GTR Broke Down and Wouldn't Start and Couldn't be Towed......
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From: Maryland
W212 E63 AMG S Model
That's poor engineering in my opinion. Yes, it may be an isolated incident, but the way these cars are meant to be driven (under track usage and lots of spirited driving), something that could cause that much catastrophic failure should be protected a lot better.
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‘24 BMW iX M60
Bish
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2018 AMG GTS, 2015 911 GT3, 2017 E300, 2014 X3 35i
Agreed isolated incident and not indicative of a systemic issue like my 991 GT3 engine.
Thread Starter
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2023 Urus Performante 2018 Huracan Perf. - 2017 Ferrari 488 GTB
Just a follow up after 3,395 miles now. No problem - fixed. Tech was right it was a one off situation. Was a crazy ordeal, but it's all behind me now.
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
Or maybe not a one-off... I’ve been stranded on the North London Orbital for five hours and I’ve just been shown the C63s diags is showing faults all over the shop (approximated wording of errors shown from memory):
Intercooler A comms failure
Throttle actuator B out of range
Coolant pump failure
Misfire cylinders 1, 2, and 3
Misfire cylinders random
Turbo A pressure low
[Electronic rear differential inoperative]
[Collision avoidance warning system inoperative]
[Traction control inoperative (this, combined with the engine starting to misfire and the diff suddenly becoming inoperative could have worked out very differently accelerating hard out of the roundabout I was on!)]
Hundreds of faults across multiple systems recorded looks like a CAN-bus issue to me. Now waiting for a tow truck before they can organise a courtesy car. Did I mention it is getting cold out here?!
[The errors in brackets were displayed on the dashboard, but not in the diagnostics]
Intercooler A comms failure
Throttle actuator B out of range
Coolant pump failure
Misfire cylinders 1, 2, and 3
Misfire cylinders random
Turbo A pressure low
[Electronic rear differential inoperative]
[Collision avoidance warning system inoperative]
[Traction control inoperative (this, combined with the engine starting to misfire and the diff suddenly becoming inoperative could have worked out very differently accelerating hard out of the roundabout I was on!)]
Hundreds of faults across multiple systems recorded looks like a CAN-bus issue to me. Now waiting for a tow truck before they can organise a courtesy car. Did I mention it is getting cold out here?!
[The errors in brackets were displayed on the dashboard, but not in the diagnostics]
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
Well, I’ve now been told they can’t get me a tow truck for another two hours and they will then will organise a car for me (which is a total wait time at the side of the road approx. 9 hours). I’ve given up and booked a hotel room, they're going to sort this out in the morning. Now I know why we buy AMG’s, not.
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W463 G550 / C190 GTC //prev: W204 C63 507 / R170
Well, I’ve now been told they can’t get me a tow truck for another two hours and they will then will organise a car for me (which is a total wait time at the side of the road approx. 9 hours). I’ve given up and booked a hotel room, they're going to sort this out in the morning. Now I know why we buy AMG’s, not.
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
It was related to my previous post about my car showing exactly the same symptoms, which shares the same engine and electrical system. The fact AMG left me on the North London Orbital for 24 hours was a result of this fault. The fault (and the lack of a decent recovery service) is likely to be common to both cars.
Member
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From: Waterloo, Ontario, Canada
'07 CL550
It was related to my previous post about my car showing exactly the same symptoms, which shares the same engine and electrical system. The fact AMG left me on the North London Orbital for 24 hours was a result of this fault. The fault (and the lack of a decent recovery service) is likely to be common to both cars.
I experienced a similar but less severe problem in my “old” BMW M240i last year caused by a bad chassis ground. The wipers, headlights, and some
computers went completely haywire due to a faulty chassis ground, but fortunately it didn’t affect the CAN bus. It was a one-off instance and they fixed it.
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
Agreed, the wire routing would likely be different, but the faults appear related, which is why I posted in this thread. I think a wet vs dry sump is a red herring here, but the electrical systems' similarity for these engines may be relevant - as does the relatively hard-sprung nature of the suspension of both cars.
After fourteen days or so, Mercedes came back saying the car was fixed, the problem was 'a blown fuse to the auxiliary coolant pump' and they 'rewired' something. The fact it was in there for two weeks and the use of the word 'rewiring', coupled with the sheer number of recorded faults (several hundred), suggests to me that there was a short to ground (likely the aux coolant pump wiring). In which case, I would guess this is could be a very similar issue, just a different wire rubbing against a piece of sharp metal.
I wasn't provided any written information about the repair.
After fourteen days or so, Mercedes came back saying the car was fixed, the problem was 'a blown fuse to the auxiliary coolant pump' and they 'rewired' something. The fact it was in there for two weeks and the use of the word 'rewiring', coupled with the sheer number of recorded faults (several hundred), suggests to me that there was a short to ground (likely the aux coolant pump wiring). In which case, I would guess this is could be a very similar issue, just a different wire rubbing against a piece of sharp metal.
I wasn't provided any written information about the repair.
Last edited by JeremyH; Dec 22, 2019 at 07:41 PM.
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Joined: Aug 2021
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From: Kingsport, TN
2016 MB AMG GTS, 2013 Porsche 911S, 2017 BMW X5, 1974 Lotus JPS Europa
Electronic Rear Differential Lock Inoperative, Transmission Malfuntion
I had nearly the exact problem as the original post from Benzbell. The problem was finally diagnosed as a frayed CAN cable located on the drivers side, rear hatch area. The cable was shorting to the frame due to abrasion, and the short to ground was intermittent. (Details about the cable are included early in this post.) This intermittent fault caused multiple error codes including; Electronic Rear Differential Lock Inoperative, Transmission Failure, Collision Avoidance System Inactive, Malfunction, and automatic shifting to "N", starter lockout, no start at all, etc. A short time later, the car would start and drive normally. But the next time it wouldn't start at all and throw multiple error codes again. When the cable vibrated/moved enough to clear the short, the car worked normally. The GTS has 20,000 miles and is driven infrequently. It is still at the dealer for the cable repair. We will see if this actually remedies the problem. However, the issue can be duplicated by moving the cable around, so obviously this is at least part of the fix.
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
Sounds like you're getting the same errors I was, although mine would also on occasion go into limp-home mode and cut the power dramatically. While getting the issue diagnosed was a pain, assuming they were both caused by a similar short, you should find the problem has been resolved when you get the car back. Unfortunately, I can't say for sure what happened with mine as they weren't very forthcoming (other than saying the aux coolant pump fuse had blown and that they replaced and rewired the pump).
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 359
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From: Rockport, TX
2007 S65 AMG-Sold, 2007 SL55 P030 - 2016 GL450 - - 2017 AMG GTS - Sold - 2015 AMG S65
I had nearly the exact problem as the original post from Benzbell. The problem was finally diagnosed as a frayed CAN cable located on the drivers side, rear hatch area. The cable was shorting to the frame due to abrasion, and the short to ground was intermittent. (Details about the cable are included early in this post.) This intermittent fault caused multiple error codes including; Electronic Rear Differential Lock Inoperative, Transmission Failure, Collision Avoidance System Inactive, Malfunction, and automatic shifting to "N", starter lockout, no start at all, etc. A short time later, the car would start and drive normally. But the next time it wouldn't start at all and throw multiple error codes again. When the cable vibrated/moved enough to clear the short, the car worked normally. The GTS has 20,000 miles and is driven infrequently. It is still at the dealer for the cable repair. We will see if this actually remedies the problem. However, the issue can be duplicated by moving the cable around, so obviously this is at least part of the fix.
https://mbworld.org/forums/coupe-roa...u-pin-out.html
If the ECU is getting bad or in complete signals all kind of side effects start to happen.
Best H
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Joined: Aug 2021
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From: Kingsport, TN
2016 MB AMG GTS, 2013 Porsche 911S, 2017 BMW X5, 1974 Lotus JPS Europa
CAN Cable Shorted to Chassis
I picked up the GTS at the dealer this morning. The cable repair is already completed so I cannot get a photo of the abraded wire. The repair included removing the cable bundle, insulating the abraded cable, and then wrapping the cable bundle with a strip of foam insulation. During troubleshooting, the cable could be moved around, and the car would throw error codes and/or shut down. It could be restarted when the cable was moved to another position, only to fail again when released. The cable is located in the rear tool compartment, drivers side. Remove the left rear side panel where the tow hook is stored. Once removed you have a clear view of a fuse block and various cable bundles. The abraded cable was in the upper section of this area and close to the fuse block connector. I can send a pic of the repair, but I doubt it will be of any use due to the very tight quarters. The cable that was shorting to ground was one of the two CAN leads. This two conductor network cable connects all modules and sensors to the data bus that feeds the ECU. The cable carries a high or low signal, and when grounded, that confuses the ECU with multiple failure codes. I'm certain if a MB tech is reading this they are saying I am completely misinformed. Well, so be it. But, this repair solved my problem, and the car is back to normal, with a confirmed insulation cut on the main bus cable due to abrasion on the frame. I'm an electronics engineer, and I know two things: 1. Vehicle wiring on new cars is a holy nightmare, and 2. But for a post on this forum, my car might still be at the dealership.
Last edited by jemilhorn; Aug 16, 2021 at 04:03 PM. Reason: typo
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Posts: 359
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From: Rockport, TX
2007 S65 AMG-Sold, 2007 SL55 P030 - 2016 GL450 - - 2017 AMG GTS - Sold - 2015 AMG S65
Thank you for posting this information...
I picked up the GTS at the dealer this morning. The cable repair is already completed so I cannot get a photo of the abraded wire. The repair included removing the cable bundle, insulating the abraded cable, and then wrapping the cable bundle with a strip of foam insulation. During troubleshooting, the cable could be moved around, and the car would throw error codes and/or shut down. It could be restarted when the cable was moved to another position, only to fail again when released. The cable is located in the rear tool compartment, drivers side. Remove the left rear side panel where the tow hook is stored. Once removed you have a clear view of a fuse block and various cable bundles. The abraded cable was in the upper section of this area and close to the fuse block connector. I can send a pic of the repair, but I doubt it will be of any use due to the very tight quarters. The cable that was shorting to ground was one of the two CAN leads. This two conductor network cable connects all modules and sensors to the data bus that feeds the ECU. The cable carries a high or low signal, and when grounded, that confuses the ECU with multiple failure codes. I'm certain if a MB tech is reading this they are saying I am completely misinformed. Well, so be it. But, this repair solved my problem, and the car is back to normal, with a confirmed insulation cut on the main bus cable due to abrasion on the frame. I'm an electronics engineer, and I know two things: 1. Vehicle wiring on new cars is a holy nightmare, and 2. But for a post on this forum, my car might still be at the dealership.
But do appreciate the fact that you took the time to share your experience here.
Thank you,
Best H
Newbie
Joined: Aug 2021
Posts: 3
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From: Kingsport, TN
2016 MB AMG GTS, 2013 Porsche 911S, 2017 BMW X5, 1974 Lotus JPS Europa
To JeremyH: I had a "limp mode" issue last year with the GTS. There were absolutely no error codes, but the car would not generate more than 150 HP. After a couple of days at the dealership, no progress was made, so they hooked up to the MB diagnostic computer in Germany and let the techs there look at the engine parameters. Nothing was found, so they "re-flashed" the fuel computer. That fixed the problem, and I have had no similar issues since. No indication as to what might have caused the fuel computer to lose it's mind, but the re-flash fixed it. Too many computers, too many cables, too many connectors, too many sensors, too many..... And I have worked with manufacturing computer design and control systems for years. But vehicle ECU's, modules, and CAN's are an entirely different matter.
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Mercedes AMG C63s Coupe
I have to admit, it was driving me nuts. I would overtake someone and then find the power cut dramatically when I slowed down after the manoeuvre - I was starting to get concerned about it happening while I was overtaking (it never did). My estimate was about 150bhp too, which makes an almost 2 tonne car feel very slow!
Once the car came back from the dealer following its complete ECU meltdown (I seem to recall the breakdown service said there were some errors recorded 100's of times in the log), it never happened again.
Once the car came back from the dealer following its complete ECU meltdown (I seem to recall the breakdown service said there were some errors recorded 100's of times in the log), it never happened again.
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2025 Lucid Air Grand Touring, 2022 F-150, 1926 Rolls-Royce SSG roadster
I always ask for replaced parts. As to those the dealer says must be sent back to the factory I ask to inspect them.
