Dogtag114

Starting July in NJ, you can be pulled over for talking or texting as a primary offence.


I was driving, listening to Pandora, and picked up the phone to skip to the next song on Pandora.


I state trooper was on my left as I did it. I was in my wife's Explorer at the speed limit, so my mental radar wasn't on.


I got a warning and lost a PBA card for it...


Question is: was I breaking the law? The law states "talking or texting on a hand-held wireless communications device"


http://www.state.nj.us/mvc/About/safety_cellphone.htm

Ingenieur

“Use” of a wireless phone and any other hand-held communication device includes, but is not limited to, talking or listening to another person, texting, or sending and receiving electronic messages.

But not limited to
Need to look at the actual law

In a sense you were sending an electronic message
Actually a digital command via web

Dialing a call isn't specified but I'm sure is a violation
They basically prohibit use for ANY reason

Here's the law http://www.njlawman.com/new-jersey-t...-39-4-97-3.htm
Should have kept the card
No points non-reportable to insurers

SaphGreyC63

Got a "texting" ticket, use of mobile phone, here in California a couple months ago.

I told the officer that I was not using my phone for texting or calling someone but rather looking at it for gps. He didn't want to hear it and gave me the ticket.

I looked up the law in California and it stated that we are not allowed to use our phones for "texting, calling, or emailing another human being" (those aren't the exact words and that is the just the idea behind what it was saying)

Given that I knew I wasn't texting or contacting another human being, I fought the ticket using trial by declaration (written trial basically) by stating my case, sending in my phone and text logs from Verizon and I won the case.

Check your state's law and if you have a written trial I would do that at the very least fight it somehow.

Dogtag114

Damn... Woulda kept the PBA for that...

dchl21

over here at t.o. is $280 bux when caught. crazy

mthis

Lol in NYC it's 5 points
And red lite ticket is 3.

jcfay

Talk to an attorney, if you have one. The law states as an exception "however, this definition shall not preclude the use of either hand to activate, deactivate, or initiate a function of the telephone." In other words, it is hands-free for everything but with the above exception. I'm no attorney, however. But that has BS written all over it, and we all know that cops often don't know the nitty-gritty details about traffic laws, nor do they care, when instead they can write tickets and have them most often not contested and simply paid for. Gotta get their quotas and tax revenue, but it's BS and I'd fight it, depending on the amount of work involved and the cost/reward analysis.

Ingenieur

When a cop drives by you and you are holding a phone and hitting buttons is he supposed to divine your intent?

He saw you 'using' a phone
The law was written to give him latitude
Put the pjone down and drive...period
At 70 mph you are travelling 100 ft/sec
A few distracted seconds can kill someone
Happens many times everyday

Ingenieur

Here's the cali law https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc23123.htm

It just says 'use' period
Does not specify talking, texting, internet, email, music
Just use, use for any purpose

It's a $20 fine

The distraction is the same when talking as using gps
In fact maybe more for gps, internet, song selection since you may have to look at the device

No one thinks it will happen to them...until it happens to them
Why me? Lol
Everyone thinks they are a good driver so it won't happen to them
A good driver wouldn't do it

Ingenieur

Law
V C Section 23123 Hand Held Wireless Telephone Prohibited Use

Hand-Held Wireless Telephone: Prohibited Use

23123. (a) A person shall not drive a motor vehicle while using a wireless telephone unless that telephone is specifically designed and configured to allow hands-free listening and talking, and is used in that manner while driving.

(b) A violation of this section is an infraction punishable by a base fine of twenty dollars ($20) for a first offense and fifty dollars ($50) for each subsequent offense.

(c) This section does not apply to a person using a wireless telephone for emergency purposes, including, but not limited to, an emergency call to a law enforcement agency, health care provider, fire department, or other emergency services agency or entity.

(d) This section does not apply to an emergency services professional using a wireless telephone while operating an authorized emergency vehicle, as defined in Section 165, in the course and scope of his or her duties.

(e) This section does not apply to a person driving a schoolbus or transit vehicle that is subject to Section 23125.

(f) This section does not apply to a person while driving a motor vehicle on private property.

(g) This section shall become operative on July 1, 2011.


It does not limit use to talking or text, etc
It limits 'use' for any reason period except emergencies

SaphGreyC63

Just FYI, I was using the phone at a red light, put the phone down before it turned green, he stopped me after, so for the distraction purposes I would say that's a situation that doesn't warrant it.

Secondly, you're right, its a $20 fine.....before all the "fees" they add in. Total comes out to $162. I've always said if they actually just keep it at $20, I and I'm assuming so many more people, would have just paid it and moved on, but at $162, it was worth my time to write a quick letter.

Lastly, this was the exact violation I was written up for:
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc23123_5.htm

Specifically section A, which was noted on my ticket:
23123.5. (a) A person shall not drive a motor vehicle while using an electronic wireless communications device to write, send, or read a text–based communication, unless the electronic wireless communications device is specifically designed and configured to allow voiceoperated and hands-free operation to dictate, send, or listen to a text-based communication, and it is used in that manner while driving.

That's probably why I got off, because I was ticketed for that exact reason and I was able to prove no texting or calling or communication. If you look at section C

(c) For purposes of this section, a person shall not be deemed to be writing, reading, or sending a text–based communication if the person reads, selects, or enters a telephone number or name in an electronic wireless communications device for the purpose of making or receiving a telephone call or if a person otherwise activates or deactivates a feature or function on an electronic wireless communications device.


In other words I was activating or deactivating a feature or function on my device (ie GPS) at a red light no less, wasn't even moving.

avery.whss

I got a speeding ticket last night...first one ever..80km in a 50km at 1am..my radar dector didn't even go off..OP I know the feels

Ingenieur

He wrote you up for texting
Should have written you up under the one I posted 'use' lol

Critter

Just why is it so difficult to not understand that using a hand held device while supposedly driving a motor vehicle is up for debate. When you took your drivers test did the examiner let you text your buddies to tell them you are taking a test, LOL. You get caught, whine about it while for some reason you feel you have the right to put others in potential danger, lane swerving, inattentiveness, no signals, sudden stops because of looking at your crotch and not realize the traffic has stopped in front of you or just you are so important and need to be in contact with the rest of the world, like now.
In Canada they want to raise the fine to $1000 and points which is perfect as there are lots of people who will not mind adding to the government purse.
Once you have had an idiot drive through a red light on you while he is texting your views will change also.


When stopped at a red light you are still in control of a motor vehicle and feel the need that is also a charge as plain clothes cops stand near the intersections and have a field day handing out tickets, saves gas in the cruisers.


Friend of mine handed his cell to his son in the back seat, ticket, the cops do not play games up here in the Great White.

jcfay

I'm definitely against cell phone use while driving, but not while stopped, that's just plain stupid. Texting and driving is dangerous, but if you think for one second that you're not distracted while messing with the COMAND system you're delusional. I know it prompts you to not use while driving but when you look down to turn down your car stereo or whatever it's also dangerous. I'm just not down with excessive fines, points, or whatever. I am all for, however, being a super attentive and safe driver, it's just too bad that most people drive like crap.

Ingenieur

How did we get by before cell phones
With a less stressful and hectic existence perhaps?

People can't stand the noise of their own 'wheels'
So they must always be distracted from themselves
Phones
Texts
Internet
Music
Etc

Anything other than be alone with their own thoughts

We think they make us more productive
Or provide a more meaningful existence
We can do 'more', usually more useless crap
99% of the convos are insipid and meaningless
They can wait
But that wouldn't give us an excuse to avoid ourselves lol

jcfay

"Insipid and meaningless?" Ouch. Remind me not to give you a call to chat... FYI I have some pretty damn deep convos, even while driving

Critter

jcfay, got a good story for you, woman sitting at a red light, texting, looked up seen the light turn green and jumped on the gas, ran right into the back of my sons CTS, seems that green means go even when you have a car in front of you with signal flashing waiting for people to cross the road. The silly Bee atch actually told the cops "why did he not go when the light was green" Ticket for her and a 2400 dollar repair bill on the CTS as well as two years of physio for her insurance.

Ingenieur

We can discuss why the phone should not be used when in a vehicle on public roads

If you are at a red light looking at your phone instead of scanning your mirrors you may miss the chance to avoid being smoked

We can discuss
World hunger
World peace
Cure cancer
What outfit should you wear
We he/she said about she/he

Most people if locked in a dark quiet room with only a chair would be babbling in less than 5 minutes

jcfay

Yeah, just another dumb ***... That's sad. Perhaps there should be some sort of advanced driving test to tell if you can manage in this modern age with cell phone in car NOT to run into other people minding their own business. I don't disagree that there is some degree of safety risk with cell phone use, but during long highway drives, with a really attentive driver, I think the risk is minimal. But that's with a good driver and not some moron, of course. Texting is just plain deadly, though, unless stopped at a light or otherwise.

When I used to drive a fleet vehicle in a previous job, they had a no cell phone use policy while driving, and if you were in an accident they'd pull your records and then pass the full liability over to you. Just desserts.

Ingenieur

That is problem
The OTHER guy is the problem, not me lol
I can 'handle' it
No one plans on having an accident (actually negligence, accident for the poor sucker minding his own buisiness and gets whacked )

EGO

It's the people who DON'T do it that are the safe smart ones
Not the ones who think they can safely

SaphGreyC63

Since people seem so set on taking cell phones out of a driving situation, here's a question for everyone.

First, let me state my own views. I do NOT use or condone use of a cell phone while driving at any speed (though as stated above if I am stopped at a light, don't see that as dangerous at all, since its basically the same as parked as long as I am attentive to the light changes, and that of course the phone is put down before moving). It is dangerous no matter how good a driver you are. It's a distraction that impairs you from the full attention.

Now the question.....Lawmakers are so so so intent on stopping cell phone use in cars which is a good thing, yet car manufacturers are moving forward with systems that allow users to access facebook and instagram and a host of other apps that have no place in a car and driving at all and are just full distractions but will be 100% legal to use because its built in. The BIGGEST culprit of this is of course Tesla, which straight from the factory provides you a HUGE touch screen that allows use to have full access to the internet while the car is moving. Why is this allowed but cell phones are not? Even above it was noted that command is distracting, which I agree with, that scrolling and moving between phone, looking at phone book contacts, and dialing, READING TEXT MESSAGES ON THE COMMAND SCREEN!!!! and other actions are allowed.

That's my 0.02 and would love to hear other people's thoughts about this.

Ingenieur

I'm guilty of using my sat radio presets via the steering wheel buttons
I keep my screen parked not up

Anything other than 100% is not good
I don't like involved conversations
I want to immerse myself in the actually act of driving
FOCUS people

SaphGreyC63

While 100% is the ideal, I think we can all agree that is never the case. When we get in our cars, if it isn't a "live" distractions I for one can attest that if I have any business thoughts it's all definitely running through my mind and distracting me to some extent.

We've all had those "how did I get home?" drives where the drive happens almost automatically.

Ingenieur

I've gotten pretty good at shutting off the internal dialogue
Been around long enough to know worrying about work won't do squat
So while there give it my best and leave nothing on the table
Literally and figuratively lol
Clean my desk off and mind out

It is easier now with my 'retirement' job
My previous career was different
Making payroll
Securing agreements/ contracts
Employee issues
Client issues
Project/ contractor issues

I do not miss it