Rickster36

Hi Folks, this is my first post and I'm seeking the help of all of the experts on this site.First of all I'll give you an insight of what I want to do. Like most people in this world I'm fed up with the price of gasoline, but instead of just "beefing" about it I intend to do something positive that will help myself, and help others who are interested in doing the same thing. Number one is to build a hydrogen generator that will fit under the hood and be run by the battery(others are already doing it). Number two is to build a circuit that will change the regular spark at the plug to a plasma spark which will improve the burn rate of the gasoline/hydrogen mix thereby giving more power and better fuel mileage. The problem I have is that my present car is a 97 328i BMW who's engine fills the complete under-hood cavity. After spending the last couple of months looking at suitable candidates for this I have decided that the car I want must be a MB and an E-Class (W124) in particular. Reason? Well built and affordable to me (I'm retired!).So which engine should I choose? The M103 or M104? I know they both have head problems, but which has less? The M103 has more room around the engine but from photos it looks like the M104 may just have sufficient. Is the S320 worth considering or is it just added weight? Eagerly awaiting any responses.
Cheers, Rick

STLe320

Personally, I LOVE my m104.

PaulX608

M119 is nice as well. My opinion may well be quite biased, though.

rivcal4life

I dont think a V8 is going to help his MPG. Go with the M103, more reliability over the M104. Also, as I understand, they are easier to work on as well. Not to mention they should be cheaper.

battlecat714

M119 -.036! To the OT & Justin: gas prices are going down

190E 16V

M119 is a V8 and effectively fills the engine compartment.

fred1948

Good luck with your project. This is a subject that intrigues me but from the reading that I have done I have concluded that there are several pitfalls.
I think that you should be more concerned about the engine management system than whether it is an M103 or M104. You will have to trick the electronics to keep it from adding fuel to correct what it thinks is a lean condition. Also, the hydroxy makes the fuel burn much faster and the engine temperature can be a problem. I would think that a plasma spark would not be necessary.
I recently purchased a plasma torch and must say that it seems like there should be some way to take advantage of this technology in the automotive engine.
If you haven't heard about Crower's work on a 6 stroke engine then you should be interested in this link.

RHW

I run a 103s in 2 cars and 104s in 2 cars.

The difference in operating cost is more than made up for by the difference in horsepower, imo.

One of my 103s is in a 4-matic Estate Wagon - that car is dog slow.

(it is looking forward to the winter though, both convertibles will be winterized this week, and the wagon comes out of hiding)

STLe320

What about your sportline?
Is that one of your winter drivers?

GEDaggett

I bought a E320 with the 104 and it is really nice especially acceleration 35-110mph but I am going to sell it for the 119 e420. Maybe cause I am more of a gear head than a crusier but If I can't have a 500 I at least want a little more POP. As far as the s320 or S420 I have driven a number of them and they are more of night on the town than a weekend on the road car, if that makes any sense, Kinda big, bulky and boat like compared to the E-class. My thinking has always been the S class is what you are driven in but the E-class is what you drive.

RHW

If my gf dumps her Honda Pilot I am giving her the wagon... so mebe down to driving the Sportline this winter. (GF and I have been together over 10 yrs so giving back and forth w Becky is family like)

I would admit to scoping around a little for a 95 wagon in case I lose my '90 wagon. It would have to be a steal, cuz I am car broke, and Becky says she's keeping the Pilot money.

rivcal4life

Freakin Georgie. Did you even read the original post silly? haha MPG is his main concern over anything else at this point.

yeah Ive noticed the decline too. Thank God.

RHW

He wants some working room in the engine cavity, so methinks V8s are not an option.

PaulX608

Yeah, I didn't read the whole thing carefully

Just promoting wonderful V8 W124's!!

battlecat714

haha! Well then settle on an m103 then - pretty strong, durable cars with good mpg.

Even though gas prices really are coming down...

ronald7410

Welcome bro. V8 if your planning to go fast!

Rickster36

Hi Guys,thanks for all the replies to my first post. Since sending it I've tried out a couple of 300E's and was pleasantly surprised at the good handling.They both had the M103 engine and there's plenty of room for what I would like to do.Mind you, I'm not too old to enjoy horsepower so I'm going to see if I can find a 320E to look at and see what kind of spare room there is around the M104.Unfortunately there aren't too many MB's for sale in Ottawa so it may mean a trip to Toronto which is five hours away.The things we do for our cars!

Saijin_Naib

I've got some room in my bay with the m104, it's not as empty as the m103 bay but its still rather open.

cabriolad

Sounds like an interesting idea....








Here are some pics of the engine of my E320 1995 Cabriolet...104 engine. Maybe they will help in your consideration before driving 5 hours.

4 ft ruler in photo for scale

Rickster36

Thanks for the photos Cabriolad; they really help a lot. The size of the hydrogen generator I have in mind will be roughly 5"x4"x10" long so it looks like I could squeeze one in there. Obviously, the larger the better. Looking at the top view, another idea presented itself, and that was to place one in the space presently occupied by what appears to be the windshield washer bottle(next to the intake filter) and make myself another bottle to fit whatever space I find.There's also enough room for the electronics boards. One to fool the computer when it thinks that the engine is running lean, and the other for changing the regular spark at the plug into a plasma spark. The latter is something that a group called "waterforfuel" is working on, on the "freeenergy forum" and three members have modified their vehicles and are finding that their engines run smoother with more power. Hopefully it won't be too long until I find "my Benz" and can get cracking on all I want to do. Incidentally, I emailed a guy a couple of hours ago for details on the 1995 E320 he has for sale. Cheers, Rick

cabriolad

Hi Rick.
Glad the photos of are some help. I f you need me to take some dimensions let me know.

If you've looked at the board you'll see that there are two particular problems that plague the E320 104.
The upper wiring harness over the engine tends to degrade and crack. This is due to Mercedes attempting to find a biodegradable plastic compoundin the early/mid 90's. This part is about 800 to buy and another 1200 to have installed. Most people onthe forum say that it can easyily be installed by a good do it yourselfer (which you seem to be).
The other issue is the head gasket which may leak. This is another thousand dollar job at least, though the gasket itself probably runs less than 30 US.
Check with the seller to see what has been done to remedy these problems. These issues seem to crop up around 60-80K miles.

cabriolad

Hi Rick.
Glad the photos of are some help. If you need me to take some dimensions let me know.

If you've looked at the board you'll see that there are two particular problems that plague the E320 104.
The upper wiring harness over the engine tends to degrade and crack. This is due to Mercedes attempting to find a biodegradable plastic compoundin the early/mid 90's. This part is about 800US to buy and another 1200 to have installed. Most people on the forum say that it can easily be installed by a good do it your selfer (which you seem to be).
The other issue is the head gasket which may leak. This is another thousand dollar job at least, though the gasket itself probably runs less than 30 US.
Check with the seller to see what has been done to remedy these problems. These issues seem to crop up around 60-80K miles.
Best of luck