Magic 20 whp intake spacers
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thebug44 (02-24-2020)
#177
im getting mine today, doing th charcoal delete and the spacers, have K and N air filters and just got the tune yesterday. The tune is just unreal, with my plans on charcoal delete and the spacers I’m expecting some power, weather noticable or not I know throttle response and I’m sure a slight difference in sound is what I’ll get most from it and that’s what I want. So I’ll keep you posted on my results and my opinion. And guys, they are $180 bucks, the cost of an oil change so worth it, I’d say yes but I’ll confirm after I put them on and slide my favorite turn in second, usually I can nail it just me in the car, I love in Colorado so a mile high, but having two people in the car the turn isn’t so seamless sideways in second. SO. Fk a dyno, if I can slide this turn in second after the charcoal delete and the spacers then proof in the pudding. Weather is exactly what it is today as it was yesterday and exact same turn and same people in the car so this is a real enough test for me.
The following 2 users liked this post by BLKROKT:
Celicasaur (02-24-2020),
hachiroku (03-10-2020)
#179
No offence man, but honestly - don't open it. Send it back for a refund and if you must spend that $180 USD, try and get a lambda sensor for one side and then down the line buy another and install them together. There is zero chance of any gain whatsoever with these spacers. By all means, do the charcoal delete though. If you do the charcoal delete and spacers together, you'll think the spacers aided a little with the slight power gains, but I'm telling you - they won't contribute to anything positive. You'll benefit from more response and power down the line with brand new Bosch lambda sensors, than these spacers.
and send my that o2 sensor.
The following 3 users liked this post by skratch77:
#180
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,375
Likes: 695
12 C63BS Magno Alanite Grey, 22 X3M Brooklyn Grey, 08 BMW E93, 22 Ducati Desert Sled, John Deere 3R
Seriously though whomever is trolling as Dustin Thomas - good work bringing back this thread, I have missed it for a while!
#181
Me too man. The cars that I have are all 20-27 years old now....there's no fun forum community for them. Nobody innovates anymore and I can't possibly achieve anything new or exciting, because it's already all been done. It was fun chasing that 600hp M156 over here....but gosh, what a waste of effort doing it on a heavy W212
Funnily enough, I saw my old car on eBay recently and it sold for way more than I'd sold it for. No mention of the Kleemann cams or the custom tune that I had put in. I'll bet he has no idea of the tribulations that the car achieved in a previous life...hehe.
Funnily enough, I saw my old car on eBay recently and it sold for way more than I'd sold it for. No mention of the Kleemann cams or the custom tune that I had put in. I'll bet he has no idea of the tribulations that the car achieved in a previous life...hehe.
#182
#183
Member
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 116
Likes: 4
From: North West
12-P31 C63 Coupe- 19-GLC 63 S COUPE -18-911 TURBO S 19 AMG GTR COUPE
Well look at it this way weed is legal. Maybe you shouldn’t drive while your high or post things
While high either. I have a thought maybe grab some jack and the box and think about the S
Your posting.
While high either. I have a thought maybe grab some jack and the box and think about the S
Your posting.
#184
This is the funniest threaf ive read in awhile...
still....was hoping for some ryno results. I was kinda rooting for the Moron to have some mild gains.
Logically though intake spacers in that car is a joke of a purchase. 20 hp is a joke. Maybe 1-3 with 5 peak at most
still....was hoping for some ryno results. I was kinda rooting for the Moron to have some mild gains.
Logically though intake spacers in that car is a joke of a purchase. 20 hp is a joke. Maybe 1-3 with 5 peak at most
#185
Old thread!
Just read it for my own amusement, forumheroes with a lot of posts can post whatever they want and be trusted as the bible.
Won´t mention any names but the guys i´m talking about is often seen in performance upgrade threads talking down newcomers.
However!
Three basic rules to allow more power beeing produced:
First rule of engine breething, get rid of restrictions!
Second rule: Raise air density into cylinders!
Third rule: Engine doesn't suck air in, it creates lowpressure that atmospherepressure is equalizing.
Get rid of restrictions?
Yes anywhere in inductionsystem there might be restrictions, there is always gains from either removing the restrictions or optimizing to get lower restrictions.
Raise Air Density?
This goes hand in hand with removing restrictions but has the other hand grabbed to temperature,moisture,pressure.
Make sure your engine grabs as cold dense air as possible, and try not to heat it up when going into engine.
As engine always pumps it´s volume no matter what angle the throttles are in, the throttles only restricts the air and gives less density to fill the cylinder with.
We need to make sure we fill the plenum with as dense air we can when on full throttle, this by larger throttlebodies, optimize air passages going into the throttlebodies.
Air sucked in?
No! or yes the guy that are unaware of physics is getting away with that statement, but in a group of more well educated people they´re just a fool.
Engine uses it´s power to draw lowpressure through the intakesystem that the atmosphere pressure tries to equalize, thereby air is pushed into the engine.
Can we lower the losses for both (power consumption and less restictive system for mother nature) there is always a gain.
The spacers won´t give you 20whp, but for the price and possible gains(say 2-5whp) they are worth having a go.
And the guys reading air grams going through the air mass meters, you should not trust this 100%
To get correct reading of airdensity one need a far more advanced metering system, the airmeters are 'good enough' to get almost correct mixture(oxygensensor does the final touch).
Why you might think?
It is because the airmeters actually reads a little bit wrong with moisture in air, more moisture = less oxygen, but more moisture cools the tempsensor in airmeters and airmeter is reporting more dense air going into engine.
But no harm done, as the oxygensensors will pick this up and send info to ecu so the ecu can correct it.
So an engines 'airdemand' if reading the air grams will alter from day to day, and where you are located.
I would actually give LTFT(long term fueltrim) more focus, as this is the result of what has been going into the engine and how much fuel needed to burn it correct.
Lastly, air filters are NOT the restriction if having a good proven filter like K&N among a few others i can´t remember the name of when typing this.
And bonusquestion, where does the engine consume most air per cycle?
Bahhh i´ll answer it as i figure there are actually really few that will get this correct.:
The most air consumption per enginecycle is at peak torque(actually sliiiiighly above, say 50-100rpms, this due to frictionlosses)
But in the region of where torque peak is, there where it´s at.
This is interesting as due to effiency of intake system you can get lower air grams running into engine at 7000rpm than at peak torque rpm, say 4500rpm.
And if having this phenomena there is always gains from optimizing intake system.
Thank you!
Just read it for my own amusement, forumheroes with a lot of posts can post whatever they want and be trusted as the bible.
Won´t mention any names but the guys i´m talking about is often seen in performance upgrade threads talking down newcomers.
However!
Three basic rules to allow more power beeing produced:
First rule of engine breething, get rid of restrictions!
Second rule: Raise air density into cylinders!
Third rule: Engine doesn't suck air in, it creates lowpressure that atmospherepressure is equalizing.
Get rid of restrictions?
Yes anywhere in inductionsystem there might be restrictions, there is always gains from either removing the restrictions or optimizing to get lower restrictions.
Raise Air Density?
This goes hand in hand with removing restrictions but has the other hand grabbed to temperature,moisture,pressure.
Make sure your engine grabs as cold dense air as possible, and try not to heat it up when going into engine.
As engine always pumps it´s volume no matter what angle the throttles are in, the throttles only restricts the air and gives less density to fill the cylinder with.
We need to make sure we fill the plenum with as dense air we can when on full throttle, this by larger throttlebodies, optimize air passages going into the throttlebodies.
Air sucked in?
No! or yes the guy that are unaware of physics is getting away with that statement, but in a group of more well educated people they´re just a fool.
Engine uses it´s power to draw lowpressure through the intakesystem that the atmosphere pressure tries to equalize, thereby air is pushed into the engine.
Can we lower the losses for both (power consumption and less restictive system for mother nature) there is always a gain.
The spacers won´t give you 20whp, but for the price and possible gains(say 2-5whp) they are worth having a go.
And the guys reading air grams going through the air mass meters, you should not trust this 100%
To get correct reading of airdensity one need a far more advanced metering system, the airmeters are 'good enough' to get almost correct mixture(oxygensensor does the final touch).
Why you might think?
It is because the airmeters actually reads a little bit wrong with moisture in air, more moisture = less oxygen, but more moisture cools the tempsensor in airmeters and airmeter is reporting more dense air going into engine.
But no harm done, as the oxygensensors will pick this up and send info to ecu so the ecu can correct it.
So an engines 'airdemand' if reading the air grams will alter from day to day, and where you are located.
I would actually give LTFT(long term fueltrim) more focus, as this is the result of what has been going into the engine and how much fuel needed to burn it correct.
Lastly, air filters are NOT the restriction if having a good proven filter like K&N among a few others i can´t remember the name of when typing this.
And bonusquestion, where does the engine consume most air per cycle?
Bahhh i´ll answer it as i figure there are actually really few that will get this correct.:
The most air consumption per enginecycle is at peak torque(actually sliiiiighly above, say 50-100rpms, this due to frictionlosses)
But in the region of where torque peak is, there where it´s at.
This is interesting as due to effiency of intake system you can get lower air grams running into engine at 7000rpm than at peak torque rpm, say 4500rpm.
And if having this phenomena there is always gains from optimizing intake system.
Thank you!
Last edited by swedepat; 09-18-2021 at 03:17 AM.
The following 2 users liked this post by swedepat:
Music City Benz (04-13-2023),
Saurabh914 (09-18-2021)
#186
I agree with most of that.....but you say that the engine does not suck in ... then describe how air is pushed into the engine by atmospheric pressure trying to equalise the pressures....which is the very definition of suction.....!
#187
I just bought the lower airbox housing for the hammer supercharger kit(larger than stock). Hopefully the larger boxes do something other than take up more space in my engine. But, for the price(less than the spacers) It doesn't really worry me if they don't do anything.
#189
This and eddies, bernoullis, and coanda are important things to have back in the head trying to understand.
And it also becomes more visible how and engine breathes and how efficient the world can fill the cylinders(atmospheric pressure, 1bar absolute at sealevel)
Last edited by swedepat; 09-24-2021 at 12:14 AM.
#190
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,068
Likes: 2,849
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
It alters the way of thinking when you are trying to undertand movement of air.
This and eddies, bernoullis, and coanda are important things to have back in the head trying to understand.
And it also becomes more visible how and engine breathes and how efficient the world can fill the cylinders(atmospheric pressure, 1bar absolute at sealevel)
This and eddies, bernoullis, and coanda are important things to have back in the head trying to understand.
And it also becomes more visible how and engine breathes and how efficient the world can fill the cylinders(atmospheric pressure, 1bar absolute at sealevel)
LOL
#191
You are one of the people i´m aiming at with my posts in this thread.
Feel threatened that your high horses are just some shetlandponnys?
So porting and airflow theories are totally wrong as i had the bad luck of having an injector got stuck?
And please tell me how to tell if injectors are going bad in advance, so i can dodge the bullet next time =)
Feel threatened that your high horses are just some shetlandponnys?
So porting and airflow theories are totally wrong as i had the bad luck of having an injector got stuck?
And please tell me how to tell if injectors are going bad in advance, so i can dodge the bullet next time =)
Last edited by amdeutsch; 09-25-2021 at 08:39 AM.
#192
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,068
Likes: 2,849
From: Los Angeles
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
You are one of the people i´m aiming at with my posts in this thread.
Feel threatened that your high horses are just some shetlandponnys?
So porting and airflow theories are totally wrong as i had the bad luck of having an injector got stuck?
And please tell me how to tell if injectors are going bad in advance, so i can dodge the bullet next time =)
Feel threatened that your high horses are just some shetlandponnys?
So porting and airflow theories are totally wrong as i had the bad luck of having an injector got stuck?
And please tell me how to tell if injectors are going bad in advance, so i can dodge the bullet next time =)
Worst of luck getting your shïtty car running again. And yeah, injectors are a standard maintenance item.
Last edited by amdeutsch; 09-25-2021 at 08:39 AM.
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BLKROKT (03-07-2023)
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BLKROKT (03-07-2023)