Hi guys,

Curious as to what issues might be encountered swapping out an existing M156 (W211 E63) and replacing it with one from a C or ML-chassis?

Do the various M156 engines have any differences in oil pan? Engine mounts/crossmembers? Harness (just plug'n'play or a headache of a splice job)? Anything else?

M156 E's are very rare here, and to source a donor engine it will almost certainly have to come from a C or ML. Hoping it is a relatively straight-forward approach, however I am bracing myself for it to be anything but.

*posted this in the C-class forum, but meant to post here. Plenty more C63 owners than E63, so figured more wiser heads here!*

Any help or advice would be much appreciated!

 

Have you thought about swapping it with the M156 from the SLS?

 

That would be awesome, given the extra features of the SLS engine, but do these motors ever come up for sale? I'd imagine they'd be very scarce and hard to come by, no?

 

Great idea. Put an M159 in it. Brilliant really. An engine worth easily 8x more than the car it’s going in. You guys must be scientists.

OP, you need an oil pan. That should be it.

 

Thanks BLKROKT. Can you see any foreseeable issues with running the E63 wiring harness on the C63 motor?

 

I was trying to be humorous when I said that, and yes I am a scientist.

 

What kind of scientist?

 

Not really. Nothing that can’t be fixed fairly easily. All sensors and wiring should be like 99% right if you’re transplanting from roughly the same year.

 

what’s humor?? blkrokt can not compute


op you’ll probably find yourself having to cross reference and comparing from your current to the new. Transplanting/replacing missing pieces on the new m156 with your current one when you see differences.

 

Cheers for all the replies fellas. Perhaps I should explain a bit more about my current predicament:

Car was showing a check engine light and had a slight misfire that came out of nowhere a few weeks back while just cruising along. Temps etc all good, just had a very very slight misfire. Turned it off and started up again - misfire gone, CEL gone, car was purring along nicely. Then, about 2 minutes later, slight misfire returns with CEL. Got it home (literally around the block). Pulled all the plugs out; all good condition, not wet at all. Oil level good, oil clean. Coolant fine. Thought perhaps it might be a dodgy coilpack or a spark issue; and intended to get it down to a mechanic in town to pull the codes.

However, once I put all the car back together, and took it for a drive it was once again perfect. The CEL was still there (I presumed it was a "hard" code at this point and simply needed to be cleared). Drove the car around for 15 mins - all temps, oil, coolant, power etc all tip-top and no issues at all.

Started it up again on Friday to run into town to a mechanics and get the code checked. Well...pulled over halfway into town and took a phone call. While idling I noticed the idle slowly, almost imperceptibly, got slightly rougher. I ended my call, pulled out onto the road and accelerated, and it had a misfire, this one a bit worse than before. I was literally only 200m from the corner of the next street, and then that would have been 400m to the workshop. I got to the corner, and then all hell broke loose - massive clouds of smoke out the exhaust, huge drop in power and massive roughness to the idle/running of the car. I literally coasted around the corner, pulled into a side street and shut it off. Checked the oil - and it was a chocolate milkshake

I have been reading up all about the headbolt issues and other dramas with these engines. As it was 5pm Friday when the car got to the workshop (on a flatbed tow truck), they had no chance to check it out but will be inspecting it tomorrow and letting me know. They did start it in the workshop, so it is starting up (good it isn't hydrolocked) but I am bracing myself for a full headbolt & head gasket replacement at the very least. And if this is the course of action, I will definitely be going for the revised headbolts, SLS lifter upgrade and perhaps a set of new cams if damaged in any way (as they were getting slightly noisy). Whatever is needed to make it bulletproof for the future. If the price difference isn't too great, I may opt for VRP aftermarket cams with higher lift/duration as a bit of an upgrade whilst at it.

I have a third party insurer with the car (given to me from the dealer when I bought it last year) so they will cover some of the costs. However if a used engine works out cheaper than doing repairs on this current engine, then I am sure they will steer me to the cheaper option. I found a 2011 C63 motor with 35,000kms for sale here locally from a private seller for $8k AUD. All other motors I can find are $10k plus with much higher kms (from junkyards). Hence my questions regarding swapping that motor into my 2007 W211.

 

Sorry to hear, that sucks. It’s gonna be close because your heads are going to have to come off. With labor it should be under $10k if the engine isn’t damaged beyond the headbolts. That’s probably less than replacing the engine unless you get a screaming deal on one.

 

This one for $8k has been up for sale since August last year. The seller updated the ad end of May this year ( I am guessing to lower the price) and states that any reasonable offer would be considered. They have service books/records for the vehicle it came out of (2011 C63) so it definitely sounds like a legitimate seller and not some junkyard dog engine they have no knowledge of.

Given the low volume of AMG cars sold here in Australia, I highly doubt people are banging down his door to purchase the engine. Probably worth offering $6k and see if they'll take it.

Any idea what $$ would be involved with a shop to remove and replace the motor, together with other ancillaries such as new coolant/radiator service, plugs, and other misc items needed for a properly done engine swap? I am guessing it will run into the several thousands at the least.

At least a 2011 should be quite a robust motor with the revised headbolts!

 

My take is that it's ridiculously reasonably priced given the mileage, the provenance and market trends for transplant-worthy M156's. My advice is to jump on it. I was looking for a good motor for a project a few years back and was willing to pay 6k USD but didn't find the right one and prices were climbing back then. Your prices are way higher to begin with and 8k AUD works out to 5.5k USD. A bargain all things considered if as advertised IMO.

 

Make sure that 2011 motor isn't a early headbolt engine.
Check the engine number is greater than ending in #60658.

 

I agree, or at least it has the upgraded bolts already changed. Need to pull the valve cover to see inside to be sure IMO

 

I had blown my motor on C63, Got a replacement from a E63 which had crashed like a mustang (Pole Wrapped).
Was a direct fit with wiring etc no issues so I presume a C Class doner will fit perfectly with no issues. As for ML63, Oil Pan
as mentioned.

 

😂😂 love your sarcasm since day one. I can only imagine how many users get their butt hurt over it.

Goodluck OP. Sucks to see the headbolts give out on you, presumingly.

 

Having suffered a somewhat similar catastrophe to yours, I decide to join the forum to see if I could offer you some insight into what options you might have.
An engine swap was not an option for me as I did not want to lose all the P31 goodies I had with my car - it had to be rebuilt.
Cam lifters were stuffed. Likewise the inlet cam adjusters and the camshafts.
I took the opportunity to replace the cam lifters with the ones from the SLS AMG -$1800 sourced online, twice the price if supplied by an MB workshop
Cam adjusters were $2000 each, but there's someone on eBay selling recon ones for around $1100 each.
New camshafts were quoted as $2000 each. I sent mine to Clive Cams in Victoria to be reground at $200 a pop. You should google Clive Stenlake's bio, there's nothing he doesn't know about camshafts, having done work for the likes of Glenn Seton and Peter Brock. He did the developmental work on the Pacer engines.
The final bill was around $8000. I've tracked the car twice since, and I'm one happy little vegemite! It's bullet-proof!

 

Hi Aus C63,

Thanks for the tip on the local camshaft guru! Were your cams damaged/scored as they often do due to the 'soft' metal MB used? And if so, was just a simple re-grind all that was required? Do you know if Clive Cams can grind to a different cam profile (i.e. higher lift and/or duration) or just purely stock?

You'll have to let me know who in Victoria did all the work on reassembling your heads, and was that $8000 in parts alone? If so, how much did labour run up to?

Will definitely be hunting down adjusters and SLS lifters to go back into the car too.

 

Hi Aussie E63,
I'm in Perth actually. Where are you?
The workshop I used sent the cams to Clive Cams on my instruction. I'm kicking myself for the missed opportunity cos the cams were damaged to the point where they needed metal being added before re-grinding, and I could have had a more aggressive profile done. Then again, the car's already running 520bhp and 650nm, and on the track the brakes and suspension have not proven equal to the task. But I digress.
The total bill was $8000.
Here's the link to Clive Cams https://www.clivecams.com.au/
Lifters were a Weistec item.
Happy to help.

 

I am in Sale (Vic) at the moment, but grew up in Perth. With regards to the more aggressive profile being done on the cams, did you investigate into what sort of mapping (and by whom) could be done to get the most of a different cam profile? Can all that be exploited via the standard ECU or would it require switching to a Motec/Haltech for instance?

Good to know Weistec stock the SLS lifters! Was it a pretty quick turnaround via postage from the States to your door?

 

I suspect Clive Cams would be able to make some recommendations re cam profiles.
I went to Evolve Technic for a Stage 1 chip tune plus air filter. Dynoed at 404kW and 650nm. Top speed raised from 250kmh to 320kmh. $2000. They're hq'd in Victoria. Here's the link
www.evolve-technik.com.au
I bought the Weistec-branded cam lifters via Vivid Racing. Same price. Took 2 weeks which is a long time in my experience. I think Weistec manufacture their own stuff.
Cheeers.

 

Update: spoke to the workshop and they pulled the plugs and 7 out of 8 are wet with coolant sludge. Given it's unlikely that head gaskets and/or head bolts would have ruptured simultaneously on both cylinder banks, they believe the water/oil cooler (sandwiched in the valley between the two cylinder banks) has likely ruptured.

The big fear now is if the bearings have been washed with glycol...which AFAIK won't be evident until they get fresh oil in and start the motor again. Or, may surface with some bottom end knock months from now....sleepless nights ahead 🙁

Genuinely considering swapping to a C63 donor motor, or just trading it in with cash on top for a 2011 or newer C63.

 

Wow I feel your pain! Difficult decisions to take. If it was mine, I would opt for a replacement engine, but that's just me. I cherish my AMG'S. My Grandma C43 has sprung a leak at the radiator. New one ordered. The 99' factory original has lived a good life until now IMO

 

Weistec stocks/resells OE Mercedes lifters. The only non-OE Mercedes option I ever came across are INA lifters, which is the company that manufactures them for Mercedes. AFAIK, there is no aftermarket option for lifters and I can't imagine why anyone would ever bother with one in the first place.