W209 M113 v W208 M113
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From: New Jersey
1999 AMG C43
W209 M113 v W208 M113
Can you guys tell me about the differences in the W209 (113.988) v the W208 (113.984) engines? powerbands, reliability, etc etc? prefer one over the other? aftermarket mods?
Last edited by mickey13; Dec 15, 2016 at 12:57 AM.
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From: New Zealand
I thought they were the same in terms of what you are asking, power reliability etc. I am pretty sure the front end is slightly different in terms of water pump, oil pump, pan and hose/pipe routing. Also there was a change in ecu between the early w208 and later w208 engines, I don't know about the w209.
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From: New Jersey
1999 AMG C43
well i have read that the last two 208 model years were updated in respect to me2.8, meaning they changed the connectors on the engine harness. there also seems to be an idea that the last two 208 model years also received a bump in compression, but i'm wondering if the bump in compression didn't come until 209.
so i have also read that the power bands between the 208 and 209 are different, where the 208 falls flat the 209 picks up a bit. my understanding is that the 209 has a different cam profile and strengthened heads. hoping you guys would have more details for me, regarding these things. and maybe also regarding differences between available aftermarket upgrades
209 comes with a bigger TB?
so i have also read that the power bands between the 208 and 209 are different, where the 208 falls flat the 209 picks up a bit. my understanding is that the 209 has a different cam profile and strengthened heads. hoping you guys would have more details for me, regarding these things. and maybe also regarding differences between available aftermarket upgrades
209 comes with a bigger TB?
Last edited by mickey13; Dec 15, 2016 at 10:21 PM.
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From: New Zealand
Yes that is correct with the newer ECU, faster processor, I think larger fuel/ignition tables etc. I can't help anymore sorry but I can say that the top end of the M113 is greatly hindered by the restrictive stock headers/downpipes so as long as you do mid or long tube headers then I think you will be pleased with the powerband regardless of the M113 variation. I would find the latest M113 available, things usually get better over the design life. Is this for a C43 swap?
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From: SCV SoCal
2002 CLK430
The U.S. didn't receive the CLK55 until the 2001 model year, so all CLK55s have ME 2.8. The bump in compression came with the 209. The 55 TBs are all the same part number, so they're the same size, but I think they've been NLA for a long while. The ME 2.8 430/500 TB is the same diameter as the OE 55, but a different part # than the OE AMG part. The NA 55 heads are all the same. In fact, it's the same part number as the 500; a 2020 and 2120.
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From: New Jersey
1999 AMG C43
have you ever heard of the evo engine?
http://www.mobilverzeichnis.de/merce...orenuebersicht
on epc, i only see 209 amg designation 113987 not 113988, but i see the 171 amg designation 113989
http://www.mobilverzeichnis.de/merce...orenuebersicht
on epc, i only see 209 amg designation 113987 not 113988, but i see the 171 amg designation 113989
Last edited by mickey13; Dec 16, 2016 at 12:11 AM. Reason: fixed link
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: New Jersey
1999 AMG C43
you're right though. all the heads are the same part number... really strange
edit: camshaft and spring part numbers are different on the evo designated engines
edit: camshaft and spring part numbers are different on the evo designated engines
Last edited by mickey13; Dec 16, 2016 at 12:30 AM. Reason: rechecked
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From: City with Tall buildings!
C43/55,2k11 Volvo S60 T6AWD,2k Audi B5 S4,95 Eagle Talon Tsi AWD 500+awhp
Suspension(better) and I think the tranny is different in the w209. Better exhaust system and klemann makes nicer headers for the w209. W208 lighter and feels faster. Both cars are reliable.
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From: Hotlanta
AMG
^^^Great to see you and Marcus on the boards!
To the OP - My (limited) understanding is the engines are virtually the same except for the following for U.S. Spec versions:
-Stock HP rating was 362 on the 209 vs 342 on the 208
-Stock torque was the same at 376 lb-ft
-Engine management was newer generation on the 209
-Rev limit was slightly higher on the 209
That said, in practical terms, the street/track performance was nearly identical. Many dynoed within 10whp of each other.
Good luck with your build!
To the OP - My (limited) understanding is the engines are virtually the same except for the following for U.S. Spec versions:
-Stock HP rating was 362 on the 209 vs 342 on the 208
-Stock torque was the same at 376 lb-ft
-Engine management was newer generation on the 209
-Rev limit was slightly higher on the 209
That said, in practical terms, the street/track performance was nearly identical. Many dynoed within 10whp of each other.
Good luck with your build!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 5,475
Likes: 5
From: City with Tall buildings!
C43/55,2k11 Volvo S60 T6AWD,2k Audi B5 S4,95 Eagle Talon Tsi AWD 500+awhp
^^^Great to see you and Marcus on the boards!
To the OP - My (limited) understanding is the engines are virtually the same except for the following for U.S. Spec versions:
-Stock HP rating was 362 on the 209 vs 342 on the 208
-Stock torque was the same at 376 lb-ft
-Engine management was newer generation on the 209
-Rev limit was slightly higher on the 209
That said, in practical terms, the street/track performance was nearly identical. Many dynoed within 10whp of each other.
Good luck with your build!
To the OP - My (limited) understanding is the engines are virtually the same except for the following for U.S. Spec versions:
-Stock HP rating was 362 on the 209 vs 342 on the 208
-Stock torque was the same at 376 lb-ft
-Engine management was newer generation on the 209
-Rev limit was slightly higher on the 209
That said, in practical terms, the street/track performance was nearly identical. Many dynoed within 10whp of each other.
Good luck with your build!
Member
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 171
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From: Finland
'14 E500 Coupe
And if you think about it those three thing are only factors that can do 20hp power diffirence in othervice same kind of engine.
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2001 Clk55 AMG
The 209 has better exhaust, and a higher redline. Which can account for hp numbers.
And it isn't uncommon for a manufacturer to stretch the truth a little to sell the new model.
I'm not trying to start an argument or step on anybody's toes, but I sure wish we could get past the he said she said thing.
And it isn't uncommon for a manufacturer to stretch the truth a little to sell the new model.
I'm not trying to start an argument or step on anybody's toes, but I sure wish we could get past the he said she said thing.
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From: Hotlanta
AMG
The 209 has better exhaust, and a higher redline. Which can account for hp numbers.
And it isn't uncommon for a manufacturer to stretch the truth a little to sell the new model.
I'm not trying to start an argument or step on anybody's toes, but I sure wish we could get past the he said she said thing.
And it isn't uncommon for a manufacturer to stretch the truth a little to sell the new model.
I'm not trying to start an argument or step on anybody's toes, but I sure wish we could get past the he said she said thing.
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From: Florida
2002 CLK 55 AMG cabriolet Eurocharged
I have read elsewhere in the forum W209 cams are preferred.
Swapping then questions the tune. If I locate a set reasonable we can get some data.
I am heading for the dyno this year.
Gator
Swapping then questions the tune. If I locate a set reasonable we can get some data.
I am heading for the dyno this year.
Gator
