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This may not be a popular thread as I know lots of the folks here daily their c63 and don't track it, but for the few who use trailers occasionally, regularly or always I would like to see how you are setup to pull them.
I plan to keep my car fully streetable but also plan to tow it to a few different types of events.
I am having a trailer built now that should be delivered in a few weeks. I plan to use e-tracks with over-the-wheel straps as the main tie downs and hand tight, crossed, through-the-wheel straps on the trailer D-rings just as backup and to keep car from moving sideways on the trailer during an "unexpected event".
Even on coilovers these cars don't strike me as particularly low (compared to lowered vettes, etc) so it shouldn't require extensive thought in terms of loading or unloading, correct? I don't have or plan for any lower fascia or front lip add-ons.
Thx for any input or participation
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 8, 2021 at 03:42 PM.
Just my opinion but you may be over-thinking this. Back when I had a dedicated race car and trailer I would just take and run ratcheting tie-down straps through each wheel to a built-in tie down for each corner of the car. The car never moved front-back or side-side because the tension at all 4 corners. Unless you're running cheap straps you should be fine.
Never hurts to ask, you never know what you will learn that you haven't thought of. For the close to home tracks i plan to stick with my over the tire straps as they can't damage the wheels. They also have wheel chocks with them that mount in the e-tracks. Makes it simple to pull car up to exact same well-balanced spot every time and is a good help in case of a panic stop. Most people I know using through the wheel as their main or only tie downs have to crank them down pretty hard as they tend to ride up the wheel to the next spoke and sometimes loosen up a little. Just heard this from a friend who tows his Porsche this way. Some of the events are hillclimbs in the mtns where I will be trailering through several states and up and down mountain roads, so through the wheel backups are cheap insurance, but I wouldn't crank them really tight.
I used to.use chassis tie down points cross strapped to D-rings on my dedicated hillclimber, but without that option I think I prefer over tire to through wheel for the straps under tension.
something about through wheel cranked down tight just doesn't seem like the best option to me, especially after paying to powdercoat wheels and ceramic coat them for brake dust.
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 8, 2021 at 05:37 PM.
Never hurts to ask, you never know what you will learn that you haven't thought of. For the close to home tracks i plan to stick with my over the tire straps as they can't damage the wheels. They also have wheel chocks with them that mount in the e-tracks. Makes it simple to pull car up to exact same well-balanced spot every time and is a good help in case of a panic stop. Most people I know using through the wheel as their main or only tie downs have to crank them down pretty hard as they tend to ride up the wheel to the next spoke and sometimes loosen up a little. Just heard this from a friend who tows his Porsche this way. Some of the events are hillclimbs in the mtns where I will be trailering through several states and up and down mountain roads, so through the wheel backups are cheap insurance, but I wouldn't crank them really tight.
I used to.use chassis tie down points cross strapped to D-rings on my dedicated hillclimber, but without that option I think I prefer over tire to through wheel for the straps under tension.
something about through wheel cranked down tight just doesn't seem like the best option to me, especially after paying to powdercoat wheels and ceramic coat them for brake dust.
Slightly different perspective because mine was a dedicated race car. If the wheels got scuffed up, scratched, etc, I didn't care because that would probably be the least of the damage that weekend, haha. If you're really worried about damaging the finish on the wheels, why not put something through the spoke where the straps connect to the wheel to protect it, something simple like a towel to prevent direct contact. Just throwing thoughts out there.
I appreciate it. You never know when someone has useful model specific tricks for this or that.
Towels and things tend to blow around and move at highway speeds for hundreds of miles. i have even seen the fabric tear after and end gets loose and whips for 500 miles. (It is an open trailer)
Plus I have 3 weeks before trailer is done so why not talk through it with guys that may have already towed these cars.
Door height should open over the fenders for easy in/out of car at stock ride height judging by the measurements, but coilovers should arrive by March so fenders are removable so after coilovers doors should still open with a fender off. Just makes things simpler.
I kind of like this setup since the trailer has etracks. No wheel contact at all.
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 8, 2021 at 06:13 PM.
No worries. That's what this forum is for, to get opinions and options. I like the setup in the picture above. My trailer was enclosed so I didn't have to worry about wind and such but that setup looks like it should be sufficient.
There's no chassis slots for t-hooks on this car so I'd say e-track is the way to go. If you're at OEM ride height it's easy to slip a tire basket over your front wheels as well.
I used a U-Haul Auto Transport all last season and it worked great which uses a tire basket. You don't even secure the rear on it. It just has a safety chain that I loop through a hole in the subframe behind the differential so it doesn't go flying off the trailer in a crash. I'd use the same point for rear straps on a custom trailer.
Jasanoff, thank you. good info on the subframe. I drove my car to its first two track events but I figure even if something cheap breaks to keep me from driving home, I don't want to spend 30 min to 2.5hrs in a small AAA truck cab with a stranger during a pandemic to get home lol. Plus I plan to start traveling a bit further to Daytona and Homestead Miami for their road courses, plus out of state for some hillclimbs.
the trailer will be used for a few things but mainly my car so I had the etrack spaced to split the difference between the front and rear track width on the c63.
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 8, 2021 at 09:34 PM.
Jasanoff, thank you. good info on the subframe. I drove my car to its first two track events but I figure even if something cheap breaks to keep me from driving home, I don't want to spend 30 min to 2.5hrs in a small AAA truck cab with a stranger during a pandemic to get home lol.
the trailer will be used for a few things but mainly my car so I had the etrack spaced to split the difference between the front and rear track width on the c63.
What trailer did you get? Aluminum? drop axle?
I spec'ed out a few aluminum options but since the Uhaul rental is so cheap I didn't think it was worth the expense. The only downfall is being heavy at ~2200lbs.
I spec'ed out a few aluminum options but since the Uhaul rental is so cheap I didn't think it was worth the expense. The only downfall is being heavy at ~2200lbs.
it's aluminum (about 1850lbs) and quite high spec
So it is similar to this but with 3inch deck lift, dovetail, E-tracks, 2 front box doors, 2 spares, upgraded tires, sidewinder jacks, winch etc.
Damn, that is a nice trailer.
What does something like that retail for in the States
idk, but i am sure you can Google it. It's being fabricated in Oklahoma where i have an interest in a livestock brokerage so i just traded 2 black Angus steer and 4 barbados blackberry sheep to a member of the Shipman family for it.
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 9, 2021 at 01:04 PM.
I usually tow one of three race cars (not a C63) and also use ratcheting tie-down straps through each wheel. Far more secure than the basket that just goes over the front wheels if you're going someplace that has a lot of twisties and hills along the way. I remember a deer jumping out in front of the ML when I was towing the 924 to Calabogie one night and had to hammer on the brakes. Despite the fact that 11000 lbs do not stop on a dime, I am certain that if the car had not been properly secured with ratcheting tie-down straps through the wheels, it would have ended up inside or possibly on top of the SUV. I think it really depends on WHERE you're towing it... I would have no reservations using a rental U-HAUL with the tire baskets going to Mosport or even Watkins Glen (mostly highway and flat), but I would never attempt it going to Calabogie because of the twisty roads, hills and wildlife.
Thx. It's definitely those unexpected events we are planning for. I think I am going with over tire straps like in the picture posted above but on ALL 4 corners to make use of the e-tracks built in to the trailer. Each strap is 3 times stronger than the corner weight of the car, and the kit comes with front wheel chocks that also mount in the etrack to help keep the car in place during a panic stop. i might run a safety strap through the subframe too like Jasonoff mentiined. Most of my tows will be flat wide Florida roads less than 3hrs away but there will.be some out of state mountain trips. I will.keep some extra straps on hand in case it needs more securing for those trips.
I used to have a hillclimber corvette c5 similar to that.
Last edited by Dr.Speedfellow; Jan 9, 2021 at 02:48 PM.
Far more secure than the basket that just goes over the front wheels if you're going someplace that has a lot of twisties and hills along the way.
Not disputing this, just attempting to understand the comment.
If the front tires are secured to the deck with basket straps. As in, they are NOT moving in any direction when done properly. Then, the rear subframe is cinched back to 2 anchor points. How is that less secure than straps through the wheels?
Not disputing this, just attempting to understand the comment.
If the front tires are secured to the deck with basket straps. As in, they are NOT moving in any direction when done properly. Then, the rear subframe is cinched back to 2 anchor points. How is that less secure than straps through the wheels?
It unfortunately doesn't prevent the car from moving side to side (especially at the back but also at the front), and depending on how hard you tie it down on the rear subframe, it compresses the rear suspension on the car to the point where it can bottom out when you're going over inevitable bumps on the road and possibly even knock the alignment off. I remember towing the Civic to the Mosport DDT for a shakedown on a U-HAUL, and at one point had to pull off the 401 as the car had shifted about 18" to the side (force of habit - I checked the rearview mirror and the car was basically sitting sideways). It was a solid wood deck flatbed trailer and considerably larger than the car itself which may have contributed to it shifting around, but both the front and the back were definitely dancing around, the back more than the front. After we yanked down on the chain at the back to the point where the already lowered and super-stiff suspension was even more compressed, we carried on for the last 30 minutes of the journey. It had again moved by the time we got to unload it in the DDT parking lot, and after I drove the car on the track I noticed the rear wasn't behaving as expected. Doing a trackside alignment (we have Longacre toe-in measurement plates and the racing camber/caster "level" tools) showed that the camber and toe on one of the rear wheels were both off by a considerable amount, and it was properly aligned in the shop the evening before before it got loaded on the trailer.
Could putting force on the wheel itself toward a D-ring also potentially affect the alignment? Even if you're pulling straight back in the rear and forward in the front?
I haven't had any issues with the U-haul car hauler and hopefully I don't in the future either.
In theory yes, but in practice it would be next to impossible. After all, the wheels themselves are exposed to considerably higher forces with the car driving, braking or cornering. With slicks our data logger shows we're consistently pulling 1.5 to 1.6 Gs lateral and/or longitudinal under braking - and that's just mechanical grip without running any aero. That means that the two loaded wheels are supporting at least 1.6x the mass of the car front to back or sideways without affecting the alignment. On a 2,800 lb car including driver and fuel, that's a weight of 4,500 lbs that is regularly exerted on the two loaded wheels. I highly doubt that you could strap the car down with ratchet straps to anywhere near that. Even under panic braking with the tow rig, the most you could get with street tires on the SUV and trailer is under 0.5 Gs, and laterally maybe half of that before you flip the trailer.
In theory yes, but in practice it would be next to impossible. After all, the wheels themselves are exposed to considerably higher forces with the car driving, braking or cornering
Yeah it makes sense for sure. When you read about how people strap cars down it's more opinionated than oil threads lol.
So you figure your previous strap technique that pulled down on the suspension (which I would NEVER do) force adjusted a toe arm because it bottomed out over bumps? My comment previously about using the rear subframe back to D-ring anchors would have them far enough away to not pull down on it very much.
I am still not grasping how a tire basket wouldn't prevent side to side movement. The U-haul setup deforms the tire when cinched down so it's putting a lot of pressure down to the deck. The through wheel technique is not pressing the tire into the deck at all so I would think there would be more potential of side to side movement unless you are crossing the straps?
If I do eventually get my own trailer, I will have to decide how to strap this thing down properly.
How much clearance do you have from the bumper and front of the trailer? Im planning to rent Uhaul trailers for next year, but it seems pretty tight up front (from prev experience towing regular cars with it).
Originally Posted by Jasonoff
There's no chassis slots for t-hooks on this car so I'd say e-track is the way to go. If you're at OEM ride height it's easy to slip a tire basket over your front wheels as well.
I used a U-Haul Auto Transport all last season and it worked great which uses a tire basket. You don't even secure the rear on it. It just has a safety chain that I loop through a hole in the subframe behind the differential so it doesn't go flying off the trailer in a crash. I'd use the same point for rear straps on a custom trailer.
How much clearance do you have from the bumper and front of the trailer? Im planning to rent Uhaul trailers for next year, but it seems pretty tight up front (from prev experience towing regular cars with it).
I drive up on a 2x8 in the front so it clears the tire stop lip. It already had enough clearance as is at the ride height I have set which is basically stock height.
You just have to be careful of the break over angle since the ramps aren't very long.
Last edited by Jasonoff; Jan 11, 2021 at 08:33 AM.
There's no chassis slots for t-hooks on this car so I'd say e-track is the way to go. If you're at OEM ride height it's easy to slip a tire basket over your front wheels as well.
I used a U-Haul Auto Transport all last season and it worked great which uses a tire basket. You don't even secure the rear on it. It just has a safety chain that I loop through a hole in the subframe behind the differential so it doesn't go flying off the trailer in a crash. I'd use the same point for rear straps on a custom trailer.
off topic but what is the towing capacity of your jeep? Looks awesome btw. Been debating if I should start towing with my lx470
That U-Haul trailer looks ~20 years ahead of the one we had (steel frame with flatbed wood deck).
I suspect the issue in part may have been caused by the relative widths of the trailer and the car as the front baskets were basically pulling the front wheels away from the car, and also with the EG/EK Civic unequal length non parralel link double wishbone suspension on both ends. While this design makes them very suitable for track use because of the resulting camber change when you laterally load it, it also pulls in the unloaded wheel on the opposite side so once you compress both sides of the suspension by pulling the car down on the rear subframe while it is stationary, you are introducing opposing forces into the suspension components that it would never encounter during road use. It could certainly be something that's an issue only with this specific suspension design.
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