Celicasaur

Ahhh good stuff, glad that you're going for them. I'm interested to see how they perform on a car that is...well...performing well. You'll probbably make better use of them than me because you track your car also.

Eureka moment? TBH by the sounds of it, I think these would have just worked right off the bat if my intake didn't coincidentally fail on me (belly pan threads were toast). Most of the struggle came from 1) modyfying the oem throttle plate 2) making a vacuum port for the 997 TBs 3) sealing them in and then of course 4) discovering that they work in reverse to the oem signal. When i took the gamble on buying a 550 series TB and plugged it into the loom to find it working, i ordered another one right away and tried to install them asap.....which is when my bellypan gave up after countlessly being torqued up (you really need to see the graveyard of intake manifold bolts that I've got....well over 10 sets of gaskets and bolts purchased over the last year ) - I was quite sad when i spend ~120USD on brand new bellypan bolts (those tiny screws were like £7GBP EACH!) from the MB dealer only to find that my local engineering shop couldn't install new threads because the material of the manifold was too soft and just kept crumbling to dust.




Thanks guys

It's ~15.7% now vs ~13.7%. WOT was 87% but now 91%

Idle rpm is the same as it was (thankfully!) although I am getting an intermittent CEL, code P2101 - Throttle Actuator Control Motor Circuit Range/Performance. I'm guessing maybe one of them is faulty (they were second-hand items afterall). If the CEL keeps coming back and annoys me, then I guess I'll have to get a proper diagnostic on STAR and work out which one to replace.

Thanks G and ahhh the M5 and Celica are both badass in their own right. It's almost depressing how a ~20 year old V8 (with just a tune!) and 4-cylinder 2.0l motor are so close in the 0-100 sprint as my E63

skratch77

Don't bother trying a bunch if throttle bodies.I have about 4 in my garage and the e55 only uses one throttle body.

It needs specific ecu tuning to fix the codes being thrown and you just entered the nightmare I metioned everyone had going bigger tb on the e55.

The closets I got was using star to up engine rpm in park and in drive and reverse.you have to do it with car running and foot on the brake putting it in the gears.

I had to Max out the limits in star to not throw codes but every 2 months the car would pend the code and be in a limp mode and every 3 months it would get a check engine light on.

That is why I put the stock one on before selling the car as it won't pass inspection with these codes pending.

Before you spend money buying tbs like we all did get into star and up the engine rpms and try to get that tps% as close to stock as possible.

Also are you sure you don't have those values backwards? It should be lower number now because you have a bigger tb and more air is coming in and the ecu will close it to compensate.

It should be 13.7 now and 15.7 stock I think

Celicasaur

Damnit, I certainly hope not tbh

For what it's worth, I didn't have a CEL yesterday, so fingers crossed....

I'll report back if anything spooky happens.

BLKROKT

I've heard from someone who's testing the Russian 82mm TBs that - so far - they are 100% plug-and-play.

Pretty psyched about this. Thanks for blazing the trail for us here Celicasaur

skratch77

Glad you guys are testing this out for us! I have 2 or 3 550 the sitting in my garage waiting lol

Conv_GSDriver

@celicasaur man great reading this. What you described in your post a couple days ago was very similar to how my previous car's throttle response felt compared to the almost stock one I currently have with only the EC tune. Since I bought the previous car with the mods on, I didn't find out how much of a difference it made until I bought my current car in stock form and then I was able to tell the difference. For what I was able to find out, the car basically had a stage 1 setup like the Renntech/Kleeman offerings, a tune, full akra exhaust. The TBs being those 82mm same part number from Porsche. I did suffer from the occasional loss of power issues, limp mode followed by CEL; The CEL would clear by itself after about 3-4 days. Great to hear and hope it sustains this way. Would be interested in the GB if that ever materializes knowing this might be a more stable setup and possibly plug and play as mentioned earlier. Kudos to you man.

Celicasaur

It's all love guys - hopefully we'll start seeing more 480whp cars turning into 490whp cars.

I've also got a couple of other things in the cooker which you'll hear about in a new thread if they pan out

LSAMG

Hey Guys,
just wanted to chime in with some info:
1. Thanks to All that worked hard to see if this was even possible
2. I ordered the kit from Oli in Russia
3. The part numbers are correct.
4. They are plug and play
5. They have been tested for 100 miles and no CELs, errors or bad idle issues
6. I am running Eurocharged V6 header tune. They were informed about the larger throttle bodies prior to getting the tune.
7. Due to the weather, I have not had it at WOT, but it was tested at WOT a few days ago, no issues
8. I am going away for 2 weeks, but will do a follow up when I hit 500mi
9. Shout Out to Harry and the Team at Bergen Imports!!!!
10. pics:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/g4xob4f7xhh0lu9/-2.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ztqj03zyyu2vcge/-3.jpg?dl=0

ritalin

Awesome.

Looking forward to more results. What was the total cost if you don't mind.

BLKROKT

I talked to Oli earlier today about a Group Buy, and he's going to send me some info. I'll post here when I hear back from him.

My TBs should ship on the 25th. Can't wait.

Kriston

Great Job guys,

Those Russian TB's were on Ebay for years now. Happy they worked out for you all.

I had contacted Oli prior to purchasing the Renntech TB's. He said its the same design, however just to confirm the TB's he's offering with his packaged kits are used?

If they are 550 TB's how much are they new?

If we can get a GB together for the Russian plates, and source new TB's for a reasonable cost. I'm down for a set for the old mans ML63.

BLKROKT

I looked at this too Kriston. Initially I had ordered just the plate by mistake, so I was looking at these 550 throttle bodies. MB Part # A 273 141 0325. Bosch Part # 0280750182

New they were over $1000ea. Remanufactured I found ~$200ea. Knowing the cost of the plate alone, and then combined, it just wasn't worth the effort for me to source them separately, or the risk that they wouldn't fit or would need to be modified to work correctly. The package made more sense for me.

I'm pretty sure he's using remanufactured TBs for this to keep the cost reasonable.

Kriston

He will sell the kit for $950 With the TB's. He offered it for that price last year.

BLKROKT

Less now

Kriston

lets get this GB going!

ritalin

Damn group buys.... keep me posted

LSAMG

Hi Guys,
just checking in . No issues, had her out for a few spirited runs in the cool weather. good luck with the group buy

Celicasaur

How are you enjoying the better low down shove?

I love it man. On the stock set up, the throttle is limited to whatever it's been programmed to open at, but these just force the issue and ingest more air, making it a lot more smoother on the pedal and exciting at the same time.

Mag1c Carp3t

I'm down for some larger TBs.

LSAMG

oh Yeah Celicasaur!!!!, took me by surprise

hachiroku

before and after dyno?

Celicasaur

It would be nice if somebody did that i guess.

For what it's worth I think I saw a gain of around 8 or 9 g/s of airflow up top after the changeover. Using ricer math, that equates to ~10-12hp, but don't quote me on that.

Phil_T

Would this not require mapping for it to run right? Or will the ecu adjust for the extra flow?

hachiroku

i wrote the same thing and re-read the thread. the ECU is a ME9.7 unit. similar ECU to what AUDI/VW/Porsche/Lamborghini use which is a Bosch Motronic. these ECU's are very intelligent and actually deliver performances based off calculations rather than "maps". you set the target a/f maps and target timing, then the computer decides how much fuel, timing, throttle, etc to give to achieve target a/f and target load based off a map.

if you notice from the screenshot posted previously that the ECU is massively pulling ignition timing because it cannot control/limit airflow due to the change of throttle body. air flow meter is still reading too high, and ignition timing is pegged at -22.5 degree's.

the Bosch Motronic ECU is pretty advanced and meant to allow for better control of "drive-ability". makes you understand why there are so many tuners available to us. honestly wished hptuners came out sooner, as i would have went with that rather than an off the shelf tune.

injector changes will throw off the computer entirely, but as far as throttle bodies, i think there is a small margin of error of which the computer will be able to compensate without losing its mind. ideally you would want to readjust power delivery maps as a little too much airflow could cause the ECU to peg into the wrong load cell, then resulting in the ECU dropping performance.

MBNRG

Exciting discussion to push the NA envelope for sure, and a hat tip to all the contributors. To help justify BTBs + Plate, this data would be greatly appreciated:

1. With BTBs installed, Dual Band A/F monitoring at WOT to check for Lean conditions, especially on cars already equipped with Long Tube Headers.

2. Multiple Before/After Dyno Pulls and Quarter Miles. Do we gain power across the band, or do we gain at a specific range, and lose at a different range?

Kriston, did you notice anything from the above 2 points with your Renntech 82mm TBs? Was the 10whp you saw across the entire power band? And were you already running with LTH?

Does the Renntech unit utilize the same Bosch TBs from the 550 series, or is it the Porsche ones like someone else mentioned?