BMS

In theory you can do a little more with an ECU tune for sure. But the JB4 gets you very close in terms of power, with a lot more features (like boost by gear so you can actually put down the power), smart phone integration, etc, in a package you can remove and resell down the road. Even those running flash maps are finding the JB4 very useful for fine tuning for different fuels (like pump and E85 mixtures), boost by gear, logging, etc, etc.

John Gaarg

And what are the options for tuning mirrors? maybe there is another form? Maybe someone will advise me this page, where I cac search the options?

Behind The Bibs

msd3075

With a piggyback, the ECU never knows that it's outside of the stock parameters.

This is kinda a weird example, but think about it this way. You have a TPMS sensor inside of each of your tires/wheels. It reads the pressure of each tire and then sends that signal back to the car. If you were to install a device between the TPMS sensor and the car, you could use that device to manipulate the reading shared between the sensor and the car. The sensor reads an actual 38 psi, but my device changes it to read 5 psi less (33 psi) inside the car. I then go, thinking my tire is low, to fill up my tire until the reading in the car says 38 psi. In reality, the tire is now at 43 psi, but the car only ever sees it as being at 33 psi and needing to be bumped up to 38 psi. It never sees the higher 43 psi reading.

Jon@BMS

The vehicle will see normal factory-like parameters while the JB4 is installed.

DRGG

I have noticed that every tuner blithely makes statements about their tune leaving the engine performing within "factory safe parameters." How do they know what is "factory safe"?

Jon@BMS

DRGG

I wasn't singling you out, but since you responded, if the ECU thinks everything is within spec, in fact the engine is under additional stress - it just doesn't know it. What I am driving at is how does a tuner know how the tune affects the reliability of the engine and drive train, info that perhaps is only known to AMG? If I understand you correctly, you are saying that you have a long history of experience with engines of all sorts including similar AMG engines. But, then reliabilty testing usually means running something until it fails or at least logging what amounts to be aggregate hours over many engines.

Jon@BMS

There are obviously additional risks involved in raising power to a significant degree, but short of a cascade failure of components, the safety systems built into piggyback tuners like the JB4 are designed to prevent the engine from reaching a condition where damage is going to happen when used as recommended.

fenom

i'm ordering an arma intake, hopefully it will increase like it says.

Behind The Bibs

slowc

KJ

The M177 engine is also used in the E63S where it's making 603 HP (vs 503 HP in the C63S) with different turbo's and exhaust manifolds.

So clearly the M177 Block and other key components can handle more power. Whether the C63S's Turbo's themselves are over stressed is another story. I'm sure it'll be fine though.

I haven't tuned my car, not because I am worried about long-term reliability, but because I'm worried about voiding my warranty and affecting my resale value. In Canada, we don't have as many rules protecting us, so the dealer could easily void the warranty on the entire car, even if that failure was totally unrelated to the tune.

I don't plan to keep the car past the warranty period, so I want to make sure the car stays "marketable" so that I can sell it and upgrade in the near future.

DRGG

I believe that this has been previously discussed in this group or in another forum and that the E63S engine differs in terms of different hardened piston alloys, cranks, and other parts designed for a heavier load. Compression is also different. Honestly, I don't know what to think but like you I don't want to find out at the expense of my warranty.

msd3075

My concern wouldn't be the stress on the engine as much as it would be on the rest of the drivetrain (transmission, rear diff, etc). I'm willing to bet the weak point that is eventually found will be there and not in the engine.