C450 is getting changed to C43
01-20-2016, 07:39 AM
#26
Junior Member
I have a friend with a lowly C class coupe but with Amg trim - and he constantly claims to have an 'AMG' !!! So the brand is already diluted by having the Amg trim level - this doesnt seem too much more really.
02-23-2016, 07:58 PM
#29
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Cee Fiddy Five
I get it...the number of increased sales from the 43 'AMG's will far eclipse the minority of enthusiasts they lose. Money talks.
Just when I finally thought AMG was going the right direction with more exclusive options and unique characteristics for its cars, starting with the w204 C63, they go and do this. Already hate the placement of the shifter in the new C63. Mercedes-AMG has lost a long time fan and supporter.
Just when I finally thought AMG was going the right direction with more exclusive options and unique characteristics for its cars, starting with the w204 C63, they go and do this. Already hate the placement of the shifter in the new C63. Mercedes-AMG has lost a long time fan and supporter.
02-23-2016, 09:37 PM
#30
MBWorld Fanatic!
I actually like this move. A lot.
Instead of having some "faux" AMG similar to BMW's M Sport line, we now have another true AMG option. AMG has worked on every material/important component of this car: brakes, drivetrain, suspension, steering, etc.
Reading the specs, I see nothing that makes the new C43 any less of a car, performance-wise, than the something like the A45/CLA45.
If the C43 is going to perform well, beat down its rivals, and draw new buyers into the AMG brand, buyers that eventually will work their way up to cars like the W205 or W212, then I am 100% all for it.
I haven't been on the board in a long time, but when I saw the announcement today, I thought that most people would be thrilled with the decision to give the car a proper AMG treatment, rather than tweaking a few things and putting an "AMG Sport" badge on it.
Regardless, as much as I love this forum, I have been enjoying my car, and the AMG brand, much more than I ever have before while away from all the automotive message boards.
Just my two cents.
Instead of having some "faux" AMG similar to BMW's M Sport line, we now have another true AMG option. AMG has worked on every material/important component of this car: brakes, drivetrain, suspension, steering, etc.
Reading the specs, I see nothing that makes the new C43 any less of a car, performance-wise, than the something like the A45/CLA45.
If the C43 is going to perform well, beat down its rivals, and draw new buyers into the AMG brand, buyers that eventually will work their way up to cars like the W205 or W212, then I am 100% all for it.
I haven't been on the board in a long time, but when I saw the announcement today, I thought that most people would be thrilled with the decision to give the car a proper AMG treatment, rather than tweaking a few things and putting an "AMG Sport" badge on it.
Regardless, as much as I love this forum, I have been enjoying my car, and the AMG brand, much more than I ever have before while away from all the automotive message boards.
Just my two cents.
02-23-2016, 10:25 PM
#31
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I actually like this move. A lot.
Instead of having some "faux" AMG similar to BMW's M Sport line, we now have another true AMG option. AMG has worked on every material/important component of this car: brakes, drivetrain, suspension, steering, etc.
Reading the specs, I see nothing that makes the new C43 any less of a car, performance-wise, than the something like the A45/CLA45.
If the C43 is going to perform well, beat down its rivals, and draw new buyers into the AMG brand, buyers that eventually will work their way up to cars like the W205 or W212, then I am 100% all for it.
I haven't been on the board in a long time, but when I saw the announcement today, I thought that most people would be thrilled with the decision to give the car a proper AMG treatment, rather than tweaking a few things and putting an "AMG Sport" badge on it.
Regardless, as much as I love this forum, I have been enjoying my car, and the AMG brand, much more than I ever have before while away from all the automotive message boards.
Just my two cents.
Instead of having some "faux" AMG similar to BMW's M Sport line, we now have another true AMG option. AMG has worked on every material/important component of this car: brakes, drivetrain, suspension, steering, etc.
Reading the specs, I see nothing that makes the new C43 any less of a car, performance-wise, than the something like the A45/CLA45.
If the C43 is going to perform well, beat down its rivals, and draw new buyers into the AMG brand, buyers that eventually will work their way up to cars like the W205 or W212, then I am 100% all for it.
I haven't been on the board in a long time, but when I saw the announcement today, I thought that most people would be thrilled with the decision to give the car a proper AMG treatment, rather than tweaking a few things and putting an "AMG Sport" badge on it.
Regardless, as much as I love this forum, I have been enjoying my car, and the AMG brand, much more than I ever have before while away from all the automotive message boards.
Just my two cents.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
Last edited by ab0bab0i; 02-23-2016 at 10:32 PM.
02-24-2016, 12:59 AM
#32
Super Member
Now I guess I'm looking at a C43 sedan for the wife and a C63 S Coupe for me. 
http://www.autoblog.com/2016/02/23/2...oupe-official/
Whether you call it an AMG or not, C43 seems to be a great car with the AWD it surely can take over the sedan duties from my S4.
http://www.autoblog.com/2016/02/23/2...oupe-official/
Whether you call it an AMG or not, C43 seems to be a great car with the AWD it surely can take over the sedan duties from my S4.
Last edited by OC6.3AMG; 02-24-2016 at 01:02 AM.
02-24-2016, 01:31 AM
#33
MBWorld Fanatic!
A45/CLA45 makes more power on a 2L 4 Cylinder than this 3L V6. They should've put the 45 engines in this car.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
I didn't buy an AMG just because the motor was assembled by one technician. I wanted a car with better steering, bigger/more powerful brakes, and a proper suspension (among other things).
Although the C43 doesn't tick the hand-assembled motor box, AMG has its fingerprint all over this car now, which sits a heck of a lot better with me than a car with just a tune and some cheesy badges on the fender.
Is the "one man, one engine" philosophy a cool conversation piece with enthusiasts? Sure.
For those that hinge their purchase on the "one man, one engine" marketing pitch, there are plenty of AMGs that fill the bill.
Just my opinion, and no one is changing it.
02-24-2016, 01:50 AM
#34
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Before the CLA45/A45 came out, there were people saying, "WTF? An AMG car with a turbocharged 4-cylinder?"
I didn't buy an AMG just because the motor was assembled by one technician. I wanted a car with better steering, bigger/more powerful brakes, and a proper suspension (among other things).
Although the C43 doesn't tick the hand-assembled motor box, AMG has its fingerprint all over this car now, which sits a heck of a lot better with me than a car with just a tune and some cheesy badges on the fender.
Is the "one man, one engine" philosophy a cool conversation piece with enthusiasts? Sure.
For those that hinge their purchase on the "one man, one engine" marketing pitch, there are plenty of AMGs that fill the bill.
Just my opinion, and no one is changing it.
I didn't buy an AMG just because the motor was assembled by one technician. I wanted a car with better steering, bigger/more powerful brakes, and a proper suspension (among other things).
Although the C43 doesn't tick the hand-assembled motor box, AMG has its fingerprint all over this car now, which sits a heck of a lot better with me than a car with just a tune and some cheesy badges on the fender.
Is the "one man, one engine" philosophy a cool conversation piece with enthusiasts? Sure.
For those that hinge their purchase on the "one man, one engine" marketing pitch, there are plenty of AMGs that fill the bill.
Just my opinion, and no one is changing it.
From the company’s beginning more than 40 years ago, every AMG engine is assembled carefully and precisely in Affalterbach by a single AMG master engine builder. Everything from the first piston to the last bolt is the work of one AMG technician and . all work stages are subject to the stringent Mercedes-Benz quality criteria. In the final stage the Master Mechanic personally installs an engraved placard bearing his signature—one man’s personal assurance of quality and the mark of the company’s uncompromising commitment to precision and performance. The One Man, One Engine philosophy is one of the key reasons why Mercedes-AMG continues to raise the bar in the luxury/ performance vehicle market.
Last edited by ab0bab0i; 02-24-2016 at 01:52 AM. Reason: added quote
02-24-2016, 02:15 AM
#35
Super Member
Before the CLA45/A45 came out, there were people saying, "WTF? An AMG car with a turbocharged 4-cylinder?"
I didn't buy an AMG just because the motor was assembled by one technician. I wanted a car with better steering, bigger/more powerful brakes, and a proper suspension (among other things).
Although the C43 doesn't tick the hand-assembled motor box, AMG has its fingerprint all over this car now, which sits a heck of a lot better with me than a car with just a tune and some cheesy badges on the fender.
Is the "one man, one engine" philosophy a cool conversation piece with enthusiasts? Sure.
For those that hinge their purchase on the "one man, one engine" marketing pitch, there are plenty of AMGs that fill the bill.
Just my opinion, and no one is changing it.
I didn't buy an AMG just because the motor was assembled by one technician. I wanted a car with better steering, bigger/more powerful brakes, and a proper suspension (among other things).
Although the C43 doesn't tick the hand-assembled motor box, AMG has its fingerprint all over this car now, which sits a heck of a lot better with me than a car with just a tune and some cheesy badges on the fender.
Is the "one man, one engine" philosophy a cool conversation piece with enthusiasts? Sure.
For those that hinge their purchase on the "one man, one engine" marketing pitch, there are plenty of AMGs that fill the bill.
Just my opinion, and no one is changing it.
Very well said. I personally don't give a S*** about the "one man, one engine" and always liked AMGs for the way they drive and sound.
Who really cares if an engine is assembled by one person, several people or robots as long as it's a reliable performer?
AMG's BS marketing has surely gotten alotta people fooled from a 4banger CLA45 driver all the way up to the Pagani drivers.
02-24-2016, 02:47 AM
#36
MBWorld Fanatic!
A45/CLA45 makes more power on a 2L 4 Cylinder than this 3L V6. They should've put the 45 engines in this car.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
I drove the CLA45 and that engine is terrible, so much turbo lag. Would much rather have the 3.0v6 "non handmade" than that hand made marketing crap.
02-24-2016, 04:49 AM
#37
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Mercedes C200 CGI, CLS350, CLA45 AMG, AMG GTS(ordered)
BRAND DILUTION! I feel really sorry for myself and for you fellows, with all these C43's coming on the way holding up the AMG badge! not only the C450 looks VERY similar to the C63, which already pissed me off, but it will also carry around an AMG badge, which just KILLS our C63s !!!
Failed strategy. failed moved.
Failed strategy. failed moved.
02-24-2016, 08:03 AM
#39
Your regular Joe won't be able to see the difference but the true enthusiast will.
Not a fan of the AMG sport line. It takes away from the exclusivity of the brand imho.
Not a fan of the AMG sport line. It takes away from the exclusivity of the brand imho.
02-24-2016, 11:00 AM
#40
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2015 C63S E1; 2016 C450 AMG
A45/CLA45 makes more power on a 2L 4 Cylinder than this 3L V6. They should've put the 45 engines in this car.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
Why would people be thrilled that it doesn't follow AMG's philosophy of one man one engine? It has the same engine as a C400. Engine isn't built at Affalterbach, it just has a tune.
Can you say turbo lag and understeer?
Have you compared the CLA45 interior to the C450/43?
As between these two cars, I'd say the C is much more AMG than the CLA.
02-24-2016, 11:18 AM
#41
Junior Member
I only care about the one man one engine principle if it makes it a better engine ! If so then great - if not, who cares ? Its a nice touch to us enthusiasts but doesnt make me buy or not buy.
I am happier having a C43 which atleast is a real AMG car - to me that means a car with some sort of performance rather than a little uprated trim and a badge !
I am happier having a C43 which atleast is a real AMG car - to me that means a car with some sort of performance rather than a little uprated trim and a badge !
02-24-2016, 08:38 PM
#42
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02-24-2016, 09:18 PM
#43
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2015 C63S E1; 2016 C450 AMG
Just wondering, have you actually driven a C450, or are you just talking s**t?
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
02-24-2016, 09:35 PM
#44
Member
I am not sure AMG is what it used to be anymore. Maybe i am just being delusional.
Last edited by Zand3rs; 02-24-2016 at 09:37 PM.
02-24-2016, 09:37 PM
#45
MBWorld Fanatic!
This ^^^
Although I do agree that the new C43 is a top performer, IMHO I personally also don't like the dilution and exclusivity take away it has caused with the top tier AMG models, we'll just have to live with it as it's now all done.
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
Driven all of them myself, agree with regards the CLA-45 in certain respects, however in terms of handling the A45 and GLA-45 variants are on point
02-24-2016, 10:40 PM
#46
Biggest and most significant difference:
C43 is narrow body. C63 is wide body.
The visual difference is huge. C63 looks perfect. Regular narrow body C coupe looks like it had its arms tied to the body and squeezed into a clamp. Looks weird to me, like something is missing.
No widebody, no care.
C43 is narrow body. C63 is wide body.
The visual difference is huge. C63 looks perfect. Regular narrow body C coupe looks like it had its arms tied to the body and squeezed into a clamp. Looks weird to me, like something is missing.
No widebody, no care.
02-24-2016, 10:43 PM
#47
Super Member
Just wondering, have you actually driven a C450, or are you just talking s**t?
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
Also I'm sorry, but Mercedes is all about the interior and comfort etc. Not AMG. AMG is all about driving performance, and making badass insane vehicles.
So since I haven't driven one yet, and so this isn't opinion based etc (other than the sound area) , I'll provide facts that show it's definitely not more of an AMG car than the CLA 45 since AMG is about driving performance.
Engine-2.0L CLA 45 AMG: I4 fully designed, and hand built by AMG with stronger internals since AMG engines have stronger internals vs C450: a 3.0L biturbo V6 which was taken from a C400 and just tuned.
Winner- CLA 45 AMG.
Horsepower and torque- CLA 45 AMG: 375 Hp, and 350 Tq vs C450:362 HP and 384
Winner- C450 just because it has a bit more torque.
0-60 (Manufacturer times)- CLA 45 AMG: 4.1 (Quite impressive considering the turbo lag) vs C450: 4.8
Winner- CLA 45 AMG
Quarter Mile- CLA 45 AMG: 12.6 vs C450: 13.0-13.2
Winner- CLA 45 AMG.
Transmission- CLA 45 AMG: AMG SPEEDSHIFT DCT 7-Speed Sports Transmission (Yes I know it sucks in comfort mode, but it's extremely good in manual, plus were talking about performance not driving around like grannies.) vs C450: 7G-TRONIC PLUS If you want to include the C43 then :9G
Winner- CLA 45 AMG.
Brakes- CLA 45 AMG: 13.8-inch front and 13.0-inch rear discs vs C450: 14.2-inch front rotors 12.6 inches rear.
Winner-Tie.
Weight- CLA 45 AMG: 3,450 lbs vs C:450 3,748 lbs
Winner- CLA 45 AMG
Stopping distance 60mph-0- CLA 45 AMG: 111 vs C450: 111.8766
Winner-CLA 45 AMG.
AWD- CLA 45 AMG: Can be 50:50 vs C450: 33:67
Winner- C450
Steering- CLA 45 AMG :Constant-ratio electromechanical power steering vs C450: Electromechanical power steering
Winner- No idea honestly.
Sound (My opinion)-
Winner- CLA 45 AMG just because of how much it crackles, and pops.
ESP- CLA 45 AMG: 3 stage vs C450: Multistage
Winner- CLA 45 AMG
Suspension- CLA 45 AMG: 4-wheel independent suspension vs C450: 4-wheel multilink suspension
Winner- Tie.
LSD- CLA 45 AMG: AMG limited-slip front differential vs C450: No LSD.
Winner- CLA 45 AMG
Track results- Couldn't find any track times for the C450, but based off the weight, braking, acceleration, transmission, and top speed facts, I'm guessing that the CLA 45 AMG would be faster at most if not all tracks. Although this highly depends on the drivers skill as well of course.
Overall winner- CLA 45 AMG.
So ya. The CLA 45 AMG is definitely more of an AMG than the C450 which isn't surprising since it was fully designed by AMG. The CLA 45 AMG even broke records, and is one of the most powerful production cars with a 2.0L I4 if not the most powerful. The C450 on the other hand is a C400 with a tuned engine, some upgraded parts, and a few bits from a C63. Therefore it is good competition towards the BMW 335/340, and the Audi S4, but it definitely isn't more AMG than the CLA 45.
Last edited by kuba.95; 02-24-2016 at 10:54 PM.
02-24-2016, 10:45 PM
#48
Super Member
Just wondering, have you actually driven a C450, or are you just talking s**t?
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
The interior is VW Passat grade, and the turbo lag is very noticeable. I haven't driven the C450/C43 yet, but I can say for the price it seems to be the no brainer with its full-time 4matic, W205 interior and all the AMG bits and pieces. I'm sure the CLA45 is faster in quarter mile, but you get so much more in the C43 and I'm glad they didn't use the fourbanger in the C43.
AMG should only make the handbuilt V12 and charge the premium it demands, because people are paying the premium on the C63 / GT S hand assembled 4.0 V8 engines and the G550 has the basic same engine only it's not hand assembled by one person, has some different components and tune.
My point? AMG hand assembled engines are overly hyped/marketed and let's be honest here, it really means nothing.
I would happily pay for a high performance car as long as it drives and sounds the way I like it to and that's why I don't drive an M4.
Hopefully they crack the 400 hp/400 trq on the C43 by the time I'm ready to get my wife one.
02-24-2016, 11:37 PM
#50
Super Member
Just wondering, have you actually driven a C450, or are you just talking s**t?
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
I own a C63s. I just bought my wife a C450 and I did a bunch of auto-x runs in a CLA at the AMG Driving Academy. I am quite familiar with how each car drives. I stand by my statement. The C450 is much more of an AMG than the CLA.
Today, AMG is about a high quality interior with power and handling. The CLA totally fails on the interior part and with all that understeer and mushy brakes, it is a bit weak on the handling part as well.
I also drove all the cars at the Academy, and if your'e not good at driving an all wheel drive car, you will understeer more than necessary, especially if you're used to rear wheel only. Also, the brakes got mushy because the class was hammering them 8 hours a day, several days in a row (and they still were pretty darn good). Having driven both, the A series AMG's are much more AMG than the C450 is IMO. The C450 reminds me of my old C55, just a tuned C-class. I've had 4 C series AMG's, and a GLA45. I prefer the C63's and 100% rear wheel drive. Once I've gotten used to the all-wheel drive mechanics and transmission in the GLA, I can drive it as quickly as I ever could my C63. My favorite AMG is the GT S. My next favorite is the W204 C63. I don't really like the styling of the W205, but I've read it drives really well!
