FormulaZR

N/A Mustang owners tried this excuse with the F-body, and the F-body tried it with the 03/04 Cobra...so, you're argument is old and tired.

I was looking at your earlier statement about 620rwhp out of a C63. Here's some facts for you, that will never happen without FI or N2O...ever. My N/A 6.3 in my Firebird isn't even close to 620 rwhp and it's built far beyond any N/A AMG engine could ever imagine. FI will put you WAY over the cost of the CTS-V plus all the upgrades you could throw at it. Your C63 has way too much compression to take advantage of FI the way the CTS-V can.

BTW, I can only find 1 "stock" C63 within .2 of the CTS-V...and there's actually no info provided on the car. The rest are AT LEAST .5 behind it...

http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21

Looks wise...that's just how you see it. In my experience, not too many people who aren't "in the know" about MB don't know the C63 isn't just another small MB with big exhaust. Just because YOU see such a big difference doesn't mean others do...I for one don't see the HUGE difference you claim between the C63 and the rest of the C's.

Also...you're still trying to compare your damn 1st gen CTS-V to the 2nd gen. Totally different cars. Sorry you didn't like your CTS-V with the crappy diff; but the 2nd gen is nothing like it.

rockykhan

well this american family sedan makes enough power to whip a stock mb c63 ..e55.....like some 1 said 100+hp diff from the c63...its just too much ...so yes u need some mods...caddy has 550+hp.

Veho

Sure the CTSV wins the race stock vs stock. Whooopsi-fing-doo... I would never buy one over a C63. As propain wrote, do the ECU tune for just 1500$ and the CTSV wont be faster anymore.

They are both great cars tho and owners of both cars should be happy to have one!! It´s wrong to say that the CTSV suxx cos it still is a nice car! It is prob my favorite us-built car in this category. I personally just wouldn´t buy it over an AMG (C63). That being said I´m looking forward to see what GM will come up with in the near future cos they will be making big changes in how they build cars.

soldier2304

CTS-V... Test drove one and sure it is a very fast american car indeed with some very impressive handling for it's weight and it does OWN a C63 AMG. I can think of so many cars that are much faster than the C63. Does it matter? I felt NOTHING special apart from being a very fast american car (same feeling with my friend's Z06). Now everytime i switch on the engine of my AMG it still puts a smile on my face and it's been more than a year with it now. I could care less if an american made car pulls buses on me.

German engineering > American engineering any day and that's not gonna change with a 550+ supercharged CTS-V.

To each their own

rockykhan

+1

MB_Owner

I know...that's what's sad...that M-B didn't stay in the HP race. The C63 has to be modded and the warranty voided to make it competitive with an American-built stock sedan of roughly the same cubes; granted, a more expensive car which is supercharged. Still, I'd be a little torqued if I were an Affalterbach engineer knowing that my engine has a lot more capability for less than the MSRP price differential.

BTW, why is there such a HP difference between the 2010 C63 and the E63? Is the C63 artificially restricted? I'm sure there's more space to work with in the E63 but I wouldn't think that a more restrictive intake and exhaust system would account for a 67 HP difference.

shchow

To be quite honest, the C63 vs CTS-V comparison is not quite fair.
I think the C63 is the best overall car in its class.

IMHO, the CTS-V compares better with the E63/M5 class of cars.

hhughes1

BTW, I can only find 1 "stock" C63 within .2 of the CTS-V...and there's actually no info provided on the car. The rest are AT LEAST .5 behind it...

http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21

Where are all the monster CTSV's? All those cars out there and 11.8 is top of the heap?

Quadcammer

Ah, so when you run out of responses (as bad as they may be), you resort to the old, "if you like GMs go post elsewhere). Its called not being blinded by brand loyalty. I've never owned a GM car.

Absolutely so with the C63. They both look pretty similar to their more mundane counterparts.

Ok, so you get more attention from an MB than a Caddy. So what does that have to do with a ferrari driver getting "all the ***" compared to a ricer that beat it in a race? Anybody who attempts to use a C63, a CTSV, or any car to get women is pathetic.

Two things on the interior. 1. stop using your 04 CTSV as the example. Its a different car all together. 2. The CTSV interior is trimmed in leather. The c63 has a dash with plastic hard enough to crush rocks on.

So the reason GM went under was because of its unions. Previously you stated GM went "belly up" because they didn't have a good track record. Might want to make up your mind, or are you backpedaling?

Finally, I believe the C63 was only cheaper because of a huge discount. Wonder why there was such a big discount on it?

Prove that a C63 is a better product than a CTSV without hiding behind an emblem.

uh, not really. A standard C6 corvette basically runs the same times for $4X,XXX. 2010 GT500 is basically the same, with the same price.

Not to mention both are easily and cheaply modified.

taylorcoleman

It's interesting (and entertaining) to read threads about the C63 vs. the CTS-V. As has been said so many times before, being supercharged versus NA notwithstanding, they are in different size classes. I find a rare flare up around C63 vs. M3, ISF, etc. -- but they are there. Even so, the debate never seems as heated as btw the C63 and CTS-V.

On the other hand, the CTS-V is in the same price range as the C63, which I suppose is how these cars are being compared in the same class.

Keep up the good work on this thread, however. Although we've been down this road b4, it somehow happens to maintain its entertainment value -- for me at least.

Quadcammer

Seems that GM made a bigger more luxurious car lap the nurinburgring faster.

So you have any support for your statement that german engineering is better, or should we just take your word for it?

2tonOfun

And me as well.

propain

Wow.. you really are a GM ***** arent ya??

GM bankrupt. MB doing fine.

Good for GM for making a nice car. Its about time. To bad Caddy destroyed its name a long time ago (1982 Cadillac Cimarron) and is now starting to recover. Not for its luxury, but for its performance. Good for them. Sadly, they are very late to the game.

If you were talking to me about classic GM cars or Vettes you wouldn’t hear a peep from me. Even though the quality still isnt as good as MB.

You’re a troll bro and im really tired of your lame banter. Go buy either car and at least I would look at you as something other than a drooling onlooker with envy in his veins. That seems to be a trend in this thread though. Most of the flamers don’t own either car.


http://www.time.com/time/specials/20...658526,00.html

That is what happened when Caddy decided to be like MB. They are finally recovering 27 years later.

C63 DTM AMG

ahahaha i love this quote and this thread cracks me up!

having driven both, i feel that they are in different leagues...if MB was to strap a supercharger on the C63 and wider tires (just like the cts-v has) i feel that it would also get a sub 8 min. time on the ring.

and is there anyone in the NY or westchester area with a cts-v that would want to do friendly comparisons against a C63 just for fun?

i love coming back from a long day of school and reading this...really puts a smile on my face to see grown men who don't even have the cars being talked about try to argue which one is better!

Quadcammer

No, I'm an unbiased automotive enthusiast. I will tell it like it is. If MB nuthuggers are making stupid comments about GM cars, I'll tell them they're wrong, and vice versa.

MB's sales have fallen off about 40%, but thats doing fine? GM's and MB's financial situation has nothing to do with specialized high-performance vehicles such as the C63 or CTSV. Its about cars like the malibu or the E350, respectively.

I'm not talking about classic mb or GM cars? where did that come from?

Drooling onlooker? Envy in my veins? I have no interest in purchasing either car. If I want a car with performance, I'll buy a real sports car, not a compromised sports sedan. If I wanted a C63 or a CTSV, I'd go buy one.

Notice the only one flaming is you. The rest of us (well most of us) are simply posing tough questions, refuting your ridiculous claims, and making fact based statements.

Quadcammer

so now the 17 year old who just got to college wants some? Maybe your on call MB technician can put a saturn V rocket engine in your C63, or R8, or whatever the car of he day is

If my aunt had a *****, she'd be my uncle. Fact is, MB didn't "strap a supercharger or wider tires on the C63". They had the ability to do so, and didn't. Thems the breaks.

soldier2304

C63 DTM AMG

ahahah bring it buddy! 18 to be correct! and unfortunatley NASA lost the plans for the Saturn V so the project for putting that on my big wheeler has to be put on hold...

and do i want some? no...i want the whole thing!!! did i ever say anything beside laugh at how you talk about getting women in a car when were comparing a cts-v to a c63?

and MB didn't do that for obvious reasons...hence the fact THAT I STATED HOW THEY WERE IN DIFFERENT LEAGUES! for a college freshman to bring common sense back to a grown man really makes an impression...

drive safe!

thwalkerjr

Although there is no proof required to prove a well-known fact - go read the stories from real people that actually have the car. Take a trip over to the CTS-V Forum and peruse their threads. You will notice issues around rear end-groans, isolator/shaft wear issues, bolts half screwed in at the factory, warning lights at the track, and customers pissed at the quality of support from the dealership, etc. I stopped looking after page 3 of 15 on only one forum.

Considering the fact you have never owned and, therefore, experienced the joys of GM ownership... shut up.

Our own EricPD (former AMG owner) who bought the CTS-V may be able to also provide real world experience on the engineering (which I equate to quality). He has already had issues with this more luxurious, american engineering thing that you speak of. He has not been around for awhile. I suspect he is regretting the decision at this point.

Love your point-counter-point approach on our forum but you have no credibility. Probably someone from the high school debate team. Keep up with the snappy come backs - it makes for good forum banter!

P.S. I happen to be speaking from experience having actually owned American and German - the difference in engineering is not hard to notice. Oh yeah, but you wouldn't know would you?

propain

Without even looking to hard I see you make a habit out of troll the AMG forums and bashing them and starting ****. When things get tough next you will start postulating about how you have a 700WHP rustang...

https://mbworld.org/forums/c32-amg-c...t-project.html


Im done with your troll ***. Take a look up at the forum name. Of course im bias. Im also going sticking with my MANY years of GM owned car experience. Every one of them has been nothing more than bang for the buck cheap quality. Maybe my benz will turn out to be the same, but a quick visit to the GM forums says otherwise. I dont see anywhere near the same complaints on MB forums as I have in my many years on GM forums.

When I owned the CTSV there was nothing but daily flames about rears being blown and all sorts of complaints. If you like I can direct you to my posts on the subject on my GM owned cars. Ive OWNED the CTSV. Maybe not the current gen but I have the right to more of an opinion on the subject than you about their quality.

Just an FYI I also own a 08 Buick Enclave. Nice crossover and decent quality. In the first 3K I had 3 leaks in the front and back sun roofs. Then the switch on the drivers side windows broke. Then the seat belt harness that control the height broke. I had the tranny flashed because to save gas milage they had it shifting SO early that it dogged big time in every gear. They also had a recall on the heated washer fluid and no longer put it in the 09 because of it. GM QUALITY!

Have fun with your rustang and feel free to have the last word.

B.E.R.U.A.N.G

Damn....3 pages long in one day...

Why people love arguing and defending their comment in the internet?...

I love my car, but I am not a MB-Freak or BMW-Freak that will go crazy if someone didnt agree or didnt like what I like...

Sure CTS-V nice, but C63 is not bad either...everyone got their own preference...why bother trying to "convert" someone who didnt agree with you to love your choice ??

If I got extra $$$ I might ditch the C63 and buy R-35 (or buy an extra car is better )why? Because I love cars...and life is too short to drive one car

Just my $0.02 Good day my beloved MBWorld friends

Quadcammer

So you're basing your "factual evidence" from an internet forum? Its pretty common knowledge that people are much more likely to complain on a forum. Furthermore, the C63 hasn't been problem free either.

So because Eric hasn't been around, you've come to the decision that he's regretting his decision? Any basis for that?

High school was quite a few years ago, but I was on the debate team.

Hmm, I currently own a ford, and I've owned 5 german cars. Doesn't that mean I have some experience?

propain

Who would have thought we would have to convert anyone on a MB forum?

I agree about multiple cars. Thats why I keep almost everyone ive owned. If I feel like being rice I take out my STI ect... I tell you what though... Aside from my track cars... All I wanna drive these days is the C63.

thwalkerjr

And for the record Oliverk (not that you care) I find your posts to be objective and to the point. And while some people may take offense, you call it like you see it.

But every now and then I think you step outside your own knowledge and allow your opinions to override facts. This be one of them cases... and so I'm just, as you would say, telling it like it is.

From one enthusiast to another... you can appreciate that I am sure.

Quadcammer

So I've told a fella his light covers are dangerous and silly, and then when he argues that all S-class owners are boring, I make the post that I understand the need for speed due to my ownership of a heavily modified mustang. I don't see the problem.

Are you kidding? This whole forum is filled with complaints about MB problems.

Considering Buick was given some of the best JD Power ratings for quality, beating Lexus for at least one year, I'd say your anecdotal Enclave experience isn't worth much.