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Remember 6 or 7 years ago when everyone was screaming that the sky was falling because the C63 has going turbo instead of staying N/A "like a proper 63 should be"?
Funny how history repeats itself. Even funnier how everything ends up being just fine (if not even better than before).
Source: IG/@avarvarii (who also did the rendering of this), CARMAGAZINE.CO.UK, FEB 2021
Some highlights:
weight likely to be > 2000kg(4410lbs)
550bhp/590lbft(800NM)
50:50 weight distribution
181mph top speed
0-60 in 3.5s
What y'all thinking about this?
Obviously, no verdict until I drive it. But, this sounds depressing...
4cyl vs v8
4400 lbs vs 3900 lbs
Awd vs rwd
Not interested. When will manufacturers learn that that extra 1/2 second faster 0-60 and faster nurburgring times mean very little to driving enthusiasts. It is about the dynamics and emotion. Cars are becoming emotionless 🚀. 😑
Remember 6 or 7 years ago when everyone was screaming that the sky was falling because the C63 has going turbo instead of staying N/A "like a proper 63 should be"?
Funny how history repeats itself. Even funnier how everything ends up being just fine (if not even better than before).
Who says it's fine? The statistic that would be interesting to see is what percentage of 204 owners bought a 205 and kept it. I have a feeling that a lot of 205 owners are new to AMG and/or the 63 range, because it's the last V8 in this segment. I went through this already once. I'm here, because Audi went from an NA high revving V8 and dual clutch transmission to a turbo V6 with torque converter automatic with the RS5. Wasn't interested in that, even though historically Audi is about turbo charged engines. I'd preferred if the 205 was naturally aspirated, but at least it is still a V8. I can tell you I have my eyes on Porsche now, because they are sticking to what the brand represents and they are starting a parallel track with the Taycan. They are not messing with the recipe of their current cars. Eventually that era will go away probably, but that's ok. Customers can make the switch to the future that was started with the Taycan somewhat at their own pace, but in the meantime one can still buy a proper 911, and they even went back to NA engines in the Boxter and Cayman. The 4 cylinder engine in the 718 doesn't have many friends.
Last edited by superswiss; Jan 17, 2021 at 02:25 PM.
Who says it's fine? The statistic that would be interesting to see is what percentage of 204 owners bought a 205 and kept it. I have a feeling that a lot of 205 owners are new to AMG and/or the 63 range, because it's the last V8 in this segment. I went through this already once. I'm here, because Audi went from an NA high revving V8 and dual clutch transmission to a turbo V6 with torque converter automatic with the RS5. Wasn't interesting in that, even though historically Audi is about turbo charged engines. I'd preferred if the 205 was naturally aspirated, but at least it is still a V8. I can tell you I have my eyes on Porsche now, because they are sticking to what the brand represents and they are starting a parallel track with the Taycan. They are not messing with the recipe of their current cars. Eventually that era will go away probably, but that's ok. Customers can make the switch to the future that was started with the Taycan somewhat at their own pace, but in the meantime one can still buy a proper 911, and they even went back to NA engines in the Boxter and Cayman. The 4 cylinder engine in the 718 doesn't have many friends.
After having two NA 911's, a NA Boxster and a NA Cayman GTS, then buying a 2017 911 non-NA engine, I found the 2017 911 was much more pleasing to me. The torque off the line was far superior compared to the NA 911's I owned. The NA engines I had in all of the Porsches I owned suffered from lack of torque off the line. It wasn't until around 3,000 RPM's that those engines hit their power curve. I also had a Macan Turbo that was a rocket at every speed. I'm sure the engine purists would take their NA engines hands down but for me, the newer turbo technology being used in the car industry sure moves my needle. Maybe we should think of it as a way of prolonging the use of internal combustion engines by meeting strict EPA requirements and giving all of us a little more time before GREEN takes over.
Hopefully with the introduction of the non V-8 C63, the depreciation on the current C63 won't be as depressing.
It wouldn't be. There isn't a single one on sale on autotrader from the dealership side. The only ones you will find are from sketchy *** dealers will super low kilometers but the wear and tear at the 3 and 9 oclock position of the steering wheel says otherwise.
Who says it's fine? The statistic that would be interesting to see is what percentage of 204 owners bought a 205 and kept it. I have a feeling that a lot of 205 owners are new to AMG and/or the 63 range, because it's the last V8 in this segment. I went through this already once. I'm here, because Audi went from an NA high revving V8 and dual clutch transmission to a turbo V6 with torque converter automatic with the RS5. Wasn't interested in that, even though historically Audi is about turbo charged engines. I'd preferred if the 205 was naturally aspirated, but at least it is still a V8. I can tell you I have my eyes on Porsche now, because they are sticking to what the brand represents and they are starting a parallel track with the Taycan. They are not messing with the recipe of their current cars. Eventually that era will go away probably, but that's ok. Customers can make the switch to the future that was started with the Taycan somewhat at their own pace, but in the meantime one can still buy a proper 911, and they even went back to NA engines in the Boxter and Cayman. The 4 cylinder engine in the 718 doesn't have many friends.
Had a couple of 204's, passed on the 205. Really like the 205, amazing car but coming from that NA 6.2 it wasn't the same. I regret selling the 204. My guess is people will regret selling their 205's one day.
Does it really matter ?
No one tracks these cars. I would rather exit the 101 freeway and make my way towards the Malibu canyons.
While your under the hood clearing error codes I'm at the beach chilling.
Looking for real speed , go buy a Tuned M4, or just buy a M5 and call it day.
Mercdes-AMG has no purpose to exist they lost their soul and its no wonder why Tobias Moers left.They genuinely think thats its a good idea to make a 4400lb 4 banger with "550" Hp which will probably suck in the hot weather because of the ridiculously high boost they will need to achieve this and will probably sound like a civic.I will keep my c63s w205 as my daily driver and will order the GT3 when it comes out.
The most insulting thing is calling it "63"
Its a complete joke I hope it flops.Plus please don't buy it speak with your wallets!
Mercdes-AMG has no purpose to exist they lost their soul and its no wonder why Tobias Moers left.They genuinely think thats its a good idea to make a 4400lb 4 banger with "550" Hp which will probably suck in the hot weather because of the ridiculously high boost they will need to achieve this and will probably sound like a civic.I will keep my c63s w205 as my daily driver and will order the GT3 when it comes out.
The most insulting thing is calling it "63"
Its a complete joke I hope it flops.Plus please don't buy it speak with your wallets!
A 4400+ pound 4 cylinder performance car is an oxymoron. It really will be an insult to the 63 name...
For those curious, this is what the M139 4-cylinder sounds like (minus the hybrid assist). If I heard this go by with a 63 badge on it, I’d think someone rebadged their C300 or CLA45.
Tobias was right to storm out of that board meeting when they voted to go 4 banger with the W206 C63. I don’t blame him for taking his talents over to Aston Martin, with V8’s, V12’s, and manual transmissions
Last edited by AlexZTuned; Jan 18, 2021 at 02:33 PM.
Mercdes-AMG has no purpose to exist they lost their soul and its no wonder why Tobias Moers left.They genuinely think thats its a good idea to make a 4400lb 4 banger with "550" Hp which will probably suck in the hot weather because of the ridiculously high boost they will need to achieve this and will probably sound like a civic.I will keep my c63s w205 as my daily driver and will order the GT3 when it comes out.
The most insulting thing is calling it "63"
Its a complete joke I hope it flops.Plus please don't buy it speak with your wallets!
Originally Posted by AlexZTuned
A 4400+ pound 4 cylinder performance car is an oxymoron. It really will be an insult to the 63 name...
For those curious, this is what the M139 4-cylinder sounds like (minus the hybrid assist). If I heard this go by with a 63 badge on it, I’d think someone rebadged their C300 or CLA45.
Tobias was right to storm out of that board meeting when they voted to go 4 banger with the W206 C63. I don’t blame him for taking his talents over to Aston Martin, with V8’s, V12’s, and manual transmissions
Agree with both. The argument is compliance or pay billions in fines. Well, that doesn't matter to the enthusiast. While there will be many that will gladly pay 90k+ for W206 AMG because they need to have the latest, there will be plenty of owners that will be happy to give their money to Porsche or BMW. For what it's worth, BMW is at least trying, despite the controversial grill the new M4/3 looks like a really nice set up. Optional manual to boot!
Agree with both. The argument is compliance or pay billions in fines. Well, that doesn't matter to the enthusiast. While there will be many that will gladly pay 90k+ for W206 AMG because they need to have the latest, there will be plenty of owners that will be happy to give their money to Porsche or BMW. For what it's worth, BMW is at least trying, despite the controversial grill the new M4/3 looks like a really nice set up. Optional manual to boot!
Gotta give credit to BMW for staying truer to their roots despite the controversial grill. Inline-6, manual, RWD for the purists - or an auto with AWD for the acceleration junkies.
My next move is a 911. A 991.2 with a manual is a tempting proposition especially with how much power Porsche left on the table with them.
I really love my PFL Coupe and wish I could keep it. The FL was a disappointment, as was the lack of a special edition C63R or whatever to do a cool send off of the last C63 with a V8. But I guess those plans were scrapped too because of emissions and stuff... or they had to focus on making the 15th variant of the GT car...
I've had a 2005 e55,2013 c63 and a 2017 c63 and will get the new c63 when it hits the streets.
There is no chance it will weigh more than an s63 limo
This is my 100% bone stock C63S Coupe with 1/2 tank of gas. Weighed 4030 lbs without me in it, full weight from factory.
With a full tank, it would add approximately 55 lbs (6.3 lbs per gallon of gas) making my fully loaded Coupe weigh in at 4085 lbs! Add hybrid motors to the wheels, the starter, all the battery pack, associated wiring, and then an entire AWD system... I think 4400 lbs sounds right for a Sedan.
This is my 100% bone stock C63S Coupe with 1/2 tank of gas. Weighed 4030 lbs without me in it, full weight from factory.
With a full tank, it would add approximately 55 lbs (6.3 lbs per gallon of gas) making my fully loaded Coupe weigh in at 4085 lbs! Add hybrid motors to the wheels, the starter, all the battery pack, associated wiring, and then an entire AWD system... I think 4400 lbs sounds right for a Sedan.
In general the coupes weigh more than sedans and don't forget the car will lose 4 cylinders and a bunch of cooling. I'll bet the car comes in right around the same weight. 4400lbs is e63s bro
This is my 100% bone stock C63S Coupe with 1/2 tank of gas. Weighed 4030 lbs without me in it, full weight from factory.
With a full tank, it would add approximately 55 lbs (6.3 lbs per gallon of gas) making my fully loaded Coupe weigh in at 4085 lbs! Add hybrid motors to the wheels, the starter, all the battery pack, associated wiring, and then an entire AWD system... I think 4400 lbs sounds right for a Sedan.
Yeah, I have zero doubt about the quoted 4400+ lbs curb weight. That's no surprise. The M139 engine saves a little bit of weight over the M177, but not much. EVs in this class are closer to 5000 lbs. The Taycan with the largest battery is over 5000 lbs for crying out loud. These are massive pigs, but it's constantly being downplayed because the weight is low down, but that doesn't address the increased tire and brake wear and you still feel that weight in the corners or under braking. Can't ignore physics. PHEVs are generally the worst of both worlds. Small electric range and you are lugging around a complete combustion engine in fully electric mode, and in hybrid mode you have all that weight from the battery etc. and now the AWD. As AMG is adding hybrid to all the other models the weights will only go up. These cars would need carbon fiber all throughout to lower the weight, but that would make them way too expensive. I'm curious how AMG manages the weight. Something like the Taycan still handles very well as Porsche despite the crazy curb weight has implemented a great chassis, but that's on much more expensive car and the battery is in the floor, which is not gonna be the case with the new C63. I'm guessing the battery is somewhere in the trunk area, which is why the weight distribution is now 50:50. They basically just added most of that weight to the rear.
In general the coupes weigh more than sedans and don't forget the car will lose 4 cylinders and a bunch of cooling. I'll bet the car comes in right around the same weight. 4400lbs is e63s bro
You'll lose that bet. This car will never weigh 4000lbs, that's wishful thinking. Whatever the weight the M137 saves over the M177 will be more than offset by the new AWD, 400V battery and the electric motor module, which has its own transmission sitting on the rear axle. Read the screenshot carefully. The electric motor has to bypass the main transmission, because of the torque. It says the hybrid part alone weighs over 500 lbs. There's no way the M137 is 500 lbs lighter than the M177.
Yeah, I have zero doubt about the quoted 4400+ lbs curb weight. That's no surprise. The M139 engine saves a little bit of weight over the M177, but not much. EVs in this class are closer to 5000 lbs. The Taycan with the largest battery is over 5000 lbs for crying out loud. These are massive pigs, but it's constantly being downplayed because the weight is low down, but that doesn't address the increased tire and brake wear and you still feel that weight in the corners or under braking. Can't ignore physics. PHEVs are generally the worst of both worlds. Small electric range and you are lugging around a complete combustion engine in fully electric mode, and in hybrid mode you have all that weight from the battery etc. and now the AWD. As AMG is adding hybrid to all the other models the weights will only go up. These cars would need carbon fiber all throughout to lower the weight, but that would make them way too expensive. I'm curious how AMG manages the weight. Something like the Taycan still handles very well as Porsche despite the crazy curb weight has implemented a great chassis, but that's on much more expensive car and the battery is in the floor, which is not gonna be the case with the new C63. I'm guessing the battery is somewhere in the trunk area, which is why the weight distribution is now 50:50. They basically just added most of that weight to the rear.
They say in the article that the 4 cylinder saves 60 KG or 132 lbs compared to the V8, so there's your savings up font. Who knows how much the electric starter motor adds back. The rear is going to be loaded with those electric motors and batteries to get that weight distribution 50:50. I think AMG would have been better off focusing on real weight savings, then they can tout about handling and a 50:50 weight distribution. We all know throwing 4400+ lbs into a corner, there is no hiding the weight. It's the only thing that bugged me with the new E63S driving it at length around COTA.
The e53 coupe with a 3.0 turbo charged and supercharged with eq boost motor comes in at 4429lbs guys.
Not the same. That's a mild hybrid system with a very small 48V battery and a small starter motor between the engine and transmission. In the new C63 we are talking ~200HP electric motor plus reduction gearing plus at least a 20kWh battery according to the leaked specs below. I'm not sure you realize how heavy these batteries are. We'll have to wait for exact figures, but just for a ballpark, a Tesla 90 kWh battery weighs 1200lbs, so if we use that as our base, then a 20 kWh battery weights about 250-300 lbs alone. Now add the heavier electric motor with reduction gear set and AWD to that plus BMS, charging equipment and liquid cooling for the battery and motor. Everything gets bigger and heavier for 400V. The wiring alone weighs a lot for the kinds of currents that it needs to support. The E53 e-motor doesn't power the wheels directly.
EDIT: Just a rough calculation to illustrate: 3900 (approx. current sedan weight) - 132 (M139 weight saving) + 300 (battery) + 200 (motor + gear set) + 100 (wiring, BMS, cooling and that's very conservative) = 4368. That's just with some approximate numbers in my head based on what I've seen this stuff weighs.
Last edited by superswiss; Jan 19, 2021 at 08:47 PM.
This is going to be very interesting, can't wait for the reviews. Perhaps the greatest deviation for the AMG brand we've seen with more coming. 44/4500 lbs is enormous for a C, imagine an S that is 45/4600.
Why in the world a four-cylinder? I understand if they were to downsize but why not at least go to a 6-cylinder, which while not as preferable to a V8 is much better than a 4-cylinder, and they have the M256 engine already available.
