Watched the video ^^ yesterday & holy! Looks like it’s going to be significantly more than our w205. I hope it sits at the dealer lot and not sell and everyone jumping on the m3 & rs5.
Yep, I saw the prices earlier. Also evident in how this whole car is backfiring based on his comment that there's practically zero interest in the car in Germany and as I said, the horsepower might look mighty on paper, but combined with the weight and the fact that the full power is only available for 10 seconds at a time as he says it can't be felt out on the road. I'm totally with Gercollector on this. AMG is going down the drain. This car and the price is laughable.
I'm sitting in a W206 at the moment for the first time. It's a 2023 C300 loaner. No AMG, so I'm not gonna comment on how it drives, but I have to talk about the interior and ergonomics. It's an absolute disaster, IMO. The cheapness radiates throughout. I can't believe it. The door cards and where you grab the doors feel so cheap. Then on top of that you have the cheap capacitive touch buttons to adjust the mirrors. They are horrible, and speaking of the mirrors, I don't know if this loaner has an issue with them, but they don't adjust far enough outward. I'm a big believer in the SAE published guidelines (link below) for how to adjust the mirrors to eliminate the blind spot. Can't do it in this car. The mirrors stop way too short of where they should be. I couldn't believe it.
Furthermore, the center display looks crooked. It's supposed to be tilted towards the driver, but that makes it look crooked and it's super distracting to adjust anything. I drove through a red light a block from the dealership, because I was trying to adjust something that I didn't notice while still sitting in the dealer lot. This is not the first time I'm using the latest MBUX, but it's just super distracting, because you have to look down and focus on the screen for every damn thing. Not being an AMG means no steering wheel controls to adjust the drive mode, so again, you have to look down. This at least is better in the C43 and C63.
The loaner is sitting in my garage at the moment and I have absolutely no interest in spending time in it. Obviously the AMG variants have some higher quality materials in them, so the C300 always felt cheaper, but there are fundamental issues from the driving position to how it feels sitting in the cabin and the operating concept of the car. Absolutely dreadful, IMHO. On the positive side I like how it looks from behind, but the front is not very impressive. the lines are kinda awkward. I wish anybody who buys this car good luck with the powertrain. Sounds like the official release was already delayed, because there were issues with it. As I mentioned earlier, I drove the GT 63 S E Performance and it's worse than the normal GT 63 S. The engine and electric motor just don't work together smoothly, and did I mention the weight. Just too detrimental and I bet it won't be any different here compared to the outgoing W205. Just sad!
I cannot speak about C63, but W206 C43 is a great car. I disagree with Superswiss' characterization. The driving dynamics are better than m340 and rival those of 205 c63. AWD and RWS help.
I also disagree about central position of MBUX 2, it's tilted towards the driver for a reason and to me sitting lower distracts less than top mounted screen.
The interior does not feel cheap in the top line trim, certainly no cheaper than in w205, I mean seriously?
Additionally, the size and layout of the screen are much better for watching all sorts of videos even in motion, such youtube, Hulu, TV and so forth if one how to tinker with Android.
I get it about the C63 weight, but to write off, no. E class AMG is going to have 700hp with similar engine. I don't like all the electric stuff and government mandates, but it's not AMG's fault.
Interior of the w206 is fine but not as good as its rival the 3 series. I have to disagree about the c63. Amg already said they could have put a v8 in it for this generation but choose not to. They could have widen the fenders like the m3 but they choose not to. Compare to the rival, it’s much more expensive, much more weight, dynamically it’s inferior to the m3 comp & cs. Have you seen the carbon bucket seats? Amg don’t even offer the carbon steering anymore, the touch square on the steering is a disaster. For that price, why no just get an rs6 wagon which is about $115k - 125k. Or the m3cs with its widen fenders. I get the c43 but the w206 c63 don’t make any sense. You’re basically paying for the 2 electric motors that only last 10 sec and add significant weight. And lastly the sound.. amg are known for sound and that is all gone in the w206.
Additionally, the size and layout of the screen are much better for watching all sorts of videos even in motion, such youtube, Hulu, TV
If that's even remotely a criteria that's supposed to make me feel better about it, then we have lost it completely. I sure hope you are not watching Hulu etc. while driving, because that would take the distracting nature of the screen to a whole new level. But I continue to say the interior is cheap. The capacitive buttons on the steering wheel etc. are a complete disaster.
However, I can relate to your take on the C43. Not sure what car you are coming from and how much experience you have in particularly with the FL C205 C63S Coupe in terms of dynamics, but compared to the W205 C43 the W206 C43 is definitely better dynamically. It's now much more of an AMG product than the rebadged C450 that the W205 was. For starters it has a proper AMG transmission and from what I'm reading, the electric turbo charger gives it a proper response, something the V8 in the C63 naturally had. One of the major design goals for the M177/178 engines was that they feel very close to a naturally aspirated engine, which AMG executed beautifully. The W205 C43 had a tuned off the shelve MB engine, and now it's an actual AMG engine at least, even though it's missing a few cylinders. The W205 C43 was frankly overall kinda terrible. We've all probably read many of the threads on the suspension and transmission tuning of the W205 C43.
I didn't' say anything about how the W206 C300 drives, but it does drive better than the W205 C300. The suspension is sorted better. But neither the C43, nor the C300 got 500 lbs of P3 hybrid hardware thrown in taking their weight way beyond the W205. It's just a different story with the W206 C63.
Again I can only speak for c43 w206 and yes it's a better proposition then c63. What we're doing now, is comparing 206 C63 with current gen M3, which is one gen behind. It's quite possible new one would be electric.
Look an the new 5! I have extensive experience with BMW, drove most of them, owned lots of them, drove on Autobahns, after several Euro deliveries and they've been going downhill fast especially design wise. I really disagree that M3 has better interior than C43. I've never been a fan of iDrive in all of its iterations and I've had them all.
As far as watching videos, I drive / stand in heavy traffic more often than on a track so it comes in handy
Again I can only speak for c43 w206 and yes it's a better proposition then c63. What we're doing now, is comparing 206 C63 with current gen M3, which is one gen behind. It's quite possible new one would be electric.
Look an the new 5! I have extensive experience with BMW, drove most of them, owned lots of them, drove on Autobahns, after several Euro deliveries and they've been going downhill fast especially design wise. I really disagree that M3 has better interior than C43. I've never been a fan of iDrive in all of its iterations and I've had them all.
As far as watching videos, I drive / stand in heavy traffic more often than on a track so it comes in handy
Notice, I didn't compare it to BMW at all, so you brought that up. That's a different topic. My last BMW was an E46. I haven't liked BMW since and frankly the interior of the E46 was nothing to write home about. Neither are the current interiors, which are basically the side-by-side screens that MB already did, so not exactly innovative for sure. But what MB is doing now is what Tesla had already done in the Model S and it wasn't good there. Unless you prefer gimmicks over ergonomics.
FWIW, I don't sit in traffic with my car, don't have a commute. I'm out driving, hitting up the canyons in RACE mode and adjusting settings mid flight. I can do that in my 2019 C63S blind using physical buttons. As I said, the W206 C43 and C63 thankfully still have the AMG Drive Unit on the steering wheel, so drive mode adjustments can be made w/o having to go into the touchscreen, but the W205 had redundant buttons on the center console as not all the functions can be mapped to the steering wheel buttons simultaneously. For example I have the suspension and exhaust setting on the left two buttons on the steering wheel, but I still have physical buttons in the center console to adjust other things such as the ESP, or the permanent manual mode for the transmission. With the W206 I have to dive into the touchscreen for those or constantly toggle which two functions I have assigned to the steering wheel buttons. That simply is one step forward and two steps back, but we clearly drive in different environments.
If that's even remotely a criteria that's supposed to make me feel better about it, then we have lost it completely. I sure hope you are not watching Hulu etc. while driving, because that would take the distracting nature of the screen to a whole new level. But I continue to say the interior is cheap. The capacitive buttons on the steering wheel etc. are a complete disaster.
However, I can relate to your take on the C43. Not sure what car you are coming from and how much experience you have in particularly with the FL C205 C63S Coupe in terms of dynamics, but compared to the W205 C43 the W206 C43 is definitely better dynamically. It's now much more of an AMG product than the rebadged C450 that the W205 was. For starters it has a proper AMG transmission and from what I'm reading, the electric turbo charger gives it a proper response, something the V8 in the C63 naturally had. One of the major design goals for the M177/178 engines was that they feel very close to a naturally aspirated engine, which AMG executed beautifully. The W205 C43 had a tuned off the shelve MB engine, and now it's an actual AMG engine at least, even though it's missing a few cylinders. The W205 C43 was frankly overall kinda terrible. We've all probably read many of the threads on the suspension and transmission tuning of the W205 C43.
I didn't' say anything about how the W206 C300 drives, but it does drive better than the W205 C300. The suspension is sorted better. But neither the C43, nor the C300 got 500 lbs of P3 hybrid hardware thrown in taking their weight way beyond the W205. It's just a different story with the W206 C63.
Yep, I saw the prices earlier. Also evident in how this whole car is backfiring based on his comment that there's practically zero interest in the car in Germany and as I said, the horsepower might look mighty on paper, but combined with the weight and the fact that the full power is only available for 10 seconds at a time as he says it can't be felt out on the road. I'm totally with Gercollector on this. AMG is going down the drain. This car and the price is laughable.
I'm sitting in a W206 at the moment for the first time. It's a 2023 C300 loaner. No AMG, so I'm not gonna comment on how it drives, but I have to talk about the interior and ergonomics. It's an absolute disaster, IMO. The cheapness radiates throughout. I can't believe it. The door cards and where you grab the doors feel so cheap. Then on top of that you have the cheap capacitive touch buttons to adjust the mirrors. They are horrible, and speaking of the mirrors, I don't know if this loaner has an issue with them, but they don't adjust far enough outward. I'm a big believer in the SAE published guidelines (link below) for how to adjust the mirrors to eliminate the blind spot. Can't do it in this car. The mirrors stop way too short of where they should be. I couldn't believe it.
Furthermore, the center display looks crooked. It's supposed to be tilted towards the driver, but that makes it look crooked and it's super distracting to adjust anything. I drove through a red light a block from the dealership, because I was trying to adjust something that I didn't notice while still sitting in the dealer lot. This is not the first time I'm using the latest MBUX, but it's just super distracting, because you have to look down and focus on the screen for every damn thing. Not being an AMG means no steering wheel controls to adjust the drive mode, so again, you have to look down. This at least is better in the C43 and C63.
The loaner is sitting in my garage at the moment and I have absolutely no interest in spending time in it. Obviously the AMG variants have some higher quality materials in them, so the C300 always felt cheaper, but there are fundamental issues from the driving position to how it feels sitting in the cabin and the operating concept of the car. Absolutely dreadful, IMHO. On the positive side I like how it looks from behind, but the front is not very impressive. the lines are kinda awkward. I wish anybody who buys this car good luck with the powertrain. Sounds like the official release was already delayed, because there were issues with it. As I mentioned earlier, I drove the GT 63 S E Performance and it's worse than the normal GT 63 S. The engine and electric motor just don't work together smoothly, and did I mention the weight. Just too detrimental and I bet it won't be any different here compared to the outgoing W205. Just sad!
If you have a chance to test the W206 C 43 next time please do let us know your experience, that is pretty much the C 63 S E Performance minus the weight, horsepower, E Performance drivetrain, etc. (pretty much).
I cannot speak about C63, but W206 C43 is a great car. I disagree with Superswiss' characterization. The driving dynamics are better than m340 and rival those of 205 c63. AWD and RWS help.
I also disagree about central position of MBUX 2, it's tilted towards the driver for a reason and to me sitting lower distracts less than top mounted screen.
The interior does not feel cheap in the top line trim, certainly no cheaper than in w205, I mean seriously?
Additionally, the size and layout of the screen are much better for watching all sorts of videos even in motion, such youtube, Hulu, TV and so forth if one how to tinker with Android.
I get it about the C63 weight, but to write off, no. E class AMG is going to have 700hp with similar engine. I don't like all the electric stuff and government mandates, but it's not AMG's fault.
Thankfully the E is at least getting a six cylinder according to MB and true too for MBUSA leaked document from the EPA.
If you have a chance to test the W206 C 43 next time please do let us know your experience, that is pretty much the C 63 S E Performance minus the weight, horsepower, E Performance drivetrain, etc. (pretty much).
Yes, it is, which is part of the knock on the C63. I'm sure there's some difference in the tuning and the e-turbo in the C63 uses 400V while the one in the C43 uses 48V, so the one in the C63 is way more powerful and is also used to recharge the high voltage battery while spinning down. I've been wanting to test the C43, but wanna find an opportunity to take it out onto some of my favorite twisty roads, so it can't just be a dealership test drive. I've also been thinking of doing another AMG Driving Academy event in Germany as they now have the W206 C63 in their fleet. I do like to drive the cars and confirm my take on them, even though there generally aren't any surprises.
Thankfully the E is at least getting a six cylinder according to MB and true too for MBUSA leaked document from the EPA.
Yes, that's an interesting development. On one hand surprising as they declared a couple of years ago that all new ICE development is being stopped and now supposedly they are developing a new OMOE six cylinder. On the other hand not surprising that they needed something between the M139 P3 system and the M177 P3 system. Opens the door to the rumored CLE possibly getting the six cylinder as well. Don't wanna know what the CLE 63 and E 63 are gonna go for if the C63 well optioned already approaches Euro 150k.
Yes, it is, which is part of the knock on the C63. I'm sure there's some difference in the tuning and the e-turbo in the C63 uses 400V while the one in the C43 uses 48V, so the one in the C63 is way more powerful and is also used to recharge the high voltage battery while spinning down. I've been wanting to test the C43, but wanna find an opportunity to take it out onto some of my favorite twisty roads, so it can't just be a dealership test drive. I've also been thinking of doing another AMG Driving Academy event in Germany as they now have the W206 C63 in their fleet. I do like to drive the cars and confirm my take on them, even though there generally aren't any surprises.
I see. I thought so.
Yay! Another driving event, eager to hear about your driving impressions of the new additions to the event.
Yes, that's an interesting development. On one hand surprising as they declared a couple of years ago that all new ICE development is being stopped and now supposedly they are developing a new OMOE six cylinder. On the other hand not surprising that they needed something between the M139 P3 system and the M177 P3 system. Opens the door to the rumored CLE possibly getting the six cylinder as well. Don't wanna know what the CLE 63 and E 63 are gonna go for if the C63 well optioned already approaches Euro 150k.
Yup exactly, it will be a hard sell most likely, to have an E 63 S with a four cylinder. So they pretty much have to and I am glad they did instead of just going fully electric and called it a day.
I agree with Swiss, W206 feels very cheap and even smells like cheap Chinese plastic. I was literally the first non influencer person to see the new c63 in Germany (even influencers reposted my photos). The car is huge, nothing like the W205, sounds like Dyson with terrible seating position. While I had my deposit on one for more than a year now it became highly unlikely that I’ll be getting one and to cement the decision I’ll be attending AMG Driving Event in Germany next month to drive the C63 on nordschleife. Oh and Mercedes can go and F themselves with this price tag, like seriously who’s gonna pay over a $100k for a 4 cylinder pig. (My build came up to 132k€ on German website).
P.S. my G82 M4 with full leather interior is far more superior in quality and feel than the new C63.
I agree with Swiss, W206 feels very cheap and even smells like cheap Chinese plastic. I was literally the first non influencer person to see the new c63 in Germany (even influencers reposted my photos). The car is huge, nothing like the W205, sounds like Dyson with terrible seating position. While I had my deposit on one for more than a year now it became highly unlikely that I’ll be getting one and to cement the decision I’ll be attending AMG Driving Event in Germany next month to drive the C63 on nordschleife. Oh and Mercedes can go and F themselves with this price tag, like seriously who’s gonna pay over a $100k for a 4 cylinder pig. (My build came up to 132k€ on German website).
P.S. my G82 M4 with full leather interior is far more superior in quality and feel than the new C63.
100% the lower dash and door is cheap plastic that you’d find in a 20k car. While it looks very nice. It’s not a step up like going from the w204 to the w205. It’s more of a change and just an upgrade in lighting and tech. For full leather interior mb only offer on the e class and higher. Hate to say this but imho the m3/m4 comp is superior in every way. One thing I forgot to mention is how complex it’ll be for those of us that don’t keep our car stock. Not to mention that it will suck owning it when it’s out of warranty
100% the lower dash and door is cheap plastic that you’d find in a 20k car. While it looks very nice. It’s not a step up like going from the w204 to the w205.
Yes, that's what I was referring to. You touch cold hard plastic every time you grab the door. Feels so cheap. In the 205 you grab leather, Nappa leather in case of the C63S, and the seat switches/speaker area is nice aluminum and all the switches on the door feel solid and you don't have to make sure you touch them in the right place. It's just so much higher quality. Had to run some errands today in the loaner and CarPlay kept disconnecting, so had to fiddle around the entire time to keep getting directions. I can't emphasize enough how terrible the capacitive buttons are. Can't even adjust the volume fine grained. Ends up either too soft or too loud. Can't easily adjust it up and down in increments. The roller is so much nicer on the FL steering wheel and the rest of the buttons are useable and consistently perform their functions, not like the capacitive buttons doing something unexpected if you didn't quite touch them in the right place.
I agree with Swiss, W206 feels very cheap and even smells like cheap Chinese plastic. I was literally the first non influencer person to see the new c63 in Germany (even influencers reposted my photos). The car is huge, nothing like the W205, sounds like Dyson with terrible seating position. While I had my deposit on one for more than a year now it became highly unlikely that I’ll be getting one and to cement the decision I’ll be attending AMG Driving Event in Germany next month to drive the C63 on nordschleife. Oh and Mercedes can go and F themselves with this price tag, like seriously who’s gonna pay over a $100k for a 4 cylinder pig. (My build came up to 132k€ on German website).
P.S. my G82 M4 with full leather interior is far more superior in quality and feel than the new C63.
Sure, AMG smells Chinese and BMW German. Leather btw comes from Argentina and plastic from BASF AG and other German co. M3 uses optional Marino leather that's softer due to the certain processes.
206 is few inches longer than 205 to make more room inside which I like. Oh and 132k euro includes19% tax, although I agree it's still outrageously expensive.
The doors are not plastic if you get leather package, at least mine aren't.
I'm talking about this part. This whole thing is a sliver painted plastic brick and that's where you have to hold on to shut the door. Are you saying this whole thing is leather in yours?
In the 205 the whole arm rest, grab handle and around the switches is leather.
At that price point good luck to them. Too many other options at that price.
I'm sure the W206 43/63 are much faster and have better tech than the W205 43/63 but personally I wouldn't pay 100k for a dyson when I can get one for a couple hundred lol
Sure, AMG smells Chinese and BMW German. Leather btw comes from Argentina and plastic from BASF AG and other German co. M3 uses optional Marino leather that's softer due to the certain processes.
206 is few inches longer than 205 to make more room inside which I like. Oh and 132k euro includes19% tax, although I agree it's still outrageously expensive.
don’t take it personally, you like what you like, you don’t need to defend your car here - enjoy it!
I'm talking about this part. This whole thing is a sliver painted plastic brick and that's where you have to hold on to shut the door. Are you saying this whole thing is leather in yours?
In the 205 the whole arm rest, grab handle and around the switches is leather.
W205 was the pinnacle. W206 going forward is a cobbled experimental mess at this point. I couldn't even fathom buying the first round of a "buzzy" four banger mated to some battery operated motors. To add insult to injury they have the gall to call it a 63. All they are doing is capitalizing on the 63 moniker and credibility of the past.
Slideshow: A one-of-one U.S.-spec Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren Roadster became even rarer after a factory-backed transformation at McLaren's headquarters.
