darbysan

'04 Cl500. I've got the normal soft close issues with the doors. If I just ignore the soft close feature, and slam the doors, is it bad?? Shutting the doors this way gets immediate action on the windows closing, vs waiting for up to 15 seconds for the soft close.

The soft close will work, both sides ( pulls in and latches), but it takes too long ( about 15 seconds) and times out after a few attempts. While I have a temporary fix available that will reset the pump on demand, I don't want to burn up the newly rebuilt pump, and I don't like to wait for the 15 seconds for the windows to raise after closing the doors. I think that resetting the pump is good for diagnostics, but not a long term solution.

I've rebuilt the pump, and tested for pressure ( Good!). The Trunk latch was epoxied and has no leaks, and works just fine. I've also "adjusted" the pressure switch on the pneumatic pump, and tested for actuation. Rear headrests work fine, as does the gas door lock and the regular door locks.

The question is whether it's worth the effort to pull both door latches and repair the leaks ( assuming I can locate the leaks)? I assume that I have a minor leak on the pressure side that prevents the pressure building in the line high enough to trigger the switch on the pump. I am assuming that once that pressure switch triggers, it tells the windows it's OK to move up ( or failing to trigger, it just times out and tells the window to close). Will finding and fixing the leak result in this speedy window action??

SoaDMTGguy

I'm looking at a car with this same issue, except the trunk also does not work. For your case, is it just the driver door or both doors? Are there common points of failure, or is it typically "entire system" or individual components piecemeal?

darbysan

The Pneumatic pump in the trunk drives the trunk closure, doors, rear headrests and seat lumbar support. If the system detects a failure on any of the branches, it can shut down just that branch. Over time, failures can cause the pump to run too long with eventual failure of the pump motor.

The trunk , doors and rear headrests all have plastic diaphrams that fail over time. They can be repaired, epoxied or replaced. It just takes some effort to remove and repair. The pump can also be repaired or replaced.

For the vehicle you are looking at, it could be a bad pump, or it could be a failure of the individual lock mechanisms. Try the rear headrest button on the dash. If the headrests come up / down, then the pump might still be good. If not, then my guess is that the pump, and maybe several of the other lock mechanisms, will need repair. Also try the remote lock button on the fob. It should lock / unlock the doors, and that is also driven by the pimp.

SoaDMTGguy

Thanks for the reply. The remote lock/unlock works. I didn't try raising the rear headrests. Lumbar support + Pulse works. Trunk was hard to lift up or down manually.

darbysan

Sounds like the pump works, so probably faulty door and trunk mechanisms. Could also be a bad line. You can pull the fuse ( 20 amp, behind passenger seat) and replace. That will reset the pump, and allow the locked out functions to attempt to work. After two failed tries, it will lock them out again.

The trunk might have Hydraulic assist. This is different from the Soft Close pneumatic system. Being hard to open is a sign that this is not working properly. In my case, it was a combination of bad gas shocks, needing to have the trunk "normalized" using the STAR system, and a bad switch on the trunk. There is also a hydraulic pump and cylinder under the battery in the trunk that could be bad. In my case, the trunk latch mechanism was also leaking, so the soft close did not work either.

SoaDMTGguy

Are both doors on the same line? I'm trying to look for common points of failures. I really appreciate all the knowledge you're dropping, this is very helpful! I could probably do most of this work myself, but if I were to have it done at a shop or dealer, what would I be looking at potentially, $2,000? $3,000? More?

darbysan

Each door is on a separate line. Only common point of failure is the pump. A repair is doable as a DIY. If you have the dealer repair, he will replace the door lock mechanisms rather than repair, about $700 ea for parts + labor, so $2000 for both is a ballpark figure.

SoaDMTGguy

DIY fix is patching holes with epoxy? I watched a video about disassembling the door… damn, there’s a lot of stuff in there!

If the soft-close is inoperable, is the door any less closed/sealed after being manually shut than otherwise? Is soft-close purely a connivence-of-closing feature?

darbysan

[QUOTE=SoaDMTGguy;8575445

If the soft-close is inoperable, is the door any less closed/sealed after being manually shut than otherwise? Is soft-close purely a connivence-of-closing feature?[/QUOTE]

That was the question I was trying to get answered in my original post. I know the door closes just fine. The soft close may be a feature, or it may be there to prevent slamming, and thus damaging internal components of the door. I just don't know, and I hope someone will respond to my original question, as I don't want to have to fix them if not necessary. It's a lot of work / cost, just for a "feature", but not if it's needed to protect the door, etc...

Hopefully someone with knowledge will pop up and help us both!

SoaDMTGguy

Ahh! Been so long I forgot what your original post said!

Do you notice anything different when driving it, or is the experience unchanged?

darbysan

No difference

tim687

I'd say fix it, softclosing doors without any motor running is one of the highest quality features you can get nowadays as all cars with softclose have a motor that pulls the door inwards.

It is a time consuming job to fix it though

SoaDMTGguy

Do all soft-close systems use a vacuum? I was thinking about it, and it seemed like it would be simpler for the latch mechanism to include a mechanical retractor.

tim687

On these cars they do, I know that the W221 uses a mechanical retractor. You might be able to retrofit it

darbysan

Well, I took the plunge to fix this problem. When I got both door cards off, the pneumatic cap was just hanging there, as suspected. I bought the repair kit, but when I got the locks out, both sides had a broken area around where the cap connects to the body. I had seen this issue on the Sticky, and tried to fix with JB weld. The JB weld worked, but I could not get either side to seal up well. $180 bucks down the drain.

I could find a new lock for the drivers side, but not for the passenger side. I bought the new driver's lock, and bought a used one on Ebay for the passenger side, where the cap had already been replaced. Used one came in with a leak in the lock cap ( small round white cap), which I was able to fix with some epoxy. Door lock operated OK when bench testing, but once installed in the door, it leaked on the Soft Close portion, so another $140 wasted. I should have left the original one in there. Soft close now works, but times out on the passenger side after a couple of rounds. Driver's side works perfectly. Since that is the side that gets the most use, and how many passengers even know or care about soft close, I think I'm done.

Lessons learned.
You can bench test if you have access to some air pressure ( I used my shop compressor with a regulator valve so I could keep it below 15 psi). Pressure applied should close the vacuum lock ( white cylinder).
Apply voltage across the Green and Yellow lines ( I used a 9 volt battery) to activate the solenoid, move the locking pawl to the second click, and apply air pressure. Latch should pull in and hold, and there should be no audible leaks. Note that I passed this test at 15 psi, but in the car, the leak was clearly audible ( like a whistle). I know the pump in the car can put out almost 30 PSI, so you might want to increase your test pressures.
Note that you can do these tests with the lock still in the car. You just have to disconnect the air supply and connector at the switch panel for the door lock ( 4 pin, Green/yellow/blue/brn wires).

There is a microswitch in the lock that you can also test while it is out. Use a voltmeter connected to the Blue and Brn wires in the same connector. Open the lock, and then move it slowly to the closed positions. Switch should be Open when the latch is open, Open when latch is in the 1st click, Closed when latch is in the 2nd click, and Open when fully closed. You may also be able to hear the microswitch operating when you carefully move the latch.

Last lesson learned. I had everything put back together, but wanted to test before I completely re-attached all of the panels, switches, etc. The soft close worked, windows worked, door locks worked, but I could not get the window to properly close. It wanted to stay in the slightly opened position. I re-calibrated the window several times, with no success. I finally found that there is a small microswitch under the latch in the B-pillar. Closing this microswitch caused the window to go up, and releasing it caused the window to go down 1/4", as it should. I always thought the microswitch in the latch was the trigger for this action, but it is the B pillar switch. Once all of the chrome trim at the back of the door is in place, the microswitch will actuate with the door closing.

Final thought. If the soft close is important to you, then consider buying new parts. I had no luck with the repair kit, and I had been forewarned by others who had the same experience. Buying a used one is also a crap shoot.