1313

I have encountered CSL before. Trust me, they are definitely faster than regular M3, C32/C55 in the straights and corners. It passed me quite effortlessly in the straight.

It has 17bhp more than std M3 and weighs 110kg or 242lbs lesser. There's no way a std M3/C32/C55 could keep up with it.

FrankW

will everyone just stop responding to this guys idiot comments!!

for the last time magazine are for references only. they post the best time they get in SEVERAL tries in the magazine. so A) it doesn't mean **** in real life for those that have drove both cars. B) many magazine have shown AMGs are easier to be consistant unlike the Ms. and C) BAN this M&M dude already. If you all been on bimmerforums or e46fanatics.com, they don't want him either, that's why he trolls on here. You'd be surpriced how fast his thread gets shutdown by the other two forum.

ProjectC55

I have to admit I'm truly amazed myself!This is amazing.Where's Dave and Hugo!

andy_cyp

Hasnt this been dragged a bit too far ??

Enough guys, geeeeeeeeeeez.


ADMIN, may i suggest you LOCK this thread !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

M&M

OK, now besides my 1st hand experience (which I don't expect ayone to believe) there seems to be lots of evidence that a stock 6MT M3 can run even or ahead if a CSL. What am I on about? Some Mikey Mouse magazines with stopwatch tests?

Hell no, we have none other than Autocar & Evo magazines using their VBox GPS testing equipment. But hey, I hear you ask? Environmental conditions on the day may different & one car faster than the other on a different day. OK, so what if I can find some shoot-outs where the cars were taken together to the testing grounds & tested on the same day, with the same driver, same fuel, technique, testing equipment etc. Also, what if 2 different mags test 2 different sets of cars & get similar results? Point is a CSL is not a straight line car. It is barely faster than a stock M3 in a straght line. And you don't have to take my word for it, 'cos I have proof:

noka

M&M: You are comparing grains of sand on the same beach. What's your point, in 25 words or less?

AgentQ

I've been following the conversation for a while, but I'm going to get back to the original point here.

Those tests show one thing...

that an M3, ANY M3, tuned, CSL, or stock is just about as fast as a C55 but you still have to put up with riding around in a rattle-trap to do it. The C55 does the sedan thing better. As I've said before, if you're trying to get a sports car, don't get an M3. If you're trying to get a luxury sports sedan, don't get an M3. And, one final point, if you want a car that's very similar to an M3, but does the job more purely, get an Evo MR.

Trekman

M&M what is your point? We all know how to read a magazine, do you want us to read it for you? man you must have no life. those number dont mean sqat it all base readings . there is now way you can get the same numbers every time. you have to have a robot or a computer driving your car to get the same results. Just give it up! I told you before your comparing 2 different cars. your such a looser!

M&M

What the hell is wrong with you guys? I'm comparing 2 BMW's: an M3 & an M3 CSL. You beloved Merc is not even in this argument. And m point is that Improviz reads magazines while I'm doing it on the track. Someone who reads magazines will not see that its possible for an M3 to run with a CSL from a stop. But it does happen.

And that corroborates my other other point that is CSL's do mid to high 16's to 124mph, M3's can (AND HAVE) done 16's.

AgentQ

That's funny, I don't see 0-200 in any of those tests, but from the 0-60 and 0-100 #'s, I see that the CSL is .3s faster from 60-100, and the difference probably extends from there.

Trekman

How are you doing that troll? driving and timing yourself very unsafe. for what to prove us wrong! now I know why you get those numbers, YOU FAB IT!

Plus I dont know what else you do in the track!

M&M

AgentQ, you have some good points there. I would counter that by saying the Autocar test has a 1km sprint where the stock M3 did 139mph & the CSL did 140mph. The time difference to 140 was 0.6 seconds.

And I see your point that the CSL is .3 faster from 60-100. That is, in fact, a valid point. But surely you see that the reason the times are close it that the manual leaves the line better & the CSL is having to play catch up. If the CSL were manual, it would be a lot quicker on the standin start & 0-200 tests.

Trekman

[QUOTE=M&M]What the hell is wrong with you guys? I'm comparing 2 BMW's: an M3 & an M3 CSL. QUOTE]

I think you might what to go to an BMW M3 forum. This is a mercedes benz Forum. ohh I for got you Trolling.

1313

Well I believe what I see. The CSL that passed me was a one week car and totally factory standard. My friend happens to know the owner.

A BMW driving trainer once told me the SMG is only fractionally slower than a Manual in Nurburgring 7:00+ 20km track when I attended a BMW driving course. He also went on to say the SMG will be faster than the manual under the hands of amateurs.

The SMG with the aid of acceleration assist is also more consistent in launching off the line than a manual. BTW, I also have a manual Euro M coupe. If you dragged both of them side by side 10 times, the SMG will probably beat the manual 7 times. The manual will only be faster if you achieved a perfect slipping of clutch. Btw, a manual M3 will never shifts as fast as a SMGII even under the hands of pros. SMGII S6 shifts in 0.08s. No human in the world can shift a manual faster than this.

Do you know how journalists test cars? I happen to know a local car mag journalist. They will probably do ten runs and post the closest results.

In my opinion, the CSL in that magazine was probably a new car because CSL was newly launched then and that std M3 is most likely to be a well ran in one. So it's not a good representation. I still maintain "don't take magazine results too seriously"

1313

Frank,

I'll start the ball rolling. That will be my last post to him in this thread.

Improviz

Our moderators would seem to prefer kowtowing to trolls here to hawk other brands than to Mercedes owners. Once we start leaving, perhaps the sponsors will take a second look at who it is their advertising is trying to reach.

The freedom that these guys give trolls like M&M on our forums is apalling. If I had a vote in the matter, I'd vote these guys the hell out of here and get some people in here who are serious about keeping the trolls out. These guys are NOT here to discuss, they are here to INCITE. I provided them with ironclad evidence that M&M has done this stuff for OVER THREE YEARS in MULTIPLE FORUMS, chiefly any and all competitors to the M3, and that even the other forums shut him down.

As you note, the BMW forums shut him down.

And yet here, the moderators, who are FULLY AWARE OF WHAT HE'S DOING, let him, and multiple others who do NOTHING but post idiotic 16-year-old level rants, have the run of the place.

Pathetic. I've about gotten my fill of this forum...it's a godddamn waste of my time, and our time, to allow this **** to continue, but these guys seem to be amused by it. How they feel that continually allowing these people to come in here and incite in any way, shape, or form makes this a more enjoyable place is beyond me.

M&M

Well Improviz, if you hadn't argued with me about something I have 1st hand experience with, we could have saved a lot of time.

1313, a CSL is faster no doubt. What I'm saying is in a straight line, the difference isn't huge.

And as for the ban, what for? I thought we were having a discussion here. Where have I said anything derogatory about MB?

Trekman

I agree with you Improviz! there is nothing that pisses me off that a troll like M&M would be telling a C32/C55 owner that they made a mistake on the car that they bought because we didnt read his magazine. I say boot the Troll.

M&M

Trekman, please post a link to where I said the M3 is a better car than a C32/C55.

Improviz

Aren't you the guy who's constantly in here throwing magazine articles up in our face when we say that *WE'VE* beaten M3s?

In fact, haven't you done this IN THIS THREAD? Like, A PAGE OR TWO AGO??

Oh, yes, let's see:
once:

twice:

three times:

four:

five:

six:

seven:

eight:

nine:

ten:

eleven:

I went back three pages into the thread, and found eleven examples of you doing what you now tell us what we shouldn't be doing.

And I could just have easily found eleven more, in this thread alone.

You have produced a grand total of 382 posts on these forums, wherein you have done exactly the same thing.

And now you chastise others for doing it.

Lol...you funny!!

Correction: HAVE means plural. ONE M3 has. The rest were squarely in the 18's, with ONE OTHER EXCEPTION, that being the high 17's.

Modified Digitech M3: 18.5 seconds 0-200

Another modified Digitech M3: 18.7 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.1 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 17.9 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.6 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.1 seconds 0-200:

To sit here and argue as though 16's are the norm, or even likely, when six out of seven were tested at 17.9 or above, is about as credible as claiming that since Carl Lewis ran a sub ten-second 100m dash, anyone could do it. Rubbish, as usual.

Improviz

Probably because you're under a directive from your paymasters....I'm sure that you troll any and all forums of any and all competitors to BMW and shovel your lies and drivel because you think the competitors' cars are equal or better.

Trekman

look at all the things you have posted! the numbers that you have shown us! the many times that we have told you that we dont care about your test! you just ignore it. and if you didnt say IT! "m3 is better than a C32/C55" from what you saying, WHY are you here Posting? Duhh thats why you are a troll!

M&M

Impro, I didn't say 16's are the norm. I said mid 17's would be the norm.

Trekman

M&M just got owned By Improviz..... I was about to do that but Improviz did it for me. LOL!

Improviz

You can say a lot of things, but the evidence doesn't back you up on 17's being the norm either. Five out of eight in the 18's, including two modified cars, one in the 21's(!) one at 17.9, and one in the 16's--so which one is the "norm"? Why, the lone one, of course!!

Definition of "norm":

Something normal; the standard: scored close to the normal.
The usual or expected state, form, amount, or degree.

Correspondence to a norm.
An average.

Average of the eight = 18.5 seconds.



Modified Digitech M3: 18.5 seconds 0-200

Another modified Digitech M3: 18.7 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.1 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 17.9 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.6 seconds 0-200:

E46 M3: 18.1 seconds 0-200:

AC Schnitzer modified M3: 21.5 seconds 0-200!!



Owned again.