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Winter wheels. Need advice.

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Winter wheels. Need advice.

 
Old 10-15-2016, 02:58 PM
  #26  
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I wish I was brave enough to drive my C63 in the snow. I have dreams of a winter C63 gymkhana. Reality would be a snowy C63 married to a ditch or a telephone pole. My ex-wife's Challenger 392 with Blizzaks was THE best snow car I have ever been in. Great fun, easy to control, and made it through 9 inches of snow.
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Old 10-16-2016, 09:06 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by Alex.currie44 View Post
... It is a matter of physics. PSI on a smaller patch are higher and you get better mechanical locking into the snow. Some would argue that on ice you get more friction with a wider patch but .. .
Let me clarify; I understand that for snow/ice skinny square set up is better...

But for dry cold, I have to think a standard set up with wider wheels is better... no?

Most winters in NJ/NYC area are dry with a handful of snow days and those are plowed and salted quickly.
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Old 10-16-2016, 09:08 AM
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Fog Surround Removal

I remember reading once that the fog surrounds on the pre-face lift cars, could pull straight out and were on spring clips.

Can someone verify/correct?

My previous owner painted them black, but I'm tired of the touch ups there and will try to plastidip those.

Thx
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Old 10-16-2016, 09:20 AM
  #29  
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Yeah. There are little tabs on each side. They pull straight out. Be careful though. The tabs can scratch the bumper pretty easily if you are agressive pulling the bezel out.
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Old 10-16-2016, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by cruzmisl View Post
Diabolis, thanks for that. Can you explain what ET45 refers to? I presume offset?
Thanks
Here is a link to how offset works. As you can see offset is a measure of teh distance from the back face of the hub to the centre line of the wheel itself.
An ET of 45 means there is 45 mm between these two points.

https://www.1010tires.com/Tools/Wheel-Offset-Calculator
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Old 10-16-2016, 11:30 AM
  #31  
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Then you want wide tires. That's the tradeoff with skinny winters; they cut through the snow better but have less grip when they reach the pavement.
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Old 10-16-2016, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambystom01 View Post
Then you want wide tires. That's the tradeoff with skinny winters; they cut through the snow better but have less grip when they reach the pavement.
Ambystom01 - that's completely wrong. I'd be happy to discuss this in as much detail if you want, but unless you can factually substantiate your claims (which you can't - this has been debated ad nauseum and the physics are simply not on your side), please refrain from giving people bad advice.
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Old 10-16-2016, 03:58 PM
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I think ritalin has a set of winters for sale if anyone is looking.
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Old 10-16-2016, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Diabolis View Post
Ambystom01 - that's completely wrong. I'd be happy to discuss this in as much detail if you want, but unless you can factually substantiate your claims (which you can't - this has been debated ad nauseum and the physics are simply not on your side), please refrain from giving people bad advice.
Because you've factually substantiated your claim? All you've done is assert yourself as an expert.

Once you're through the snow and have tarmac on tire contact, a wider contact patch is advantageous. Physics is on my side.
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Old 10-16-2016, 04:23 PM
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Nokian notes that a narrower tire negatively impacts handling and recommends sticking to the stock size:

https://www.nokiantires.com/innovation/facts-about-tires/faq/

Oh look, Continental Tire suggests running wider winter tires:

http://www.continental-tires.com/car/technology/wide-tires

But hey, I'm sure you know more than the companies that actually make the tires since you've done some amateur motorsports.
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Old 10-16-2016, 05:19 PM
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FWIW I run a 225 width. The car definitely handles slush and snow well with that width, but clearly gives up traction in the dry.

But I like a square setup so I can rotate the fronts to the back to help even the wear.

But with a 225 rear wide tire (winter compound) the car will lose traction in the dry quite easily.

Running stock width tires would mean half the life out of the rears, versus rotating them.
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Old 10-16-2016, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambystom01 View Post
Nokian notes that a narrower tire negatively impacts handling and recommends sticking to the stock size:

https://www.nokiantires.com/innovati...out-tires/faq/
Originally Posted by Nokian
With a narrower tire, you would see slightly better winter performance, but you will sacrifice ride and handling abilities.
It's a tradeoff.
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Old 10-16-2016, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambystom01 View Post
Nokian notes that a narrower tire negatively impacts handling and recommends sticking to the stock size:

https://www.nokiantires.com/innovati...out-tires/faq/

Oh look, Continental Tire suggests running wider winter tires:

http://www.continental-tires.com/car...ogy/wide-tires

But hey, I'm sure you know more than the companies that actually make the tires since you've done some amateur motorsports.
Seeing as your only evidence is regurgitation of what you've read at two web sites (one of which does not support your point and the other simply amounts to marketing material) and the rest of your posts are merely personal attacks, I am bowing out. By all means use the widest tires you can get... and enjoy your winter drive, preferably on a narrow slippery road with a huge drop on one side. Please?

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Old 10-16-2016, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Diabolis View Post
Seeing as your only evidence is regurgitation of what you've read at two web sites (one of which does not support your point and the other simply amounts to marketing material) and the rest of your posts are merely personal attacks, I am bowing out. By all means use the widest tires you can get... and enjoy your winter drive, preferably on a narrow slippery road with a huge drop on one side. Please?
Great oh wise one, you call up Continental and Nokian and tell them that you think they're wrong because you're an expert in this area. I note that you haven't substantiated your position at all. It's amusing that you want to take your ball and go home after being so condescending, as you appear to be in many threads.

Originally Posted by Jasonoff View Post
It's a tradeoff.
Exactly, what works best depends entirely on the specific conditions you want to address.
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Old 10-16-2016, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Ambystom01 View Post
Great oh wise one, you call up Continental and Nokian and tell them that you think they're wrong because you're an expert in this area. I note that you haven't substantiated your position at all. It's amusing that you want to take your ball and go home after being so condescending, as you appear to be in many threads.



Exactly, what works best depends entirely on the specific conditions you want to address.
Yeah. All those rally cars that run 305s on their snowy stages give it up. Wide is for dry!
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Old 10-16-2016, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisridebike8 View Post
Yeah. All those rally cars that run 305s on their snowy stages give it up. Wide is for dry!
Because we drive roads equivalent to rally stages in our C63s all the time.

Nobody is denying that if you drive in thick snow, mud or slush, narrow tires make sense since they don't act like a snow plow, and will cut through the mess easier. However, like I've been saying since I first started posting in here, if you drive on plowed, compacted snow and clear but cold streets, stock width is fine. Nokian acknowledges as much. Continental even suggests going wider. But hey, lets ignore new information and just stick to the same dogma that has persisted since the 70s.
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Old 10-16-2016, 06:10 PM
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I had 235 all around but went with a 255 for the rear for this season.

http://www.tirereview.com/breaking-winter-tires/
Originally Posted by tirereview
Generally, narrower tires are better in snow and on ice because they are more stable and get better linear traction by penetrating the snow. This is not always true though; on hard-pack snow, wider tires with more sipes are better. In deep snow, wider tires might be able to float over the top, but thatís a very specific situation. Narrower wheel widths are normally better because it rounds the profile of the tire and helps both penetration and floatation.
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Old 10-16-2016, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisridebike8 View Post
Yeah. There are little tabs on each side. They pull straight out. Be careful though. The tabs can scratch the bumper pretty easily if you are agressive pulling the bezel out.
odd... the drivers side comes out only on the outside edge... then won't budge. The passenger side... no budge at all.
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Old 10-16-2016, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Diabolis View Post
Er - sorry, but there is absolutely no benefit in going with a wider rear tire in the winter. At freezing temperatures, you won't get any additional traction even in the dry, let alone wet from a wider contact patch. With winter tires you get more grip by increasing the pressure per unit surface area on the tire contact patch, so you do want to run narrower tires than you do in the summer when (unlike in winter) the grip is generated by the hot tire "sticking" to the pavement.

Agree 100% that decent aftermarket rims are probably just as good for winter use. You're not exactly going to subject them to G forces that would put much strain on the rims, and, if you hit a pothole or smack a curb going sideways, the replicas are probably considerably cheaper to replace.
Originally Posted by Diabolis View Post
I guess those of us that have been winter rallying and/or ice racing on narrow rubber on ice, slush, mud or just in the wet had it wrong all this time...
In WRC for snow/ice stages they use thin tires with SPIKES.

In the gravel stages they also use thin tires...however take a look at what they use for the tarmac stages. Super wide, low profile tires.

I am sure that if a dry winter stage existed, they would use a wide soft compound winter tire...I don't know why we're arguing over nothing here.
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Old 10-16-2016, 07:45 PM
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I don't know why either, but here we are.
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Old 10-19-2016, 12:42 AM
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:35 PM
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Lightbulb Staggered winter wheel set needed!

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Last edited by Bulfeed; 01-03-2017 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:38 PM
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by georgy View Post
I just got a 18 x 8.5 / 18x9.5 with PA4s 235/255. In my opinion it's not worth it to drive on skinny tires 95% of the time in the winter when there's no deep snow.

Also, any wheels would do...I've been running replicas on my cars forever and I've never bent/broken anything even when hitting big potholes in Toronto.





Hi, I am looking to find staggered wheels for the winter for my 2012 C63 as well, I live in Calgary and not been able to find wheels with the right offset / width, can you guide me to where did you find the replicas for winter, much appreciated!!
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:44 PM
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Why not run a square setup so you can rotate front to rear and even the wear?

A staggered setup will let you have a bit more grip out back, but no chance to rotate. And in the cold, even with a 255 the grip sucks.

I got my set from Tire Rack.

Last edited by thesaintusa; 01-03-2017 at 10:46 PM.
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