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Replacing oem brake pads and question about rotor condition.. Please help!
Hey guys,
Im thinking about swapping out the oem brake pads for some aftermarket pads that are less dusty. If I do pads only front and rear, I was advised the brake system needs some bleeding. Which fluids do you guys recommend and how much should I get and where can I get them?
My 2021 C63 still has the oem rotors at 15K miles on the clock. I was feeling the edges of the rotors in the front and seems like the flat surfaces are not even and the rotors are grooved in where the pads meet with the rotor. Do you guys think I should replace the rotors or are they still good for at least another new set of brake pads? These brakes sometimes squeak and that might be normal for our cars or it could be my pads need replacement, but just wanted to get some clarification on this too.
Deal with the noise, they have a lot more life left on them. It's a German thing. The friction coefficient is so high it has peaks and valleys so you have to flat foot brake to get a good contact surface. That and it's a wad of compressed metal for a brake pad which holds heat, doesn't compress and offers good pedal feel, and grabs that rotor HARD.
Good fluids are either Pentosin LV or ATE SL6. They will work with standard DOT4 but the cars prefer low viscosity ATF so the ABS, stability control, and emergency braking systems have an easier time kicking in. You should replace the fluid annually if you can manage it, 2 years is what the manual says.
Never touch the pads without replacing the rotors. Once they're grooved like that they're going to prematurely destroy the new pads and you'll get warped rotors to boot. The speeds the cars attain at the weight they are is BRUTAL on the fluids and friction components. You can replace the rotors every 20k on these cars if you don't make a switch to aftermarket ceramic pads. The ceramic pads triple the rotor and pad life. Go Brembo rotors if they're available. They're coated and are high carbon with tight runout tolerances. Pads you can use the alarmingly inexpensive Z23 pads by Powerstop which are 100 for the front and rear set. Dynamic Friction Company also makes a 5000 Euro series which has been comparable to the Akebono EURO ceramic pad series for me, previous owner of Centric split off to do his own thing and thats what DFC is. AMG tax is real lol. The OE pads are like $800 for some reason I just looked them up the other day.
I've run Powerstop in the past on a ton of cars, I even like them over the Brembo NAO because they produce less dust and they were quieter because of the rubberized shims. A few members just recently installed them on the M177 AMG' and liked them too.
Thanks for your input guys. So if 20k is the interval to replace rotors, then I'll just wait until I hit that mark to get some new rotors and pads.
Chrishimself, what are your thoughts on the Porterfield R4-S pads? Someone recommended those to me coupled with some brembo discs from FCPeuro. They are a bit pricey though.
So the Powerstop pads will work with the brembo discs I listed below then? They def are cheaper than the Porterfield R4-S, thats for sure..
Thanks for your input guys. So if 20k is the interval to replace rotors, then I'll just wait until I hit that mark to get some new rotors and pads.
Chrishimself, what are your thoughts on the Porterfield R4-S pads? Someone recommended those to me coupled with some brembo discs from FCPeuro. They are a bit pricey though.
So the Powerstop pads will work with the brembo discs I listed below then? They def are cheaper than the Porterfield R4-S, thats for sure..
it all depends on how you drive, where you drive, and what you drive. For heavy AMG's yes they start squealing at 20k but you can drive them out to 40k if you just deal with it. I live in San Jose, lots of street and traffic driving, lots of 50 to 0's, freeway is 100 down to 60's.
I used Porterfields when I used to race miata. They're great. We didn't have easy access to quality composite braking materials at the time though in 2007. I think they're a bit dated compared to like a $60 Brembo Ceramic NAO paid you can just buy on Amazon for most of the MB fleet and they cost 3x as much.
They're kind of expensive. Once I discovered Akebono, DFC, R1, Brembo Ceramic, and the other stuff you can find on Rock Auto I've stopped buying Hawk, Carbotech, Porterfield, EBC aka the $200+ carbon-ceramic-kevlar pads. Nobody is making their own pads in this industry. It's extremely cost and labor prohibitive, but if anybody has worked in a brake pad factory let me know. I've seen aftermarket rebrand OTHER people's aftermarket products. You ever see a Chinese-made rebox'ed Bosch alternator for $80? So it likely comes from an OEM anyway at the end of the day. Shockingly even like the Duralast ceramics are ok, they're expensive as hell but someone made those that makes brake parts. Brake parts are under legal scrutiny that say, exhaust or race parts don't really see.
The only options for your car are the RockAuto DFC or those Powerstops. Yes they're incredibly cheap, most of that savings due to Rock Auto handling their own fufillment, warehousing, and sales from multiple places across the country. They would be $100+ if you had to buy them locally, from a place where they sat on a shelf for years until you got there.
All rotors have a minimum thickness that's usually stamped on the hat. To know if the rotors have enough life left on them, you have to measure it. The allowed wear is usually about 1-2 mm, so if you can feel a lip, then they are pretty much done. I've kept the rear rotors for two sets of OE pads, but I replaced the front rotors each time. Check out FCP Euro. They have lifetime replacement guarantee. The full floating Brembo rotors are awesome and much cheaper than the OE rotors. Send back the worn parts and they credit the full purchase price. I'm on my second set of the Brembo rotors and parts were free this time. For the rears, I now have the Zimmerman rotors also from FCP Euro. I stayed with the OEM pads. They are frankly excellent. The dust doesn't bother me. Can barely see it with my black wheels, but the OEM pads grab when you want. With the full floating rotors they are much more consistent and easier to modulate. Get some heat in them and they stop on a dime.
There's no fixed mileage when it comes to brakes. All depends on how you drive. I get about ~16k miles out of a set. They start squealing when they are about worn. Around 1000 miles before the pad wear sensor trips. Also key to proper brake performance is to bed them in after replacing and get some heat into the brake regularly so the pad layer on the rotors stays on.
Brake flush should be done every 3 years or 30k, or before and after high speed track events.
the rotors can be turned on a brake lathe. As long as they are still above minimum thickness spec and runout. If you feel a lip it’s a good idea to turn while in there.
Brake flush should be done every 3 years or 30k, or before and after high speed track events.
the rotors can be turned on a brake lathe. As long as they are still above minimum thickness spec and runout. If you feel a lip it’s a good idea to turn while in there.
fluid wise I run pentosin super or ATE type 200 (formally known as super blue in USA) dry boil of 560 and 18$ a liter.
Brake flush should be done every 3 years or 30k, or before and after high speed track events.
the rotors can be turned on a brake lathe. As long as they are still above minimum thickness spec and runout. If you feel a lip it’s a good idea to turn while in there.
Brake flush is every 2 years. Part of Service B. There's not enough material on these rotors to turn them.
Thanks for all the informative comments guys. So how many liters of fluid do I need to get for when I replace the rotors and pads together? And what if I just do only the front or only the rear? I checked my front rotors and the wear indicator divots are still visible so I think the front rotors are still ok, and the front pads are at 7mm which is ok as well. However, the rear pads are at 5mm but I think the rear rotors are still ok. So I might be ok for some time. Obv if I just change the pads only, I wont need any new fluids but I think it'll be better if I do everything at once so Ill drag it out a little longer and check on it periodically.
Thanks for all the informative comments guys. So how many liters of fluid do I need to get for when I replace the rotors and pads together? And what if I just do only the front or only the rear? I checked my front rotors and the wear indicator divots are still visible so I think the front rotors are still ok, and the front pads are at 7mm which is ok as well. However, the rear pads are at 5mm but I think the rear rotors are still ok. So I might be ok for some time. Obv if I just change the pads only, I wont need any new fluids but I think it'll be better if I do everything at once so Ill drag it out a little longer and check on it periodically.
The liter can of ATE SL6 from amazon will be exactly what you need within an oz or two. The SL6 is preferred for the ABS and safety systems due to it being low viscosity, but Typ 200 is compatible and is an excellent quality fluid I use in the Porsches and is racing-grade so it takes as hard of a beating as you can give it, but it's a bit overkill. Pentosin Super DOT4 LV is also good. The thing with brake fluid is you lose more performance from letting it sit than you gain from choosing one over the other. You should always your brake fluid whenever it's convenient. I'm real hard on brakes and I honestly am not great at writing down records as I used to be so I honestly just do it every single time I replace brakes or tires.
Yeah the pads and rotors kind of wear at the same rate, you'll need to change them at 2mm, itll squeal but I mean just use em up, you already paid for em.
The liter can of ATE SL6 from amazon will be exactly what you need within an oz or two. The SL6 is preferred for the ABS and safety systems due to it being low viscosity, but Typ 200 is compatible and is an excellent quality fluid I use in the Porsches and is racing-grade so it takes as hard of a beating as you can give it, but it's a bit overkill. Pentosin Super DOT4 LV is also good. The thing with brake fluid is you lose more performance from letting it sit than you gain from choosing one over the other. You should always your brake fluid whenever it's convenient. I'm real hard on brakes and I honestly am not great at writing down records as I used to be so I honestly just do it every single time I replace brakes or tires.
Yeah the pads and rotors kind of wear at the same rate, you'll need to change them at 2mm, itll squeal but I mean just use em up, you already paid for em.
Thanks for the input Chris. The SL6 and Super DOT4 seem like good viable options. Thats a good idea to replace the fluid every time you do brakes. Im just going to follow that thought process too, kind of hard to keep track of it like you said. I got some time before the rear pads give out and I think I'll be able to run a new set of rear pads with the oem rotors for 1 more cycle, or I might just replace the rear rotors too, we'll see. As for the front, I think once the pads wear out (currently at 7mm), it might be a good time to replace the front rotors too, will have to check the rotor thickness and if the wear divots are still there.
I'm currently running EBC Red Stuff on my 2020 C63S coupe. Ceramic material. My 3 qualifiers: stops good cold, little to no dust and zero noise. If run Red Stuff on a 650HP 09 GT500, an 09 AMG sedan, w/P1 & P2 pkgs, an 09 BMW 650i Sport. Can't get Red for my '18 Macan Turbo. Went with Yellow Stuff and new OE rotors and a brake flush. Impressive stopping power.
Last edited by ///Bruce; Jul 9, 2023 at 02:26 PM.
Reason: Mistake...
The rear OEM rotar doesn't have any wear indicator on mine. I feel a tiny groove and a tiny lip, only enough to tell its there. I guess I can wear them out and just change both pads and rotor.
My front still has plenty life left pad wise, I do see the wear indicator on the rotor and they look fine, but obviously some wear to them.
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