UK Dealer Ship Issue - Advice Needed.
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Newbie
Joined: Sep 2018
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C63s
UK Dealer Ship Issue - Advice Needed.
Hi
So in 2017 October I bought a nearly new C63s from a UK Dealer Mercedes Benz Chelsea, it was a quick purchase about 3 emails and 2 phone calls and a collection visit to the dealership I paid 60k for the car and it had 5k miles on it. (not a cheap price)
Dean Woodley the "sales executive" sold us the car and was asked the history of it. I was told it was owned by Mercedes previously and driven by the manager, the car had been involved in no previous accidents and was immaculate.
The car had the options I was looking for basically every option was available for immediate collection so I bought it safe in the knowledge I had gone to a Mercedes Dealer.
This car currently has 8k miles on it so its hardly driven as its not my main car its more of a project car when I finally get time to fit items I have bought (extensive carbon parts inside and out, number plate c63s amg and at a later date the plan was to change the turbos etc)
After about 3 weeks of owning the car, I was scrolling through youtube and shockingly enough its on top gear and other car review videos, getting thrashed about which is what you would expect in a car review.
I checked the log book and it had Mercedes Benz Media on the log book as the previous owner. The car had many issues (Most of the are common things with the w205 range as I own another C class I knew it would go in for warranty repairs etc)
My previous c class https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...e-c-class.html (forgot my password to that account) Not going into detail about how many times that c class which was one of the first in the UK had went in for warranty issues at least 15 times.
On the amg one of the main issues not including all the other bits most of us amg owners have had fixed, was that the front bumper was aligning up poorly.
I sent Dean a email and a few calls very unhelpful, so I decided to complain to MBUK that I was not told the history of the car and would not have bought the car if I had known its history and I outlined some of the more pressing issues such as the front bumper. MBUK basically told me to go away.
Obviously I was angry but I bit my tongue and took the issue on the chin, fast forward to now. I had spent a lot of money accumulating the parts I wanted to add to the car, and the year is flying by so I wanted to get stuff fitted so I can enjoy the car.
The car needed a service and was due for a few recalls and all the problems you can think of for warranty repairs including the front bumper.
Mercedes typically has crappy service after going to my local dealership at 8:30am waiting around for them to take the keys (1 hour wait absolute **** take) I get a call stating they wanted to keep the car till tomorrow to fix the issues.
But they will not fix the front bumper as its not covered in warranty, I was like yes it is having the back bumper realigned on my other c class, he then goes onto tell me how there is over spray and screw driver marks all over the inside of the bumper area and even on the door sill (not sure exactly where will have to go and find out tomorrow) He was basically saying it had been involved in a accident.
So now I am in a situation where I own a accident damaged C63s that was not owned by the "manager" and was in fact thrashed about undoubtedly will have a lot more problems later on in life.
I own the car outright and bought it without credit as I was planing on keeping it. Its funny I did tell myself I wont buy another Mercedes after the last c class which had and still has problems ( I also bought that outright and kept it).
Its not like I bought a car from the dealer which they got from someone random, I bought it from the dealer who owned the car therefore knew all the issues that the car had yet did not disclose it to me.
Sorry for the rant wanted to get it off my chest.
The question is what do I do now?
Anyway thanks for reading!
So in 2017 October I bought a nearly new C63s from a UK Dealer Mercedes Benz Chelsea, it was a quick purchase about 3 emails and 2 phone calls and a collection visit to the dealership I paid 60k for the car and it had 5k miles on it. (not a cheap price)
Dean Woodley the "sales executive" sold us the car and was asked the history of it. I was told it was owned by Mercedes previously and driven by the manager, the car had been involved in no previous accidents and was immaculate.
The car had the options I was looking for basically every option was available for immediate collection so I bought it safe in the knowledge I had gone to a Mercedes Dealer.
This car currently has 8k miles on it so its hardly driven as its not my main car its more of a project car when I finally get time to fit items I have bought (extensive carbon parts inside and out, number plate c63s amg and at a later date the plan was to change the turbos etc)
After about 3 weeks of owning the car, I was scrolling through youtube and shockingly enough its on top gear and other car review videos, getting thrashed about which is what you would expect in a car review.
I checked the log book and it had Mercedes Benz Media on the log book as the previous owner. The car had many issues (Most of the are common things with the w205 range as I own another C class I knew it would go in for warranty repairs etc)
My previous c class https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...e-c-class.html (forgot my password to that account) Not going into detail about how many times that c class which was one of the first in the UK had went in for warranty issues at least 15 times.
On the amg one of the main issues not including all the other bits most of us amg owners have had fixed, was that the front bumper was aligning up poorly.
I sent Dean a email and a few calls very unhelpful, so I decided to complain to MBUK that I was not told the history of the car and would not have bought the car if I had known its history and I outlined some of the more pressing issues such as the front bumper. MBUK basically told me to go away.
Obviously I was angry but I bit my tongue and took the issue on the chin, fast forward to now. I had spent a lot of money accumulating the parts I wanted to add to the car, and the year is flying by so I wanted to get stuff fitted so I can enjoy the car.
The car needed a service and was due for a few recalls and all the problems you can think of for warranty repairs including the front bumper.
Mercedes typically has crappy service after going to my local dealership at 8:30am waiting around for them to take the keys (1 hour wait absolute **** take) I get a call stating they wanted to keep the car till tomorrow to fix the issues.
But they will not fix the front bumper as its not covered in warranty, I was like yes it is having the back bumper realigned on my other c class, he then goes onto tell me how there is over spray and screw driver marks all over the inside of the bumper area and even on the door sill (not sure exactly where will have to go and find out tomorrow) He was basically saying it had been involved in a accident.
So now I am in a situation where I own a accident damaged C63s that was not owned by the "manager" and was in fact thrashed about undoubtedly will have a lot more problems later on in life.
I own the car outright and bought it without credit as I was planing on keeping it. Its funny I did tell myself I wont buy another Mercedes after the last c class which had and still has problems ( I also bought that outright and kept it).
Its not like I bought a car from the dealer which they got from someone random, I bought it from the dealer who owned the car therefore knew all the issues that the car had yet did not disclose it to me.
Sorry for the rant wanted to get it off my chest.
The question is what do I do now?
Anyway thanks for reading!
Last edited by Bluepie; Sep 17, 2018 at 04:08 PM.
Super Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 784
Likes: 135
From: UK
2021 C63S coupe
Oh dear. I feel sorry for you.
As above explore what redress is available to you.
Reminds meof my of a Clio 16V I bought in 1991. I also thought it was an ex demo until
I saw it featuring in one of AutoCar's publication, another Press car.
Worst car I ever owned. It was in the workshop every month, in the end I got Renault Croydon, the dealer,
to buy it back, naturally I lost some money due to mileage covered.
Even more painful when you pay outright.
As above explore what redress is available to you.
Reminds meof my of a Clio 16V I bought in 1991. I also thought it was an ex demo until
I saw it featuring in one of AutoCar's publication, another Press car.
Worst car I ever owned. It was in the workshop every month, in the end I got Renault Croydon, the dealer,
to buy it back, naturally I lost some money due to mileage covered.
Even more painful when you pay outright.
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
C Class
Your situation has some similarities to an issue I had recently - namely bumper alignment on a C63 W205 that the dealer was unable to resolved. First and foremost I would say dont panic and get the car to an indy body shop to assess it, they will tell you if there is anything sinister or if there is not too much to worry about.
The issue I had although minor I realised after speaking to different people that it is definitely not uncommon for cars to have had knocks and bumps OR other genuine reasons for the bumper to be removed i.e. warranty work / replacment of parts/ sensors and it is definitely not unreasonable that a main dealer might be selling a car that has had a small bump at some time and the bumper is slightly out of alignment. Unfortunately for all the multi point checks the manufacturers shout about I now realise that they are likely not to the detail as some of us would like.
I am curious though as you implied the bumper alignment issue is common to AMG owners and certainly when I started investigating I could not find any other people having the same issue?
Your issue is complicated because of the time frames however get an independent review first before you do anything. Dependent on what comes back you could then decide your next steps - which might be just accept it and move on OR go back to the original dealer and see what they say. I was quoted 3hrs to remove the front bumer and refit with a view to trying to resolve the alignment. Either way your going to want to find out IF it can be re-aligned. Strictly speaking MB are right to some degree that it is not a warranty issue.
On the sales piece. I have found this before that a sales person will quote that the car was owned by MB. It is slightly misleading but only really psychologically because I think we as customers then assume the car has been properly and lovingly cared for and driven by people MB trusts. MB own lots of cars be it for whatever reasons and so sadly I think a lot of us will fall for this.
It is worth adding - given how long you have had the car have you been happy with it issues aside? Does it drive straight etc ? or Is it just the bumper alignment and knowing the previous history that has alarmed you? It did only have 5k on it when you bought it and yes it might have suffered a bit more than usual in those 5k miles. The bumper alighnment is frustrating and in some ways unacceptable but it depends to what extent and the reasons for it.
Basically get it checked first and then decide next steps :-)
The issue I had although minor I realised after speaking to different people that it is definitely not uncommon for cars to have had knocks and bumps OR other genuine reasons for the bumper to be removed i.e. warranty work / replacment of parts/ sensors and it is definitely not unreasonable that a main dealer might be selling a car that has had a small bump at some time and the bumper is slightly out of alignment. Unfortunately for all the multi point checks the manufacturers shout about I now realise that they are likely not to the detail as some of us would like.
I am curious though as you implied the bumper alignment issue is common to AMG owners and certainly when I started investigating I could not find any other people having the same issue?
Your issue is complicated because of the time frames however get an independent review first before you do anything. Dependent on what comes back you could then decide your next steps - which might be just accept it and move on OR go back to the original dealer and see what they say. I was quoted 3hrs to remove the front bumer and refit with a view to trying to resolve the alignment. Either way your going to want to find out IF it can be re-aligned. Strictly speaking MB are right to some degree that it is not a warranty issue.
On the sales piece. I have found this before that a sales person will quote that the car was owned by MB. It is slightly misleading but only really psychologically because I think we as customers then assume the car has been properly and lovingly cared for and driven by people MB trusts. MB own lots of cars be it for whatever reasons and so sadly I think a lot of us will fall for this.
It is worth adding - given how long you have had the car have you been happy with it issues aside? Does it drive straight etc ? or Is it just the bumper alignment and knowing the previous history that has alarmed you? It did only have 5k on it when you bought it and yes it might have suffered a bit more than usual in those 5k miles. The bumper alighnment is frustrating and in some ways unacceptable but it depends to what extent and the reasons for it.
Basically get it checked first and then decide next steps :-)
Member
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 197
Likes: 16
From: SURREY, UK
W212E63s[rwd sold]W211E63[sold] 645ci [sold]2018 C63s Estate[sold], 2017 gla 45 [Sold] E46m3 [sold]
sorry to hear a dealership has pulled a fast one over you. In those email exchanges, is the history of the car discussed at all, or was this a verbal conversation?
Any hard evidence you have will help your case.
I wouldnt say merc have much of a case to answer for regarding the bumper misalignment per se.
I recommend you start here:
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...d-compensation
essentially your line of argument can be that the vehicle being used by multiple car reviewers falls within the mis-selling scandals relating to car hire firms that claim a car had one owner yet has been driven by multiple users. There are some similar attributes in terms of your experience vs the widely on first glance.
You have the video evidence of the vehicle with that number plate featuring on youtube. Start there. Take screenshots and build up a case in writing straight to MBUK officially. Essentially, you have been mis-sold the vehicle. I would ignore the bumper completely, you could have a strong mis-selling case on your hands. Either go for compensation, or force them to take the car back.
Any hard evidence you have will help your case.
I wouldnt say merc have much of a case to answer for regarding the bumper misalignment per se.
I recommend you start here:
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...d-compensation
essentially your line of argument can be that the vehicle being used by multiple car reviewers falls within the mis-selling scandals relating to car hire firms that claim a car had one owner yet has been driven by multiple users. There are some similar attributes in terms of your experience vs the widely on first glance.
You have the video evidence of the vehicle with that number plate featuring on youtube. Start there. Take screenshots and build up a case in writing straight to MBUK officially. Essentially, you have been mis-sold the vehicle. I would ignore the bumper completely, you could have a strong mis-selling case on your hands. Either go for compensation, or force them to take the car back.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
C63s
Hi thanks for the reply's much appreciated.
I have spoke to a solicitor now, going to contact both mbuk and the dealer one more time before handing it over to the solicitors.
@96Spec I am not implying the bumper is a common problem for w205 amg owners.
It is a problem on my car + the other common problems.
Here's a list of some of the issues I initially added to the emails to mbuk (common problems+ the bumper)
1. The front bumper having a larger gap on one side. Its quite a obvious gap.
2. Panoramic roof rattle
3. Door led flicker
4. The Passenger side door speaker
5. Front dash rattle
6. Black night pack trim around window .
7. Transmission jolting
8. Drivers door frame top vibrating (loud when its winter)
9. Issues with the touch pad
10. Wind noise worse then my other c lass.
I could go on those issue were noticed and sent over to mbuk in the first emails we exchanged withing a few weeks off ownership so most likely more issues as the car is driven will come to my attention.
Anyway I went to my local dealer to find out why they wont repair the bumper alignment.
The technician took me around the car and pointed out the paint thickness, over spray,masking marks, screwdriver marks. Basically telling me the entire front end has been resprayed and blended into the sides.
This is why I mention the front bumper issue specifically the alignment itself is not a massive problem, I always thought the one trip to the dealer they would fix it.
The issue is once they looked at the front bumper it has now come to light the car was in the words of the local Mercedes technician involved in a "significant" accident and to sort the bumper alignment out they will have to take off a lot more the front bumper.
So when I originally confronted MBUK and the dealer in Chelsea they where basically like oh its nothing to worry about the car being on youtube etc. I was like look at the above problems, they said that its covered in warranty and the only thing i can do is contact the financial ombudsmen who will take months to get reply's from. We did contact the financial ombudsmen and are still waiting on more reply's then yes we got your email.
I also mention in those emails I am buying the car to keep its not 3 years and I hand it back, I would have not bought the car if I had known it was a press car.
So now I have a car that was a press car with multiple YouTube videos, looking at the age of YouTube videos and the age the car was 1st registered. I can not see how they broke it in carefully before doing doughnuts in the car and racing around a race track (probably explains the squeaky brakes) and to top it off was involved in a "significant accident" and poorly repaired.
Looking around the internet I found a very similar story
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...used-Gear.html
Quite similar but a lot less problems then mine above and no accident.
But BMW sorted his problems out relatively quickly whereas I am getting nowhere. Paying for solicitors and getting them involved just makes the whole situation even worse unnecessary headache.
I am thinking about taking it to the dailymail maybe that will get mbuk's attention. I have all the YouTube videos saved, all emails saved (I making them email anything instead of over the phone so its recorded)
Originally upon finding out the car was a press car and the videos all I wanted was MBUK to give me a extended factory warranty so if there is any issues they would fix them and it would give me peace of mind that yes I can keep this car.
Now with nothing and even more bad news (the accident and the warranty not covering the front of the car) I want them to take the car back.
The technician told me that most likely they will have pictures of the car before it was repaired, those would help figuring out the extent of the damage they repaired.
Number one thing a dealer that represents MB should be is honest.
Anyway people I will keep you updated and thanks again for reading this far and for the support!
I have spoke to a solicitor now, going to contact both mbuk and the dealer one more time before handing it over to the solicitors.
@96Spec I am not implying the bumper is a common problem for w205 amg owners.
It is a problem on my car + the other common problems.
Here's a list of some of the issues I initially added to the emails to mbuk (common problems+ the bumper)
1. The front bumper having a larger gap on one side. Its quite a obvious gap.
2. Panoramic roof rattle
3. Door led flicker
4. The Passenger side door speaker
5. Front dash rattle
6. Black night pack trim around window .
7. Transmission jolting
8. Drivers door frame top vibrating (loud when its winter)
9. Issues with the touch pad
10. Wind noise worse then my other c lass.
I could go on those issue were noticed and sent over to mbuk in the first emails we exchanged withing a few weeks off ownership so most likely more issues as the car is driven will come to my attention.
Anyway I went to my local dealer to find out why they wont repair the bumper alignment.
The technician took me around the car and pointed out the paint thickness, over spray,masking marks, screwdriver marks. Basically telling me the entire front end has been resprayed and blended into the sides.
This is why I mention the front bumper issue specifically the alignment itself is not a massive problem, I always thought the one trip to the dealer they would fix it.
The issue is once they looked at the front bumper it has now come to light the car was in the words of the local Mercedes technician involved in a "significant" accident and to sort the bumper alignment out they will have to take off a lot more the front bumper.
So when I originally confronted MBUK and the dealer in Chelsea they where basically like oh its nothing to worry about the car being on youtube etc. I was like look at the above problems, they said that its covered in warranty and the only thing i can do is contact the financial ombudsmen who will take months to get reply's from. We did contact the financial ombudsmen and are still waiting on more reply's then yes we got your email.
I also mention in those emails I am buying the car to keep its not 3 years and I hand it back, I would have not bought the car if I had known it was a press car.
So now I have a car that was a press car with multiple YouTube videos, looking at the age of YouTube videos and the age the car was 1st registered. I can not see how they broke it in carefully before doing doughnuts in the car and racing around a race track (probably explains the squeaky brakes) and to top it off was involved in a "significant accident" and poorly repaired.
Looking around the internet I found a very similar story
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...used-Gear.html
Quite similar but a lot less problems then mine above and no accident.
But BMW sorted his problems out relatively quickly whereas I am getting nowhere. Paying for solicitors and getting them involved just makes the whole situation even worse unnecessary headache.
I am thinking about taking it to the dailymail maybe that will get mbuk's attention. I have all the YouTube videos saved, all emails saved (I making them email anything instead of over the phone so its recorded)
Originally upon finding out the car was a press car and the videos all I wanted was MBUK to give me a extended factory warranty so if there is any issues they would fix them and it would give me peace of mind that yes I can keep this car.
Now with nothing and even more bad news (the accident and the warranty not covering the front of the car) I want them to take the car back.
The technician told me that most likely they will have pictures of the car before it was repaired, those would help figuring out the extent of the damage they repaired.
Number one thing a dealer that represents MB should be is honest.
Anyway people I will keep you updated and thanks again for reading this far and for the support!
Last edited by Bluepie; Sep 20, 2018 at 11:49 AM.
Member
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 197
Likes: 16
From: SURREY, UK
W212E63s[rwd sold]W211E63[sold] 645ci [sold]2018 C63s Estate[sold], 2017 gla 45 [Sold] E46m3 [sold]
in my eyes , if they claimed it was the personal car of the manager of the franchise or whatever and it has turned out you own a press car driven to death on tracks etc, then that is clear mis-selling .
if they claimed it was in not involved in an accident and it turns out it was , then that is clear misselling .
did you post anything on the AMG private lounge yet ? If this potentially indirectly dirties the AMG brand them I'm sure there is a chance they might escalate this and get it sorted without the need for legal eagles
if they claimed it was in not involved in an accident and it turns out it was , then that is clear misselling .
did you post anything on the AMG private lounge yet ? If this potentially indirectly dirties the AMG brand them I'm sure there is a chance they might escalate this and get it sorted without the need for legal eagles
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