Meth injection
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c63
Meth injection
HI Guys
Is anyone using meth on there cars here?
Curious to see your setups
I looking for some information ive tried seaching but with not much luck
I picked up my head this week after getting it cleaned as im adding ARP head bolts and some bits and pieces and they advised that my valves ARE JUST keeping up on my application with the stage 2 but now im adding a stage 3 and im a little worried with the extra heat and stuff
Tech heads maybe chime in here
Is anyone using meth on there cars here?
Curious to see your setups
I looking for some information ive tried seaching but with not much luck
I picked up my head this week after getting it cleaned as im adding ARP head bolts and some bits and pieces and they advised that my valves ARE JUST keeping up on my application with the stage 2 but now im adding a stage 3 and im a little worried with the extra heat and stuff
Tech heads maybe chime in here
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C63
Never dealt with meth injection, but one of my old friends had it on his 997 turbo and it really helped keep his air intake temps cooler.
Cant really say much else other then it does help with cooling.
Cant really say much else other then it does help with cooling.
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C63 AMG
Meth injection seems like nitrous to me, not a fan.
If the valves were getting too hot, there would be failures and we haven't seen any failures, so I wouldn't worry about it.
No one sells after market valves anyways, unless you had a custom set made up. I just don't think it's an issue.
Have any pictures?
If the valves were getting too hot, there would be failures and we haven't seen any failures, so I wouldn't worry about it.
No one sells after market valves anyways, unless you had a custom set made up. I just don't think it's an issue.
Have any pictures?
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Thread Starter
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c63
Meth injection seems like nitrous to me, not a fan.
If the valves were getting too hot, there would be failures and we haven't seen any failures, so I wouldn't worry about it.
No one sells after market valves anyways, unless you had a custom set made up. I just don't think it's an issue.
Have any pictures?
If the valves were getting too hot, there would be failures and we haven't seen any failures, so I wouldn't worry about it.
No one sells after market valves anyways, unless you had a custom set made up. I just don't think it's an issue.
Have any pictures?
They said it was fine now but in the future it could be a problem
Im sure you are like me and dont like problems
hence this postI have seen pics of meth injection on weistec blowers but never heard first hand experience
The e55 guys run meth all the time just never hear stories from m156 owners
Yes you are right there are no after market valves avl i just changed all my valve stem seals while the head was off
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From: Markham
07 Z06, 2011 c63pp
Meth is not like nitrous, aside from it burns cooler than fuel.
I have used meth on my 335 and it is widely used on many platforms.
I dont see a downside on this platform aside from integration. We need a tuner to step up and tune specifically for meth injection in order to reap the full benefit of the added octane.
Aem has some decent kits and most of the kits available on the market can be installed without a specific tune but aside from running cooler and potentially keeping the intake and valves clean like it does in most FI DI motors we wont be taking advantage of the performance aspect.
For you supercharged guys, it could be substantial.
Aem
Aquamist
Cooling mist
Snow performance
Just to name a few companies who offer reasonable kits.
On the m156 in sure a twin nozzle setup before the throttle bodies would be adequate but i would rather a tuner who works with meth often to make those decisions.
I have used meth on my 335 and it is widely used on many platforms.
I dont see a downside on this platform aside from integration. We need a tuner to step up and tune specifically for meth injection in order to reap the full benefit of the added octane.
Aem has some decent kits and most of the kits available on the market can be installed without a specific tune but aside from running cooler and potentially keeping the intake and valves clean like it does in most FI DI motors we wont be taking advantage of the performance aspect.
For you supercharged guys, it could be substantial.
Aem
Aquamist
Cooling mist
Snow performance
Just to name a few companies who offer reasonable kits.
On the m156 in sure a twin nozzle setup before the throttle bodies would be adequate but i would rather a tuner who works with meth often to make those decisions.
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From: Kitchener, ON
2010 C63 AMG
Is there any way to tap injectors into the intake runners of the blower?
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From: Markham
07 Z06, 2011 c63pp
Meth injection
I ran the AEM kit on my SC'd track s2000 for cooling purposes only. It was a decent quality kit. I would vote against injection before the TBs though. I'd be concerned about uneven distribution into the chambers.
Is there any way to tap injectors into the intake runners of the blower?
Is there any way to tap injectors into the intake runners of the blower?
I'll see if i can find any info.
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C63 AMG
How long does meth last? Just something more to fill up and fiddle with. Would it be kicking in at a certain RPM? I daily drive, don't need to be filling up a meth bottle every day, I like my power there and when I want it, not needing to turn a bottle on.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
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c63
THanks guys this is all interesting
Merc63 the head has all been tested and crack tested and all is ok and was ok but it was just there advice
They were not saying it was a problem but could potentially be a problem
I would think a stage 3 would be more efficient then a stage 2 so the intake temperatures should possible be better
Merc63 the head has all been tested and crack tested and all is ok and was ok but it was just there advice
They were not saying it was a problem but could potentially be a problem
I would think a stage 3 would be more efficient then a stage 2 so the intake temperatures should possible be better
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From: Kitchener, ON
2010 C63 AMG
How long does meth last? Just something more to fill up and fiddle with. Would it be kicking in at a certain RPM? I daily drive, don't need to be filling up a meth bottle every day, I like my power there and when I want it, not needing to turn a bottle on.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
Just to give you an idea. 4 or 5 20-30 min sessions at 6000-8500 rpm went through almost a full 1gallon tank.
There's also a level switch that lets you know when you're "empty" so the tune can be modified on the fly.
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From: Markham
07 Z06, 2011 c63pp
How long does meth last? Just something more to fill up and fiddle with. Would it be kicking in at a certain RPM? I daily drive, don't need to be filling up a meth bottle every day, I like my power there and when I want it, not needing to turn a bottle on.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
mr747, valves look good from there, exhaust temps would have to get pretty high to melt or wreck a valve. I think you'd be getting detention if your temps were getting too high, Weistec runs these tunes pretty conservatively.
It really depends on when and where you are using it.
In a daily driven application i would go through less than a gallon a week driving about 400km.
I used a snow perf stg 2 meth injection setup.
The setup uses a line tapped off of diverter valves in my case and fed to the control module. The pumps work infinitely and you can adjust what boost level you want the meth to start spraying. It would begin spraying at 7lbs of boost and and ramping up from lets say 30 percent to the full 100 percent by full boost of 16.8lbs.
I was using giac stg 2 plus software on my 335 which was tailored to make use of the added
octane.
If you were road racing often in boost all the time you would be using a lot more fluid. In a drag racing application your not using much at all, considering how short your run is.
Street driving, you definitely use more depending on your settings and requirements of your setup.
You can choose your tank size depending on your purpose, dd, rr, drag.
This is by no means an official how it all works as im far from an authority on the matter but there is so much discussion on it and it has proven itself a very useful tool and with all failsafe's in place far from volatile.
It seems a lot of LS guys on corvette forum only run one nozzle in most cases...
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From: Markham
07 Z06, 2011 c63pp
How long it lasts is completely variable. It uses a high pressure pulse injection pump that would be controlled by the tune.
Just to give you an idea. 4 or 5 20-30 min sessions at 6000-8500 rpm went through almost a full 1gallon tank.
There's also a level switch that lets you know when you're "empty" so the tune can be modified on the fly.
Just to give you an idea. 4 or 5 20-30 min sessions at 6000-8500 rpm went through almost a full 1gallon tank.
There's also a level switch that lets you know when you're "empty" so the tune can be modified on the fly.
Which is why the control is important.
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Joined: Nov 2012
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From: Hong Kong
W204 C63
Meth is great for Turbo or Supercharged cars.
Cools the air, allowing for the engine to run more efficiently. Essentially makes the gas a higher octane.
Does not show that much benefit on N/A cars though.
Cools the air, allowing for the engine to run more efficiently. Essentially makes the gas a higher octane.
Does not show that much benefit on N/A cars though.
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 273
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From: Melbourne, Australia
C63 Coupe, 2014, 507
Some things to consider:
- Twin-screw superchargers compress with every turn, so injecting pre-rotors will do some negative things:
a] The meth-mix will be heated which will reduce its effectiveness.
b] The rotors will get thermally shocked. The rotors in the twin-screw are hard anodised and thermal shock is not consistent with longevity.
c] Meth seepage into the support bearings will not be helpful.
- Meth mix can be corrosive/erosive. Regular checks of the supercharger components is advised.
- Ensure the system installed has one-way valves. Boost pushing the meth-mix out of the tank & into the trunk could be hazardous.
- Even distribution across all cylinders is important.
- A rising-rate control system that interrogates boost/rpm/MAF is recommended.
- Twin-screw superchargers compress with every turn, so injecting pre-rotors will do some negative things:
a] The meth-mix will be heated which will reduce its effectiveness.
b] The rotors will get thermally shocked. The rotors in the twin-screw are hard anodised and thermal shock is not consistent with longevity.
c] Meth seepage into the support bearings will not be helpful.
- Meth mix can be corrosive/erosive. Regular checks of the supercharger components is advised.
- Ensure the system installed has one-way valves. Boost pushing the meth-mix out of the tank & into the trunk could be hazardous.
- Even distribution across all cylinders is important.
- A rising-rate control system that interrogates boost/rpm/MAF is recommended.
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c63 AMG
I have a friend with a stage 3 SLS using meth. It was tune by Steve from Weistec and is running perfectly. I thought long time ago about using it but a have seen so many motors damage because a malfunctions on meth systems that I desist. The only way you know the system is working is because it have a light that turn from red to green when you accelerate. I just decide that is safer to use c16 when track the car and that way I feel secure.
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C63
Depends on how your going to run it...Methanol has an motor octane rating of 113. Most cars run a 50/50 mix of methanol and water because it is the most simplest form requiring virtually no tuning, methanol line pressures aren't as important, and cylinder to cylinder distribution irregularities aren't always catastrophic. More advanced systems run 100% methanol but these require the use of sophisticated computers to pull fuel out from the primary source, to increase timing for immediate power increases, and the methanol injection must be designed such that even distribution of methanol to each cylinder is essential to prevent engine damage, precise methanol line pressures must be maintained, and safety devices must be used in case the methanol runs out or the line becomes blocked. The 100% methanol system will make significantly more power than a 50/50 mix but there must be systems in place to support it.
You also need to worry about distribution...When the methanol system is designed such that the distribution to all of the cylinders is uneven, then some cylinders will run leaner than others, some cylinders will have less octane than others, and some cylinders will run much hotter than others. All three of these things can lead to engine damage. So just misting into the intake manifold would cause uneven distribution.
My advice is if your not going to do it right then don't do it at all. And just run race gas. And the right way in your case is direct port injection. For ultimate performance, reliablity, and safety.
You also need to worry about distribution...When the methanol system is designed such that the distribution to all of the cylinders is uneven, then some cylinders will run leaner than others, some cylinders will have less octane than others, and some cylinders will run much hotter than others. All three of these things can lead to engine damage. So just misting into the intake manifold would cause uneven distribution.
My advice is if your not going to do it right then don't do it at all. And just run race gas. And the right way in your case is direct port injection. For ultimate performance, reliablity, and safety.
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From: Markham
07 Z06, 2011 c63pp
http://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/...t-came-in.html
This would be my idea of a proper kit.
I would need a seperate manifold to try this.
This would be my idea of a proper kit.
I would need a seperate manifold to try this.
