult in a $50,000 anything, much less a Benz. Especially with all the marketing hype about the "Burmester" brand and what it represents. If they were being honest there would be "Kraco" emblems on the speaker grilles. (Kraco was a brand of car audio sold in K Mart stores when I was a kid)
My thinking is if I'm writing a check for $800 a month on a car that disappoints me whenever the radio is on, or $940 for one that thrills me, I'll find the extra $140. That's just my approach. I realize not everyone thinks like me. I know guys who resent even having to put an extra nickel into a leased car because it's not "theirs". I figure leased or purchased, if I'm making payments I'm going to set the car up for maximum enjoyment.
No approach is "right", but don't feel bad about making a leased car more enjoyable if you want to. We have these cars because they're rewarding to drive.
I do get your reservations about putting $5k into the audio on a leased car. The alternative though is 36 months of regret. $5000/36 months is $139 a month. Would I have paid an extra $140 for an optional Audison/Focal/JL audio package when I chose the car? If I hated the manufacturer's audio, um hell yes. And that's presuming I leave most of the system in the car when I return it. (It'll cost me about $500 to have the shop put it back to stock. I have to decide if, after enjoying it in two cars over five years, have I gotten my money's worth? The gear is five years old at that point. Its cash value is minimal. Is it worth $500 to get it back? The question is, could I replace it for $500? If the answer is "no", I'll probably salvage it for my next car (or put it in one of my kid's cars)
All things being equal, the C meets my expectations in most respects with the exception of the audio which I totally agree with you is an insult in a $50,000 anything, much less a Benz. Especially with all the marketing hype about the "Burmester" brand and what it represents. If they were being honest there would be "Kraco" emblems on the speaker grilles. (Kraco was a brand of car audio sold in K Mart stores when I was a kid)
My thinking is if I'm writing a check for $800 a month on a car that disappoints me whenever the radio is on, or $940 for one that thrills me, I'll find the extra $140. That's just my approach. I realize not everyone thinks like me. I know guys who resent even having to put an extra nickel into a leased car because it's not "theirs". I figure leased or purchased, if I'm making payments I'm going to set the car up for maximum enjoyment.
No approach is "right", but don't feel bad about making a leased car more enjoyable if you want to. We have these cars because they're rewarding to drive.
06-26-2017, 08:45 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
Yes, advertising slogans are rarely full of heartfelt sincerity. The Ultimate Driving Machine actually is a nice car that is not close to being the "ultimate" anything. Audi quietly retired "Truth In Engineering" when parent company VAG was caught defrauding emissions tests. The advertising word for it is "puffery". I never take it literally.
I do get your reservations about putting $5k into the audio on a leased car. The alternative though is 36 months of regret. $5000/36 months is $139 a month. Would I have paid an extra $140 for an optional Audison/Focal/JL audio package when I chose the car? If I hated the manufacturer's audio, um hell yes. And that's presuming I leave most of the system in the car when I return it. (It'll cost me about $500 to have the shop put it back to stock. I have to decide if, after enjoying it in two cars over five years, have I gotten my money's worth? The gear is five years old at that point. Its cash value is minimal. Is it worth $500 to get it back? The question is, could I replace it for $500? If the answer is "no", I'll probably salvage it for my next car (or put it in one of my kid's cars)
All things being equal, the C meets my expectations in most respects with the exception of the audio which I totally agree with you is an insult in a $50,000 anything, much less a Benz. Especially with all the marketing hype about the "Burmester" brand and what it represents. If they were being honest there would be "Kraco" emblems on the speaker grilles. (Kraco was a brand of car audio sold in K Mart stores when I was a kid)
My thinking is if I'm writing a check for $800 a month on a car that disappoints me whenever the radio is on, or $940 for one that thrills me, I'll find the extra $140. That's just my approach. I realize not everyone thinks like me. I know guys who resent even having to put an extra nickel into a leased car because it's not "theirs". I figure leased or purchased, if I'm making payments I'm going to set the car up for maximum enjoyment.
No approach is "right", but don't feel bad about making a leased car more enjoyable if you want to. We have these cars because they're rewarding to drive.
I do get your reservations about putting $5k into the audio on a leased car. The alternative though is 36 months of regret. $5000/36 months is $139 a month. Would I have paid an extra $140 for an optional Audison/Focal/JL audio package when I chose the car? If I hated the manufacturer's audio, um hell yes. And that's presuming I leave most of the system in the car when I return it. (It'll cost me about $500 to have the shop put it back to stock. I have to decide if, after enjoying it in two cars over five years, have I gotten my money's worth? The gear is five years old at that point. Its cash value is minimal. Is it worth $500 to get it back? The question is, could I replace it for $500? If the answer is "no", I'll probably salvage it for my next car (or put it in one of my kid's cars)
All things being equal, the C meets my expectations in most respects with the exception of the audio which I totally agree with you is an insult in a $50,000 anything, much less a Benz. Especially with all the marketing hype about the "Burmester" brand and what it represents. If they were being honest there would be "Kraco" emblems on the speaker grilles. (Kraco was a brand of car audio sold in K Mart stores when I was a kid)
My thinking is if I'm writing a check for $800 a month on a car that disappoints me whenever the radio is on, or $940 for one that thrills me, I'll find the extra $140. That's just my approach. I realize not everyone thinks like me. I know guys who resent even having to put an extra nickel into a leased car because it's not "theirs". I figure leased or purchased, if I'm making payments I'm going to set the car up for maximum enjoyment.
No approach is "right", but don't feel bad about making a leased car more enjoyable if you want to. We have these cars because they're rewarding to drive.
Thanks for your comments and insights. Oh, and I remember the Kraco products!
06-26-2017, 08:56 PM
#24
MBWorld Fanatic!
I had a Kraco Power Booster attached to my under dash Pioneer cassette deck with FM Supertuner technology driving a pair of Jensen 8x10 Tri Axials in a 69 Plymouth Barracuda I paid $350 for and I was the happiest man alive.
I also got laid about 5,000 times in that car. Now, a $60,000 Mercedes with $5k in high end audio gear. Number of times I've gotten laid in it: Zero.
I also got laid about 5,000 times in that car. Now, a $60,000 Mercedes with $5k in high end audio gear. Number of times I've gotten laid in it: Zero.
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raihak (06-26-2017)
06-26-2017, 09:53 PM
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Mercedes SLC 300 Polar White
I had a Kraco Power Booster attached to my under dash Pioneer cassette deck with FM Supertuner technology driving a pair of Jensen 8x10 Tri Axials in a 69 Plymouth Barracuda I paid $350 for and I was the happiest man alive.
I also got laid about 5,000 times in that car. Now, a $60,000 Mercedes with $5k in high end audio gear. Number of times I've gotten laid in it: Zero.
I also got laid about 5,000 times in that car. Now, a $60,000 Mercedes with $5k in high end audio gear. Number of times I've gotten laid in it: Zero.
