factoid junkie

last fall there were a few articles out in the auto publishing world that attempted to compare and contrast these two cars. has anyone driven/owned/experienced both of them and can comment?

shoes

I owned both and did not like either one. The BMW rides too harshly, the driving experience is very removed and artificial, the interior is ugly and we won't mention I drive. The CLS is a styling exercise as far as I am concerned- all the good points of the E Class with less visibility and functionality.

factoid junkie

i appreciate your views - if you don't like them what's the interest in this forum? and what do you like more about your SL600?

shoes

I thought you were asking for feedback on these two cars- do you only want to hear good news?

What is there to like about the SL600? How about the torque and the retractable hardtop?

Luthor

When MB decided to make a coupe model based on its mid-tier sedan (the E Class) to compete against the 6 Series coupe (which is based on the mid-tier 5 Series sedan), the Benz boys had a great idea. An E Class-based coupe would rock, and a convertible model would sell out. Too bad the execution of this idea wasn't a coupe! The CLS is not a coupe. Instead, it's a sedan with poor visibility that bangs your head on the way in or out of the car.

Looks good on paper though. May work for short drivers with x-ray vision.

shoes

I am short but my X ray vision is faulty, no wonder I could not see anything out the sides or back. Loved parking too. My wife had no problems, but she drives with her eyes closed.

Luthor

Maybe the decision to build a faux-coupe (i.e., a coupe-styled sedan) reflects the pricing of the CLK real-coupe. The CLK coupe is derived from the entry-level C Class sedan. Though the C/CLK chassis is great, the E setup is superior -- and costlier to build, I expect. Perhaps MB concluded that introducing a real coupe based on the E Class would steal customers from the CLK and put pressure on the CLK's premium pricing margins, thereby negating the additional profits from sales to ex-BMW customers who might otherwise have bought a 6 Series coupe.

TammamB

IMHO, I was surprised at the visibilty you do get through the rear. Also I believe the 645 would be 'classed' with the CL. I never liked BM's rigid/stiff interior design, although i do like the i drive myself. I agree with Shoes the drive isn't as primal as it used to be.

I think the CLS is really different in that provides me with an excellent option, the sexiness of a coupe but the 'maturity' (or sophistication? i guess) of a four door. All I know is when I saw it, it hit a chord. Basically what Im trying to say is they might not be directly comprable (albeit in an odd and scattered sort of way :p ).

Enjoy,
TB

MBStar

I have just picked up a brand new (600 km on the odometer) CLS500 (sport
pckg) for a 2-3 day test drive over this week end.
My regular car is a lowered SL500 with Eisenmann exhaust and I am debating a
change to the 645 coupe which I think looks and sounds stunning. I have yet
to drive the 645 automatic (Monday), but the CLS is anything but "primal" to
drive. At 160 km/h I felt as though I was in a soundproof chamber being driven
by soemone else. The car pulled to the right, and the steerng shook terribly
at lower speeds (90 km/h), likely due to improper seating of the front tires.
I had no problems with its head room nor with the visibility

I can hardly imagine ANY car being more detached, more remote than the CLS
even with the Sport2 suspension setting.
I figure lowering it will be a must, and I hope it can be done just by resetting
the base level. It will need proper tires (I love the five double spoke E55 wheels
though) and the optional AMG exhaust (more subtle than the Eisenmann).

TammamB

I didn't mean to elude that the CLS felt primal...

but rather that the appeal of 645, or BMW in general, is the primal feeling which I think has been lost, making the 645 a secondary choice IMO...Porshe should make an Ultra-Luxury Coupe, I think they would do it right (primally speaking) :p

Luthor

They are planning to do this. It will be called "Panamera" (click the link). Supposedly due out in 2008.

TammamB

Damn...I hope it's not the final design, but Im sure it would be a worthy competitor. But no worries, I have a little less than three years with my CLS before I have to decide anyway :p (If it even lasts that long)

Thanks for the link

TB

MBStar

So I got the 2004 645 with 2000 km in the odometer for an extended test drive,
back to back with the CLS (see above). What a fabulous coupe!
Really there cannot be a comparison between these two cars: the CLS is an
oversized luxobarge for the E class drivers who want a more "hip" look, while the
645 is a legitimate Sports coupe. It handled well in all respects, and certainly is
preferable even to the CL500. Where it falls short, I feel, is in the fit and finish
where the CLS is considerably superior.
So there, folks I think we'll have to wait for the new CL (and the new CLK) to
catch up to our Bavarian friends in the coupe market

Natalie

I agree. If you live in Germany and drive the autobahn BMW's are better cars (been there, done that, got the "t" shirt). As an everyday drive machine, I want to feel comfortable and look good driving. I like the luxury and amenities the CLS has. IMHO if you really want a sports car, go Porsche, Ferrari, Lambo ect....... Compared to them BMW's are way out gunned.

W210

I would pick the CLS over the 645i anyday. Talking about amenities, is it true that the 645i doesn't even have a sunroof? And don't forget the poor ergonomics in the iDrive infected BMWs.

In fact, I would prefer a CLK over a 645i.

hcden

I think this comparison issue between the CLS and 645 really depends on each person's preferences. No single car can satisfy all of us here. Some people like touch of luxury and good ride while some like the pure sporty concrete-mixer ride car. These cars have their own pros and cons. I prefer the CLS too because it suits my needs and personal preference. At least it has a usable back seats for emergency (ie. 2-3 supermodels stranded on the road and need some lift. ) Its funny how some people brags that their car can sustain 0.05g more g than mine and 5mph faster (in typical slalom) than my car. Yeah right...as if that makes a big difference in real world driving.

Provocative

would pick the CLS over the 645i anyday. Talking about amenities, is it true that the 645i doesn't even have a sunroof? And don't forget the poor ergonomics in the iDrive infected BMWs.

It has a panoramic sunroof that does not slide backwards. It only tilts a few centimetres upwards. Quite disappointing if you ask me.

I don't understand what people have against i-drive. I think it's a "neat" system. It's easy to use contrary to what many people say.

The 645i drives very well. But as someone just mentioned you're better off getting a Porsche or a Ferrari if you're looking for a seminal sports car experience. I'd go for the CLS personally. Yes it may not drive as good but the design and finish is far superior. Not to mention all the available features. It's worth the money you're putting into it. The 645 is a little over-priced in my opinion.

MBStar

I can't resist two more cents' worth on this subject:
I agree that for the ultimate sports car you would not look to the CLS
or the 645. What we are talking about here though, is the "sports coupe"
genre, a member of which the CLS is purporting to be.
And in as much as this claim
can be made, the stock CLS falls short on SPORTS by a Bavarian Mile!!
Which does not mean that for a small investment it can't be modified to be an
acceptable member of this club. But stock to stock, apples to apples, the 645 is
truer to form than any MB product.
So there you are Natalie...you can both look good (which I am sure
you don't need a car for) AND drive a fab car....

MDCLS

2 test drives in the CLS for about 35 miles total. 4 drives in the 645i for about 75 miles. We really were in the market to replace the 530i with the 645i In driving comparison, it is almost apples to oranges trying to compare the CLS to the 645i. Didn't consider the CLS a "driver's machine" Any "sportiness" is an added bonus. We never considered the 5series. (The new 5 look still has not grown on us) The reasons we are jumping ship for the 1st time in years are:
1.Could not get past the trunk lid. Looks like an afterthought.Imho the car looks great from most angles but the lid sticks out like a sore thumb.
2.I-drive. Yes newer versions are much easier to use but still don't care for it.
3.Lack of rear seat room for hauling the teen daughter around when she isn't out driving on her own. Again sitting in the back felt like an afterthought.
4.Local stealer's tactics.
When seeing the CLS in person for the 1st time,our jaws dropped.Pictures didn't do it justice. Lust at 1st sight.

MBStar

But do consider having it lowered (about two hours labour by a SKILLED and willing MB technician) and AMG optional CLS (not CLS55) exhaust (probably not yet available).
For now I will keep my lowered "04 SL500 with Eisenmann exhaust.

WIldcat465

The CLS family grocery getter is not in the same class as the superior 645. As I've said before the CLS feels crowded, visibility is poor and it's overpriced. It's a pig dressed in a suit. The E-class, for example, is more functional and comfortable than the CLS. Although the 645 is no CL in terms of comfort and styling, it's miles ahead of the CLS.

Provocative

I beg to differ on that. It is the 645 that is overpriced. Compare the features and practicality of both cars and you'll arrive at the same conclusion.

Don't get me wrong the 645 is a good car. I say "good" because it drives and performs very well. It is an eye-catcher but so is the CLS.

As I've explained earlier, if you're looking for a car that handles like a race car you're better off with a Porsche or a Ferrari. The 645 is more of a "pseudo-sports car." A mixture of luxury and sport. The CLS is one of pure luxury. Take your pick.

adam76

Wildcat, jeez, i thought this forum was better off without you, and now youre back. u should keep your lame comments about the CLS to yourself, and stick to forums that you acutally know about. And you wonder why you get flamed? nice to see youre still plugging your CL, now you can plug something else!

Provocative

Adam

I would advise that you respect Wildcat's opinion. He has the right to vent and do as he pleases even if it stirs the emotions a little. He may think that the CLS is a family grocery getter but that does not make it necessarily so. As always not everyone will agree with the majority. Retaliation is not the best approach to counter such asinine claims.

However, I would also caution Wildcat. If you are to argue with such vehemence you need evidence and logic on your side. Just popping up to say that the CLS is a "pig dressed in a suit" reveals the paucity of your contribution and does not nothing weaken the car's credibility or it's value.

adam76

Provacative,

This guy just pops up to bash the CLS every now and then, check the history of posts...we went through this whole discussion before. This forum is for people who like the CLS and need to discuss legitimate issues, why waste space with negative comments, if you dont like the CLS, why even post in this forum? They need to create a "hater" forum for people like that...