Marchand@HPF

Hi Guys,

My name is Marchand Müller, I am from Johannesburg, South Africa.

I am currently in a mental predicament, I would like to charge my 63, but, I have had 2 charged 63s before with many issues. I would like some input from you guys to help and assist me with my choice.

History with regards to charging:

NOTE: we are around 5250 feet above sea level with a barometric pressure of 850mbar.

1) I had a C63 2010 model, 1 of 63 limited edition, with a weistec stage 2 charger on. My issue with this car was I made nowhere near the claimed power. I had full exhaust with headers, filters, ROW airboxes standard on our cars, and the charger, I only made 460whp. I dyno'd at our local merc specialist, where 63s with headers, exhaust, pulley, meth and filters made 430-440 whp.

2) I had a 2009 C63 P30, with a weistec stage 3 charger, fully built motor, tranny, ice tank, upgraded tank pumps with lines etc. All parts were weistec. The car used to belong to a guy called George Smooth (a quick google will show a few build threads) Fuelling was always an issue although all parts were supplied by weistec, when we got fuelling "sorted" it only made 540whp @10psi (custom made pulley to compensate for altitude) and then the "bulletproof" tranny broke, upon stripping we found some parts were left out when it was built, no recorse as it was like 4 years later but the car only drove around 2k miles. Car never really worked properly nore did it make power.

SO this should explain my exploration of other suppliers.

I am currently leaning towards the magnuson charger, I do not track the car at all so 1/4mile times and trap speed does not concern me. I am simply looking for a reliable working charger making around 500whp with charger, filters and exhaust with headers.

I see the threads on the magnuson charger went quite about 6 months ago, any other feedback from guys running them long term? The weistec charged cars I had suffered badly from High IATs, the magnuson seems to be cooling better with the type of design it uses. I also like the heatshield at the bottom and much bigger radiator cooler for the coolant that cools the charger.

Has there been any tuning done for this charger with the upgraded injectors and pulley from magnuson? Has OE tuning done any of this? And I read about Eurocharged that was busy with this exact tuning, has that been finalized and with what figures?

Note: I am not trying to badmouth a specific brand, merely stating my experiences for consideration.

AMG6.3

Your numbers were so low because of your elevation. So, you can't compare a tuned car to.your supercharger given your high elevation.

You probably won't hit 500 rwhp with the other blower either.

Savage-wp

I think you should move down to Cape Town. The view is better, and we have nice thick air

Savage-wp

There are 2 Weistec charged C63's down here in Cape Town. One is stage 2, the other stage 3. They are both making decent power.

Marchand@HPF

I get you, but other charged 63s made quite a bit more than me, like 70-100whp, at my elevation, with less mods, but in saying that, surely the charger, albeit with less boost than at sea level, will surely still make at least 50-100whp more than a tuned car. I am also willing to do the injectors and smaller pulley offered from OEtuning.

Marchand@HPF

Mo did them? What are they making?

Savage-wp

You should still be able to make good power even up at Joburg. Boosted cars don't loose anywhere near the amount of power that a NA car looses at altitude. You may just need to run a different pulley to up the boost to compensate for the lower atmospheric pressure.

Savage-wp

The stage 2 one was done by Mike's Place. They are official distributors for Weistec.
I'm not sure who did the stage 3 one.
Trying to find out power for you.

chrisridebike8

For every thousand feet of elevation you lose about 3% of hp on a non-turbocharged car. Stage 2 usually makes 550 whp or so. .85 x 550 whp is 467 whp. I'm not seeing why you say you aren't making power. Sounds like you might need to accept that elevation sucks or maybe go the route of the EC TT setup as turbo cars lose about 1% per thousand feet since they have excess boost that they bleed off

AMG6.3

How rich is your tune? Graphs would be nice with fuel/air.

BLKROKT

HP Loss = (elevation x 0.03 x horsepower @ sea level)/1000

100 = (5300 * 0.03 *640) / 1000

540whp sounds about right

Marchand@HPF

My data logger said tune at 11.8

Marchand@HPF

At sea level I made 560, granted, different dyno, but still....

Marchand@HPF

I mailed them for a quote as well on a stage 2

Marchand@HPF

Also, a general question, will the charged power go up because it's a P31? Compared to a normal 63?

Marchand@HPF

Please can you provide me with a link to this conversion?

chrisridebike8

Just google horsepower loss for elevation. 5x3%=15% loss.

Marchand@HPF

Sorry, I meant for the EC TT setup. I googled that and only got vids on youtube, but no info otherwise

BLKROKT

https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...rocharged.html

Savage-wp

Turbo is definitely easier to increase the power, as you can turn the boost up to compensate for the less dense air.
But, you can change the pulley size on the charger to increase the boost as well. So assuming the charger is big enough to flow the required amount of air, he should be able to lift the boost levels to similar figures as seen with a standard kit at the coast.

Savage-wp

Not really. Once they are tuned, they all make similar numbers.
With the P31 they just open the throttle fully, and increase the timing in the stock tune.

chrisridebike8

True. I was talking relative to themselves. A SC car will still lose about 3% per thousand feet since there is no excess boost pressure bled off. There are exceptions like the S4 when in stock form. A turbo car will keep the wastegate closed to build the same boost pressure up. Area under the curve will still suffer but peak power will suffer less on a turbo car.

Cli63

I do about 600whp on the dyno with the smaller pulley that pushes about 7psi. Oe tuning said they are working with magnuson on a new belt system to push more boost (the kit has a 6 rib belt).

P31 by itself won't increase power, but having forged internals is definitely safer when you want to push more boost.

Marchand@HPF

The belt system you speak of.

Marchand@HPF

This power is with the injector upgrade? Tuning done by Jerry@OE? I know it's in your signature, but just confirming as I am speaking to Jerry currently