btlackey

So if you were an avid track guy (20+ years SCCA, driving instructor, etc...), which would you choose? 50% track, 50% street. (So Cal) I know the easy answer is the GT-R, it's focused much more towards the track. But... I generally modify most cars I get. Partly because that's 1/2 the fun of a track toy, and partly to get them to level of track worthiness I'm looking for. Coilovers, brakes, swaybars, seats, rollbar, tires and wheels, wing, etc... Not turning it into a racecar, but think GT3 / GT3RS equivalent.

So if you're going to replace or upgrade is there anything you are getting on the GT-R that makes it significantly more desirable as a starting place vs the GT-S? There is a fairly large cost delta, between the two.

UCIMBZ

Adjustable traction control for one thing. You may still do all what you mentioned to a GTR. You just start with a more capable platform to begin with.

Hhccc1

I am not a owner yet but I am planning to purchase one when the market has a spec I like. I choose the gtr over gts when considering because of its wide body, rear wheel steering, the traction control, and its exhaust design(factory resonator delete and straight piping in titanium). I think those features aren't really possible to do aftermarket, or can be done but it is very costly or difficult. I believe the engine is changed in a certain way as well but I am not sure exactly where and if it is doable aftermarket. For me, I think that those features are what made the gtr great and it is what I believe to be the version of the gt platform that is the most worth it. However it obviously differs from people, but I believe that because of those features, the gtr isn't just a modified gts, but the gtr definitely has what it takes to be a seperate model. I would recommend test driving both to see if the extra features of the gtr that cannot be modified is worth it.

AndrewFerg

There are dozens upon dozens of articles and reviews about the GTR with direct and indirect comparisons to the GTS. I'd refer you to do some research and read all of those, and then I believe you wouldn't ask to compare the two for the purposes you describe. In my opinion there is no comparison. The only reason you would go with the GTS is financial - and even then it could easily be argued that the GTR is a better investment because you'll get a lot more out of it when you sell it. Buy high, sell high, versus buy low and sell even lower. If you're trying to find the best car to be a daily driver and also track suitable, you should consider the GTC coupe for both price and value and capability.

Skilly

It would be very costly to dial in a GTS to a GTR spec

- different engine config (beyond ECU tuning)
- adjustable traction control
- rear adjustable spoiler
- rear diffuser (and its aero attributes)
- front active aero
- suspension
- rear wheel steering
- wider stance
- various other attributes to improve stability (like center brace etc)
- items in CF for weight management like front fenders and torque tube

virtually none of those matter on the road (and for some would detract from road enjoyment), but on the track with your experience, you will notice. It would cost more than the delta in price to get these things (sans adjustable TC), so it depends what you are after.

To give you a sense of how these changes affect track performance, we can look at the lap time at Nürburgring Nordschleife:

GTS - 7:33.04
GTR - 7:10.92
GTR Pro - 7:04.63
GTR BS - 6:43.61

Granted, comparing the BS is kind of unfair, its in the family but its just a relative on steriods!

AMG 17GT

I’ve driven both at COTA, And there’s simply no comparison on the track. The GTR has greater limits in all areas and stays flatter, due to the wider track and aero, especially on long sweeping turns.

That said I have not driven the GTR on the street, but I can’t imagine it being that much more uncomfortable as the car was very plush on the track. If there was a complaint I would have with the GTR is that it needed a tune to match the increased handling limits, especially throttle response. I would have a GTR right now but for all the Alcantara on the interior, which looks like sh-it as a daily.

If you are tracking at least four times a year, I would say GTR.

thebishman

I find your quote re: 'throttle response' for the GT-R on track to be interesting as it was super responsive in both my personal GT-R AND the many different GT-Rs I drove at COTA and LS with the Academy. I always placed them in 'Race' mode, but even in 'Sport +' the throttle response is very rapid.

Also: the GTS is a very capable road course car IMHO. A small amount of money, (in comparison to the delta between it and a GT-R), spent on a mild ECU tune; suspension; brakes and tires would get an experienced DE driver pretty damn close to the track times of what most of those drivers could obtain with the GT-R. Granted that money wouldn't be realised when it came time to trade/sell the GT-S versus the GT-R, but if planing on keeping the GT-S for some years it would be money well spent.

Go Dawgs

The GTC could be a good middle ground for you.

Skilly

This. Id say the only time I have ever had an issue with throttle response is if I am climbing out of my Taycan Turbo and comparing the electric response to the ICE. Race and Sport + are my preferred driving mode, but if Im comparing it objectively, throttle response isnt an issue in these cars.

ArabianOak

Just get the Aston Martin Vantage and get the benefit of having the MB Motor AND looking like James Bond on the track...can't beat that!

hyperion667

How about some pix, or a link to pix?

Go Dawgs

Spoken like a true Aston owner.. on the AMG forum. Lol!

Skilly

James Bond and the move to align with Daimler in 2013 pretty much saved the brand from being a complete dumpster fire. Nostalgia from that original DB5 is what people are drawn to from the brand. Really, they were notoriously unreliable for some time, Ford buys them and they trade reliability with the adoption of mainstream parts from run of the mill Ford and Mazdas...those 323 tail lights on the DB7..that was such a weird move to cut costs. Surprised they survived really...that is almost single handedly from Bond films.

They have come a long way from their low. Maybe they continue to develop into something more with their deeper dive into Formula 1.

JSwan724

It doesn’t look good……
Aston Martin pumps yet more cash from investors

September 6 2022, The Times

London’s only listed carmaker is going through the latest of a series of fundraisings with a deeply discounted, highly dilutive rights issue.

The news sent shares Aston Martin Lagonda crashing — not for the first time — by more than 75p, or 15.6 per cent, yesterday to close at 405p. The company started the session valued at £560 million; it finished it with a market cap of little more than £470 million.

Nearly four years on from an ill-fated £4.3 billion flotation, Aston Martin is raising a total of £653 million, including a £575 million rights issue, to mend a balance sheet stacked with £1.2 billion of net debt, much of it at eye-watering interest rates.

Skilly

didn't Bond drive a DBS?

AMG 17GT

And Tobias left already ? That was fast. And he gave them the hyper car access.

JSwan724

Unfortunately for them, Tobias was forced out. Politics.

UCIMBZ

The Vantage does look like a re-imagined GT. The only deviation I found attractive in that car is the manual shift option which I wish it would have been available just as an option for the AMG.

ZephyrAMG

I have to hand it to Aston for their interiors though...just works of stitching art and high grade materials.

boosted20v

I like what Aston has done especially with the manual option but once you get inside it all goes down hill. They ruined it with that dashboard design, it's just flat out odd with it's square shapes throughout.

luvair

I’ve owned Aston’s, so was a big fan.

The new ones, to each their own - I now prefer modern electronic features, not predated MB displays. Plus not having a front lift, seems a must for a daily driver luxury GT automobile.

Also disappointed with the direction and financial stability of AML. Seems the SUV is AM only strong seller.

I am surprised too, they cannot at least to date - have the F1 team at least to be competitive in top tier.

That all said, I still like the newer DBS Superleggera a bunch.

Acta_Non_Verba

An Aston is still on my bucket list. Some cars (for better or worse) I want to go a round with just to make my own personal conclusions. A brand new DBS showed up at our Cars Coffee a couple of months back. Beautiful car, it was....

Skilly

Comparing a Vantage to a DBS is kind of like comparing a McLaren 570 to a 765

These are SO gorgeous!

TriggrPullrUSMC

I feel the same. I use Race mode almost exclusively and contrary to some opinions I like the ride comfort. I was a bit less happy with it in the SF Bay area but the roads here in Miami while less twisty ad certainly much better. I accidentally got the car up to a pretty good clip the other day on a nice piece of highway and it was amazing. The throttle response is bang on for me. Love everything about this car although at 6'4 I'd like a bit more head room and I feel the cars should come standard with a member of the Swedish Bikini Team. Several letters on that suggested feature to Mercedes Benz corporate have not yet been replied to but I realize they are probably busy. If I can get us all GT R owners new model Swedish bikini it will have been worth the wait.

PS: And to show I am not a sexist I also asked for pre bird strike Fabio (alternatively People magazines 2021 sexiest man of the year Paul Rudd) clones for any women GT R owners. Although I don't think either is that big of a deal- I still asked. I am altruistic that way.

TriggrPullrUSMC

How dare you Sir! Besides James is unAmerican- a US Marine would be a better look on the track. James is a short **** and uses a woman's pistol. A real hero would carry a Wilson Combat.