C63_dude

Hi

Just wanted to share my pics of my new Eurotech headers.

Sweet isnīt it?

107 HP increase with Eurotech tune and his headers system...

Iīm just one happy Merc driver now and cool that I can share it with you motor heads....

RM-6302

Congratulations! The picture showing them bolted on is very nice!

I have to ask: What was the after tune/header HP and TQ measured?

also, What was the total cost including install, dynos, tune, etc?

Thanks.

I just saw your other post, SORRY.

C63_dude

Around 4600 dollars all included.... Shipping + ECU tune + bolt-on headers/pipes to midsection including all gaskets,nuts, clamps, and even a speciel key to remove the stock header... ;o)
459 before and 566 hp after....
The dyno was performed at a local tuning shop... So it wasnīt included in the package from Eurotech performance....

RM-6302

Thanks for the info.

Sincity

This is a nice piece of work:

C63_dude

Thanks Sincity... But the best thing about these headers is that I can choose my cat option... It is made in 6 pieces and very easy to install and remove the cats when going to the tracks....

And the exhaust note when driving with the 200 cell option is soo cool...

Turns heads everywhere....

I have 566 HP with 200 cell cats... Have to go to dyno and try the HP with the none Cat option....

_AMG_

WOW, those are some quality headers. Very clean work, enjoy them.

Sincity

What is the diameter of the downpipe/primary? I wonder how much more efficient these are over the PLMs since you are not using the stock primary/DPs.

PLMs (pic by Superlubricity):



Eurotech:

superlubricity

Don't forget Kleemann (from hhughes1)



These are all manifolds, not headers. I imagine they'll produce power similar to the PLMs and the catless downpipes I tested a while back. The PLMs were good for ~15 RWHP/~15 RWTQ on the Dynojet and the catless downpipes were good for another a 1-1.5 MPH improvement in the 1/4-mile.

PLM Exhaust Manifold data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...folds-c63.html

Catless Downpipe data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...-2010-c63.html

Cool system, but it isn't making the power the OP thinks it's making over stock. I'd love to see the actual dyno data. All previous data for systems like this have consistently shown they make far less power/torque than a mid-length or full-length header systems. That's where you start seeing gains (when paired with an ECU tune) of 90-100 HP over stock.

And C63_dude, you've mentioned "favorite" tuner a couple times before. I'm not into favorites. I'm into buying products and thoroughly testing them on my own under conditions I control. If the product yields the results I'm after, I keep it. If it doesn't, I learn from the data and continue to test new products until I meet my goal. I'm brand-agnostic and as unbiased as you'll ever find.

BFNYM156

[quote=superlubricity;4245732]Don't forget Kleemann (from hhughes1)



These are all manifolds, not headers. I imagine they'll produce power similar to the PLMs and the catless downpipes I tested a while back. The PLMs were good for ~15 RWHP/~15 RWTQ on the Dynojet and the catless downpipes were good for another a 1-1.5 MPH improvement in the 1/4-mile.

PLM Exhaust Manifold data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...folds-c63.html

Catless Downpipe data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...-2010-c63.html

Cool system, but it isn't making the power the OP thinks it's making over stock. I'd love to see the actual dyno data. All previous data for systems like this have consistently shown they make far less power/torque than a mid-length or full-length header systems. That's where you start seeing gains (when paired with an ECU tune) of 90-100 HP over stock.

And C63_dude, you've mentioned "favorite" tuner a couple times before. I'm not into favorites. I'm into buying products and thoroughly testing them on my own under conditions I control. If the product yields the results I'm after, I keep it. If it doesn't, I learn from the data and continue to test new products until I meet my goal. I'm brand-agnostic and as unbiased as you'll ever find.[/quote]
That's researcher's attitude

C63_dude

Superlubricity
[quote=superlubricity;4245732]Don't forget Kleemann (from hhughes1)



These are all manifolds, not headers. I imagine they'll produce power similar to the PLMs and the catless downpipes I tested a while back. The PLMs were good for ~15 RWHP/~15 RWTQ on the Dynojet and the catless downpipes were good for another a 1-1.5 MPH improvement in the 1/4-mile.

PLM Exhaust Manifold data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-am...folds-c63.html

Catless Downpipe data here -> https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-am...-2010-c63.html

Cool system, but it isn't making the power the OP thinks it's making over stock. I'd love to see the actual dyno data. All previous data for systems like this have consistently shown they make far less power/torque than a mid-length or full-length header systems. That's where you start seeing gains (when paired with an ECU tune) of 90-100 HP over stock.

And C63_dude, you've mentioned "favorite" tuner a couple times before. I'm not into favorites. I'm into buying products and thoroughly testing them on my own under conditions I control. If the product yields the results I'm after, I keep it. If it doesn't, I learn from the data and continue to test new products until I meet my goal. I'm brand-agnostic and as unbiased as you'll ever find.[/quote]
That's researcher's attitude


But Iīve seen Eurotechs datas and Iīve dunoed the car at a totally unbiased place that had no gain from improving the horsepower gain... I dynoed the car before I even touched the car to 459 HP and after I installed headers and ECU I got 566 HP. Same dyno same place.... How is that not research to you...? I think it seems more unbias when done a completely different place than the shop that actually sells the headers....? I now have 566 HP so according to you and your own data the ECU should give me 80-90 HP...? 107 HP minus 15 RWHP.... that sounds a bit extreme...?

I havenīt tried the MPH/MHB headers but If they produce more than 566 HP with my eurotech tune I would be very surprised..... Am I dead wrong here or...??

Sincity
They are 65 mm.... And the "routing" of the downpipe looks nice and smooth/fluid so to say....
I have 566 HP with my Eurotech tune... ( dynoed at a totally unbias place with absolutely no ties to Eurotech...) Period... End of discussion for that part....
I like my headers and the performance the whole package gave me and they are exactly what I wanted when I searched the Internet for upgrades...

And Superlubricity I trust is well aware of the huge difference there is from dyno to dyno..
I was told by a AMG tech that M156 engines are very sensitive to hot intake air... They simply close down the Throttle according to him... So the dyno places needs to have a very good cooling option/Fan....

superlubricity

Post this data and include all the variables. (E.g. # of runs, conditions, correction factors, etc.) I know you are excited about your new found power, but you are touting increases that make zero sense given your mods. You don't walk into a room full of people and say, "I saw Bigfoot!" That's meaningless without proof to back up your claim.

Yes, it does sound extreme. That's why a few of us are punching holes in your story.

Dead wrong. Any full-length header system (Evosport, MBH, MHP, GT PRO) or mid-length system (Cargraphic) will produce more power and torque than a set of high-flow manifolds and 2.5" catless pipes. This has been researched extensively by many members. There is nothing different/special about your Eurotech manifolds when compared to the other high-flow manifold options on the market already.

Sincity

Going slightly OT since you mentioned about hot intake air. As I mentioned in another thread, we also need some kind of shielding placed between the bottom of the airbox and exhaust manifold in addition to a vented hood. Anyone ever touched the bottom of that blistering hot airbox bottom after a drive? Evosport did say they have some sort of shielding for the Stage 2 (or something like that) but didn't say if it was available separately.

superlubricity

You are the King of taking threads Off Topic. Nobody does it better.

Sincity

That (65mm = 2.55 in) should flow better than the PLM's when Superlubricity measured them at 54.102 mm (2.130 in). Anyone know what Kleemann's measures at?

If you have a bsaeline dyno, great. Otherwise please post dyno showing post tune and dyno with headers/manifold installed so we can see the gain for the headers/manifolds alone.

Sincity

That is not a good reputation to have around here....must be due to my childhood ADD.

C63_dude

Superlubricity
Post this data and include all the variables. (E.g. # of runs, conditions, correction factors, etc.) I know you are excited about your new found power, but you are touting increases that make zero sense given your mods. You don't walk into a room full of people and say, "I saw Bigfoot!" That's meaningless without proof to back up your claim.
I get your point. I will post dyno to show.

Yes, it does sound extreme. That's why a few of us are punching holes in your story.
But thatīs the claim made by you, that my header is only giving me 15 RWHP. I did before and after dyno and I have 107 HP more on the crank. So there is no story to punch a hole in as you put it. Before 459 HP and after 566 HP. Whatīs there to discuss other than based on your research and development itīs not true.

The only reason for this to be off would be the correction factor made by the Dyno to calculate the horsepower from the wheels.

C63_dude

Sincity
We should do like Mclaren did in their F1...
A layer of thin leafgold.... That should do the trick...

superlubricity

Excellent. Be sure to show all the before and after data.

I'm not making claims, I'm sharing information. The manifolds I tested made ~15 RWHP/TQ. When I added catless 2.5" downpipes they did not show marked improvement on the dyno but did pick up 1.5MPH in the 1/4-mile up top. The posts I linked you to above cover it in great detail.
Very true. This might be the the root cause here, especially if the drive-train % loss is unusually high.

I look forward to seeing the data.

harrower

slow down guys. As I posted before the best thing to do here is get a tester state-side and see how things go.

C63 dude - don't take anything personal on the boards as this would be counter-productive to the thread. The guys here have seen and heard so many stories like yours before only to have actual results not meet expectations. That is not to say that your performance gains aren't true...they probably are but this is a skeptical and grumpy bunch at times who have been burned more than a few times by outlandish claims. I am glad you are excited about your tune/headers as that is what it is all about. Enjoy your ride and welcome again.

C63_dude

Harrower
Fair enough. But try to see this from my side of view. I get my car dynoed to 459 HP. I install the mods and dyno the car same place and have 566 HP using same correction factor on Dyno. I post it here and immediately I have to defend myselves.? Whatīs that all about.?
I know I came on too strong perhaps but that doesnīt justify anybody to question my HP gains. Dynoīs posted or not. Thatīs just as easy to tamper with....

Superlubricity
I just think that if the correction factor to be soo much off itīs strange that my stock HP is soo close to original HP..? But ofcourse that increases proportionally when power increases.


Iīll just shut up now and enjoy my ride... Donīt want to upset anybody in here...
Take care out there...

harrower

No one is upset and as I said you shouldn't take it personally. I am sure that someone will test your set-up and verify your results and any questions on the tune will go away.

Sincity

C63 dude: Did you happen to mention what dyno you used? I apologize if I may have missed it. Most of us use a Dynojet and a few others a Dyno Dynamics.

C63_dude

Harrower

Just not cool to be "called" a liar indirectly because I post my HP upgrade on my car... But Iīll deliver more data to support the gain next time. Lesson learned...
It seems like people have been lied to a lot in this Forum apparently... didnīt know that as I am brand new here and will ofcourse respect that in the future.

Sincity
I have really no idea as to what the dyno is called. I wil find out. I just figure that when the dyno guy hit 459 hp that the dyno couldnīt be that much off. But I didnīt take the time to check the name. It must be on my dyno sheet. Iīll let you know... Are there some dynoīs that are much better than others...?

BerBer63

Post RWhp numbers.