Need Advice on Adding More Power to HPS SC
01-05-2007, 12:08 AM
#1026
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
Still Dissapointed
After Mechtech installed my methonal injection kit, colder T-Stat and Bosch Intercooler Pump, they showed me a dyno chart of 387rwhp. I did not trust this number since I did not witness the dyno run myself.
So I took my car the same day down to JBA Motorsports in San Diego for an independent dyno. Three consecutive runs showed that it made only 370rwhp (consistently) and 401 lbs torque which is only a 10 rwhp gain from the House of Power Dyno Day on April 15th although I used 5 gallons of racing fuel mixed in with 10 gallons of 91 octane back then and this time I only used 91 octane pump gas. I don't think the 5 gallons of racing fuel makes any difference.
However, I suspect that the ECU was reflashed by the Long Beach MB dealer when they loaded a service campaign recall while my car was having the all the hubs and suspension repaired from my renegade wheel accident. The car's A/F ratio was in the mid-to-high 9's at WOT which way to rich. Before my accident, my A/F ratio was beautiful at 11.5 at WOT.
I am currently looking for a tuner to custom tune my ECU after my latest upgrades since it looks like Jessie's program was wiped by the dealer. I took my car down to see Jessie at Status Design Motorsports in Hermosa Beach but he was too busy and told me to drop the car off with him NEXT TIME.
I get the feeling he is either unwilling or afraid of re-tuning my car with the HPS kit still installed. A Brabus rep referred me to a tuner from San Jose (Car Toys) named Twan who does custom tuning but he told me that the HPS kit was too difficult to tune since the max rwhp he got with an HPS kit was 395rwhp, but at the expense of numerous hours of testing and dyno and road tuning. He said it just would not make economic sense to hire him as it could easily cost me several thousand just to gain 20-25rwhp. Linh also recommended a tuner from SF named Jake so I might give him a call. The guys from Germany - ODBII-tuning that is marketed under Neuspeed is too far away for custom tuning and Kleemann, Brabus and Renntech will not tune an HPS kit.
Is there anybody out there that can recommend a good MB tuner that can do custom applications and within a 500 radius of Los Angeles??? Should I just go with Powerchip ???
What the hell is wrong with this kit? I've tried just about EVERYTHING!!
So I took my car the same day down to JBA Motorsports in San Diego for an independent dyno. Three consecutive runs showed that it made only 370rwhp (consistently) and 401 lbs torque which is only a 10 rwhp gain from the House of Power Dyno Day on April 15th although I used 5 gallons of racing fuel mixed in with 10 gallons of 91 octane back then and this time I only used 91 octane pump gas. I don't think the 5 gallons of racing fuel makes any difference.
However, I suspect that the ECU was reflashed by the Long Beach MB dealer when they loaded a service campaign recall while my car was having the all the hubs and suspension repaired from my renegade wheel accident. The car's A/F ratio was in the mid-to-high 9's at WOT which way to rich. Before my accident, my A/F ratio was beautiful at 11.5 at WOT.
I am currently looking for a tuner to custom tune my ECU after my latest upgrades since it looks like Jessie's program was wiped by the dealer. I took my car down to see Jessie at Status Design Motorsports in Hermosa Beach but he was too busy and told me to drop the car off with him NEXT TIME.
I get the feeling he is either unwilling or afraid of re-tuning my car with the HPS kit still installed. A Brabus rep referred me to a tuner from San Jose (Car Toys) named Twan who does custom tuning but he told me that the HPS kit was too difficult to tune since the max rwhp he got with an HPS kit was 395rwhp, but at the expense of numerous hours of testing and dyno and road tuning. He said it just would not make economic sense to hire him as it could easily cost me several thousand just to gain 20-25rwhp. Linh also recommended a tuner from SF named Jake so I might give him a call. The guys from Germany - ODBII-tuning that is marketed under Neuspeed is too far away for custom tuning and Kleemann, Brabus and Renntech will not tune an HPS kit.
Is there anybody out there that can recommend a good MB tuner that can do custom applications and within a 500 radius of Los Angeles??? Should I just go with Powerchip ???
What the hell is wrong with this kit? I've tried just about EVERYTHING!!
Last edited by AMGSC; 01-05-2007 at 01:52 AM.
01-05-2007, 01:42 AM
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S600TT, R350
Seriously, my friend!!!!!
After this saga,
WHO in his right mind would want to touch your car?
Now you are asking for advice, when every step of the way you were told what NOT to do.
You did it anyway, only to find out that everyone who offered you advice was right.
And now you are coming back to us asking for more help!!!
Common, just sell your car and give it a rest.
Enough allready!!!!
After this saga,
WHO in his right mind would want to touch your car?
Now you are asking for advice, when every step of the way you were told what NOT to do.
You did it anyway, only to find out that everyone who offered you advice was right.
And now you are coming back to us asking for more help!!!
Common, just sell your car and give it a rest.
Enough allready!!!!
01-05-2007, 01:59 AM
#1028
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Seriously, my friend!!!!!
After this saga,
WHO in his right mind would want to touch your car?
Now you are asking for advice, when every step of the way you were told what NOT to do.
You did it anyway, only to find out that everyone who offered you advice was right.
And now you are coming back to us asking for more help!!!
Common, just sell your car and give it a rest.
Enough allready!!!!
After this saga,
WHO in his right mind would want to touch your car?
Now you are asking for advice, when every step of the way you were told what NOT to do.
You did it anyway, only to find out that everyone who offered you advice was right.
And now you are coming back to us asking for more help!!!
Common, just sell your car and give it a rest.
Enough allready!!!!
Seriously, sell the car and start fresh. You have to know when you're beat.
01-05-2007, 02:02 AM
#1029
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
This is my last resort. If I can't find a tuner that can do this. I truly give up and will use my tax refund to go Kleemann S4 and sell the HPS kit on Ebay. At least my other upgrades are still compatible with the Kleemann kit.
Last edited by AMGSC; 01-05-2007 at 02:13 AM.
01-05-2007, 02:27 AM
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Audi C7.5 S6
Actually, considering what you started with 370RWHP is not too shabby for 91 octane.
I see three options, that you may want to consider:
1.) Unload your car & parts, then buy a 2003 or newer E55 and add a stage 4 Renntech kit.
2.) Remove all the HPS stuff and get a Kleeman supercharger system.
3.) Continue with what you have been doing for the last year, because it will feel so good, when you stop.
I see three options, that you may want to consider:
1.) Unload your car & parts, then buy a 2003 or newer E55 and add a stage 4 Renntech kit.
2.) Remove all the HPS stuff and get a Kleeman supercharger system.
3.) Continue with what you have been doing for the last year, because it will feel so good, when you stop.
01-05-2007, 06:48 AM
#1032
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Actually, considering what you started with 370RWHP is not too shabby for 91 octane.
I see three options, that you may want to consider:
1.) Unload your car & parts, then buy a 2003 or newer E55 and add a stage 4 Renntech kit.
2.) Remove all the HPS stuff and get a Kleeman supercharger system.
3.) Continue with what you have been doing for the last year, because it will feel so good, when you stop.
I see three options, that you may want to consider:
1.) Unload your car & parts, then buy a 2003 or newer E55 and add a stage 4 Renntech kit.
2.) Remove all the HPS stuff and get a Kleeman supercharger system.
3.) Continue with what you have been doing for the last year, because it will feel so good, when you stop.
AMGSC When will you learn?
This guy is right!
01-05-2007, 08:38 AM
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'09 911 C4S
I don't think he'll ever learn his lesson. I think there's Karma involved in this incident (wheels falling off) alerting him that he should be unloading the car asap. In many posts ago many months ago, many people already commented that he should unload the car and start fresh, preferably with an s/c'ed M113 engine, but he largely ignored the comments and continued to "build" his car 
01-05-2007, 09:51 AM
#1034
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Wasn't your last resort somewhere on page 11-14? And this is page 21 already? Most of the people here giving you advice is helping you, but you're clearly not getting the message so why even ask for some more advice if you're not going to listen?
01-05-2007, 03:59 PM
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05 c55
This is the first time I have clicked this thread because it has always seem to large to catch up on (1000+ posts). I just read the last two or three posts and, I could be wrong, maybe there is something that could still be squeezed out of this thread, but shouldn't a thread this long be closed? You guys must have talked about everything in the world by now.
Last edited by glomar83; 01-05-2007 at 04:02 PM.
01-05-2007, 04:59 PM
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
This is the first time I have clicked this thread because it has always seem to large to catch up on (1000+ posts). I just read the last two or three posts and, I could be wrong, maybe there is something that could still be squeezed out of this thread, but shouldn't a thread this long be closed? You guys must have talked about everything in the world by now.
The reason this thread has drawn a lot of attention and controversy is IMHO the possibility of obtaining real power at a much lower price than the leading competitors such as Kleemann, Renntech, Carlsson and Brabus. HPS is the only other company that makes an aftermarket Supercharger Kit for Mercedes. There are many benz owners with older cars that do not want to spend $15-20K on a Supercharger Kit when other makes only charge $3-5k
Last edited by AMGSC; 01-05-2007 at 05:03 PM.
01-05-2007, 06:23 PM
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2003 C-Class Sportcoupe
With HPS gen II kit, you get what you pay for. In your case, it amounted to ~70whp gain over about 300whp stock, all for at least $5000 in engine mods and months of suffering. I'd pay my money to AMG or Kleeman rather than let HPS have it. Who coined that phrase originally "you can't tune a turd?"
01-05-2007, 07:25 PM
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Why the attachment to this particular car? God knows what type of damage has been done to our engine from the various "tune-ups" and the HPS paper weight......
01-05-2007, 07:39 PM
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05 c55
This thread is days away from reaching conclusion. I found a tuner who is disecting my data logs right now. He will then come to LA to tune my car next week and the final result will be disclosed. Either it makes over 400rwhp or I go with 100% Kleemann S4 by February.
The reason this thread has drawn a lot of attention and controversy is IMHO the possibility of obtaining real power at a much lower price than the leading competitors such as Kleemann, Renntech, Carlsson and Brabus. HPS is the only other company that makes an aftermarket Supercharger Kit for Mercedes. There are many benz owners with older cars that do not want to spend $15-20K on a Supercharger Kit when other makes only charge $3-5k
The reason this thread has drawn a lot of attention and controversy is IMHO the possibility of obtaining real power at a much lower price than the leading competitors such as Kleemann, Renntech, Carlsson and Brabus. HPS is the only other company that makes an aftermarket Supercharger Kit for Mercedes. There are many benz owners with older cars that do not want to spend $15-20K on a Supercharger Kit when other makes only charge $3-5k
a) you make a significant, reliable power gain at an inexpensive price or
b) this thread comes out on audio book.
01-06-2007, 12:10 AM
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
After talking to Powerchip and reading their literature, I am convinced that my ECU was reflashed by the dealer after my accident or after my Service B two weeks ago at Penske MB. I did another dyno run with 5 gallons of MS 109 Octane that cost me $60 and also removed the sprintbooster and got the identical results. A factory ECU cannot take advantage of higher octane gas because the timing is retarded and not configured to burn higher octane gas earlier.
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
Last edited by AMGSC; 01-06-2007 at 12:21 AM.
01-06-2007, 03:17 AM
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C32 AMG
This thread is like....the greatest thread ever! Somebody should make this into a movie.....
seriously AMGSC....LOL.....I cant believe this thread went on for a year before you finally decided to say F*CK IT.....wait....did you even give up yet?
seriously AMGSC....LOL.....I cant believe this thread went on for a year before you finally decided to say F*CK IT.....wait....did you even give up yet?
01-06-2007, 03:29 AM
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C32 AMG
After getting only 320rwhp at Advanced Motorsports in Irvine a month ago. I decided to get a final one at EVOSPORT to find out what my AFR was running. Although the AFR looks decent it still lacks any power. My Flecher Jones dealer wiped out Jessie's (SpeedInnovation) chip tuning but it is still a far cry from the bogus 414rwp that HPS sent me. I still need to check the SC coolant level during my lunch hour to see if it leaked into intake manifold like the other guy recently reported on this forum.
This dyno was done with all the airboxes on and no dyno mode in order to simulate real driving conditions. The temperature was in the 90's and an SAE 5correction factor was applied. I used Costco 91 Octane gas. Bob also advised me not to Reset the ECU even though I drive in congested traffic everyday since it would put the car in neutral mode instead of aggressive.
Very dissapointing results once again. This is my last and final dyno. This absolutely proves that HPS was lying about their claims about a 150hp gain with their Gen II kits.
This dyno was done with all the airboxes on and no dyno mode in order to simulate real driving conditions. The temperature was in the 90's and an SAE 5correction factor was applied. I used Costco 91 Octane gas. Bob also advised me not to Reset the ECU even though I drive in congested traffic everyday since it would put the car in neutral mode instead of aggressive.
Very dissapointing results once again. This is my last and final dyno. This absolutely proves that HPS was lying about their claims about a 150hp gain with their Gen II kits.
Wrong dyno sheet, bad tuning, lack of tuning, bad AFR.
Anything with that much incompetence or that big a discrepency.....
F*ck that...refund
i really really hope you learn your lesson
01-06-2007, 11:21 AM
#1044
Super Member
After talking to Powerchip and reading their literature, I am convinced that my ECU was reflashed by the dealer after my accident or after my Service B two weeks ago at Penske MB. I did another dyno run with 5 gallons of MS 109 Octane that cost me $60 and also removed the sprintbooster and got the identical results. A factory ECU cannot take advantage of higher octane gas because the timing is retarded and not configured to burn higher octane gas earlier.
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
AMGSC - how many dyno runs have you had? Could I be right in saying more than 150? Although there isn't a lot of great evidence on the deleterious effects of dyno runs on motors, I honestly think that motor of yours is going to go ****-up - and unfortunately, it'll happen on the road. Sure, AMG motors are built to withstand a lot of abuse, but I think this is going beyond that.
You are probably the most persistent modder I've read about on this forum, but re: this thread, I could have the same thread written by substituting 'my ex wife' for the word 'HPS'!
Fraudulent advertisement, crappy performance, and no support or solution! Like HPS, I cut my losses and upgraded to something better!There are some awesome deals on E55's right now.
01-06-2007, 12:23 PM
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S600TT, R350
After talking to Powerchip and reading their literature, I am convinced that my ECU was reflashed by the dealer after my accident or after my Service B two weeks ago at Penske MB. I did another dyno run with 5 gallons of MS 109 Octane that cost me $60 and also removed the sprintbooster and got the identical results. A factory ECU cannot take advantage of higher octane gas because the timing is retarded and not configured to burn higher octane gas earlier.
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
It's either that or the fact that the Sprintbooster added an additional 10rwhp which is quite possible also. To be honest the Sprintbooster made the most immediate gut impact of all the mods I did so far. The accelaration is downright scary. Conclusion A: Sprintbooster = 5 gallons of 109 Octane or Conclusion B: Neither Sprintbooster nor 5 gallons had any effect on horsepower.
One thing is for sure... The sprintbooster is a MUST HAVE!!!
If the service department did any reflashing it would be stated on your paperwork. Otherwise, they would not get paid for it.
It is as simple as that.
In real world, this is called fooling one-self.
01-06-2007, 12:23 PM
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
Yep - the sprintbooster is definitely a nice mod for the car, but it's certainly not the source of any hp gains - it only brings you to peak power a little quicker - it doesn't add hp.
AMGSC - how many dyno runs have you had? Could I be right in saying more than 150? Although there isn't a lot of great evidence on the deleterious effects of dyno runs on motors, I honestly think that motor of yours is going to go ****-up - and unfortunately, it'll happen on the road. Sure, AMG motors are built to withstand a lot of abuse, but I think this is going beyond that.
You are probably the most persistent modder I've read about on this forum, but re: this thread, I could have the same thread written by substituting 'my ex wife' for the word 'HPS'! Fraudulent advertisement, crappy performance, and no support or solution! Like HPS, I cut my losses and upgraded to something better!
There are some awesome deals on E55's right now.
AMGSC - how many dyno runs have you had? Could I be right in saying more than 150? Although there isn't a lot of great evidence on the deleterious effects of dyno runs on motors, I honestly think that motor of yours is going to go ****-up - and unfortunately, it'll happen on the road. Sure, AMG motors are built to withstand a lot of abuse, but I think this is going beyond that.
You are probably the most persistent modder I've read about on this forum, but re: this thread, I could have the same thread written by substituting 'my ex wife' for the word 'HPS'!
Fraudulent advertisement, crappy performance, and no support or solution! Like HPS, I cut my losses and upgraded to something better!There are some awesome deals on E55's right now.
01-06-2007, 12:33 PM
#1048
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
It WAS on BOTH the LB MB and Penske invoice . I will dig out my invoice and post the campaign code. Maybe you can tell me what it means but the dealer swears they did not touch the ECU even though all my electrical settings were cleared. It was some service campaign code????
01-06-2007, 12:37 PM
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if it made 310 when they told me it made 417. I would never even WANT to hear an expaination.
Wrong dyno sheet, bad tuning, lack of tuning, bad AFR.
Anything with that much incompetence or that big a discrepency.....
F*ck that...refund
i really really hope you learn your lesson
Wrong dyno sheet, bad tuning, lack of tuning, bad AFR.
Anything with that much incompetence or that big a discrepency.....
F*ck that...refund
i really really hope you learn your lesson
01-06-2007, 12:51 PM
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2006 Weistec 3.0L SC'd C55, 2006 MaxPsi PT6466 Turbo'd M3, 2019 Maserati GTS , 2020Alfa Quadrifoglio
Yep - the sprintbooster is definitely a nice mod for the car, but it's certainly not the source of any hp gains - it only brings you to peak power a little quicker - it doesn't add hp.
AMGSC - how many dyno runs have you had? Could I be right in saying more than 150? Although there isn't a lot of great evidence on the deleterious effects of dyno runs on motors, I honestly think that motor of yours is going to go ****-up - and unfortunately, it'll happen on the road. Sure, AMG motors are built to withstand a lot of abuse, but I think this is going beyond that.
You are probably the most persistent modder I've read about on this forum, but re: this thread, I could have the same thread written by substituting 'my ex wife' for the word 'HPS'! Fraudulent advertisement, crappy performance, and no support or solution! Like HPS, I cut my losses and upgraded to something better!
There are some awesome deals on E55's right now.
AMGSC - how many dyno runs have you had? Could I be right in saying more than 150? Although there isn't a lot of great evidence on the deleterious effects of dyno runs on motors, I honestly think that motor of yours is going to go ****-up - and unfortunately, it'll happen on the road. Sure, AMG motors are built to withstand a lot of abuse, but I think this is going beyond that.
You are probably the most persistent modder I've read about on this forum, but re: this thread, I could have the same thread written by substituting 'my ex wife' for the word 'HPS'!
Fraudulent advertisement, crappy performance, and no support or solution! Like HPS, I cut my losses and upgraded to something better!There are some awesome deals on E55's right now.
I sometimes feel the same way about my SO.It is amazing how strong these AMG motors are. I've got 21K miles on the car now and more amazing is that the blower still produces a consistent 7 lbs of boost at WOT and the blower hasn't failed yet with my crazy driving. I floor it to 140 on the freeway every chance I get as long as my radar is on.
Last edited by AMGSC; 01-06-2007 at 04:18 PM.
