W211 Transmisson / torque problems
Almost a Member!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
From: Paris
2003 E 500 - Full option
Originally Posted by RJC
Thanks. I feel sick 
I suspect that it started after a very cool period (-5 ° C) when the car was parked outside.
Then I noticed that downshifting becomes to be "sensible" not realy harsh.
Then once running in the parking lot of a supermarket very slowly: the car the transmission was jerking. Once the car started again the symtom desapeared.
Then several months later (maybe 2), the real symtoms began: vibrations under accelerations.
regarding the radiator: I am pretty sure it was a Behr because I was surprised that such a high quality brand could fail (Valeo would have not surprised me).
But maybe MB in France made a wrong diagnosis (the oil was not analysed but looks a little contaminated) and it was the other cause mentioned in the thread (control unit), but when I took the car back I noticed again once angain some light jerking in first gear whe driving slowly and some harsh behaviour.
This time fade up: I asked MB to take the car back and to make me a good deal on a CLS. They never replied. I sold the car one year ago. It was under MB waranty. No new since that.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
LOL.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Almost a Member!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
From: Paris
2003 E 500 - Full option
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
LOL.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
From: Chicago, IL
03 E320 & 02 CLK320
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
Yes, RJC, you are correct, 211,209,203's are all affected..
Any info on odds of being impacted? I'm suspecting I may have this issue but am not positive...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,061
Likes: 326
From: 2000 ft over the FL coast in a B-17
Various
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
LOL.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
1) What % of cars made up till 9/03 are being effected so far; would you venture to guess?
2) Will MB do anything on a preventative basis rather than just wait for total transmission failure and a very expensive bill; not to mention more dissatisfied MB consumers?
Wouldn't it make sense (not implying car manufactures are sensible) to replace radiators in the cars produced within this limited VIN range before the trans self destructs?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,439
Likes: 1
From: THE NAPA VALLEY, CA
Build date 2-04 E500
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 666
Likes: 4
From: Boston, MA USA
03 E320 -wife's car now; 07 Porsche Boxster S - my toy
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
LOL.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Anyway, the vehicles affected are only 211, 209, 203's up to production date of 9/2003, so if your vehicle was manufactured after that date then ur o.k.
I have replaced more than a dozen Valeo radiators and transmissions. I have seen and tested atf with coolant contamination using Valeo radiators. I have not had any with a Behr radiator. They will likley fail before vehicle is out of fact. warrenty, so dont worry. The MB technical bullitin identifys Valeo as the faulty product. If you want to believe guess-work and myths you can. But I give the facts...in which are documented clearly. The transmissions in general are good. It is the same one MB has been using for almost 10 years. The new transmission came in '05. The 7 speed.
Is there a method that an owner can use to test for glycol in ATF? Does MB have a test kit available for this? Thanks.
Regards,
Paul....
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
Originally Posted by HELL ONA HARLEY
Just to set the record straight, 04 was the first year of the 7 speed...
Newbie
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
From: California
Mercedes 03 E500
I'm really worried now
Just left my E500 at local dealer. Was given a loaner E320. As I pulled away, I was shocked by the quick acceleration and power the loaner had as compared to mine!! I returned to dealer and asked, and was told maybe mine was set on "C". I confirmed it was set on "S" setting which puts it in first gear upon starting. After reading this thread, I am worried that I may, too have the dreaded radiator problem, since from the time I got the car, it's been jerking and bucking at very low speeds if I take my foot off the accelelerator. However, each time I mentioned it dealer could not confirm problem. Is the jerking an early sign of radiator leakage? My car is a late 03 replacement car with a build date of July03. 
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
[QUOTE=mr.louie]Just left my E500 at local dealer. Was given a loaner E320. As I pulled away, I was shocked by the quick acceleration and power the loaner had as compared to mine!! I returned to dealer and asked, and was told maybe mine was set on "C". I confirmed it was set on "S" setting which puts it in first gear upon starting. After reading this thread, I am worried that I may, too have the dreaded radiator problem, since from the time I got the car, it's been jerking and bucking at very low speeds if I take my foot off the accelelerator. However, each time I mentioned it dealer could not confirm problem. Is the jerking an early sign of radiator leakage? My car is a late 03 replacement car with a build date of July03. [/
I know what you are talking about with the jerking...no, I dont think the rad. leakage is the prob. And I really dont know the fix either for that. I had another problem with a trans on a e500 211--(slippage) and also, he was concerned about the jerking as you described... I put in all new clutch discs and thicker snap-rings to minimize the clutch free play in for the "slip"...as it turns out the jerking never reoccured...so ???? Nobody really can tell when the Valeo radiators will fail...and cause damage..it may never. A minor leak from the trans can cause all sorts of shifting problems so dont assume the worst. As far as the "power" increase you felt in the loaner---How do people normally drive loaner cars?? They dog the **** out of them. The transmission and fuel mixture has most likley adapted to this driving style.
[/I know what you are talking about with the jerking...no, I dont think the rad. leakage is the prob. And I really dont know the fix either for that. I had another problem with a trans on a e500 211--(slippage) and also, he was concerned about the jerking as you described... I put in all new clutch discs and thicker snap-rings to minimize the clutch free play in for the "slip"...as it turns out the jerking never reoccured...so ???? Nobody really can tell when the Valeo radiators will fail...and cause damage..it may never. A minor leak from the trans can cause all sorts of shifting problems so dont assume the worst. As far as the "power" increase you felt in the loaner---How do people normally drive loaner cars?? They dog the **** out of them. The transmission and fuel mixture has most likley adapted to this driving style.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
Originally Posted by paulv
Is there a method that an owner can use to test for glycol in ATF? Does MB have a test kit available for this? Thanks.
Regards,
Paul....
Regards,
Paul....
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
Originally Posted by RJC
Mine was manufactured 7/03, one of the first 04's
1) What % of cars made up till 9/03 are being effected so far; would you venture to guess?
2) Will MB do anything on a preventative basis rather than just wait for total transmission failure and a very expensive bill; not to mention more dissatisfied MB consumers?
Wouldn't it make sense (not implying car manufactures are sensible) to replace radiators in the cars produced within this limited VIN range before the trans self destructs?
1) What % of cars made up till 9/03 are being effected so far; would you venture to guess?
2) Will MB do anything on a preventative basis rather than just wait for total transmission failure and a very expensive bill; not to mention more dissatisfied MB consumers?
Wouldn't it make sense (not implying car manufactures are sensible) to replace radiators in the cars produced within this limited VIN range before the trans self destructs?
2) I doubt it...everyone knows how slow mb is to react....look at the harmonic balancers. But if they dont do anything....I would guess mb will goodwill transmissions and rads for the affected vehicles for an extended period.
3) Definatly. They must not be having that many (per capita) fail...or ???
I think alot of people are dissatisfied, not only with 211's but all mb's. But basically your car is a computer on wheels times 36, with pnumatics, hydraulics, fiber-optics, CAN, etc...you ever look at the steering wheel control switches...3 wires. 3 little wires for all the features you can command from your steering wheel. Lexus will copy this in 4 years or so...thats why they have fewer problems...they wait to copy---then perfect. How many times does your computer lock-up in a year? Oh yea...I forgot..we are talking about a simple ol' radiator...WHY!!MB, WHY!!!
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,061
Likes: 326
From: 2000 ft over the FL coast in a B-17
Various
Originally Posted by 516mbtek
1) No, I only see the ones that fail.
2) I doubt it...everyone knows how slow mb is to react....look at the harmonic balancers. But if they dont do anything....I would guess mb will goodwill transmissions and rads for the affected vehicles for an extended period.
3) Definatly. They must not be having that many (per capita) fail...or ???
I think alot of people are dissatisfied, not only with 211's but all mb's. But basically your car is a computer on wheels times 36, with pnumatics, hydraulics, fiber-optics, CAN, etc...you ever look at the steering wheel control switches...3 wires. 3 little wires for all the features you can command from your steering wheel. Lexus will copy this in 4 years or so...thats why they have fewer problems...they wait to copy---then perfect. How many times does your computer lock-up in a year? Oh yea...I forgot..we are talking about a simple ol' radiator...WHY!!MB, WHY!!!
2) I doubt it...everyone knows how slow mb is to react....look at the harmonic balancers. But if they dont do anything....I would guess mb will goodwill transmissions and rads for the affected vehicles for an extended period.
3) Definatly. They must not be having that many (per capita) fail...or ???
I think alot of people are dissatisfied, not only with 211's but all mb's. But basically your car is a computer on wheels times 36, with pnumatics, hydraulics, fiber-optics, CAN, etc...you ever look at the steering wheel control switches...3 wires. 3 little wires for all the features you can command from your steering wheel. Lexus will copy this in 4 years or so...thats why they have fewer problems...they wait to copy---then perfect. How many times does your computer lock-up in a year? Oh yea...I forgot..we are talking about a simple ol' radiator...WHY!!MB, WHY!!!
Thanks
Newbie
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
From: California
Mercedes 03 E500
Thanks 516mbtek
I just want to thank you for your quick replys to all of our questions. They are extremely helpful to me, and I am sure to the rest of us on this site. I am a little more hopeful that what I'm experiencing is not necessarily anything as serious as the radiator leakage, and hope that those who were unlucky will have the problem resolved by MB. Thanks again for your help, 516mbtek.
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
Originally Posted by mr.louie
I just want to thank you for your quick replys to all of our questions. They are extremely helpful to me, and I am sure to the rest of us on this site. I am a little more hopeful that what I'm experiencing is not necessarily anything as serious as the radiator leakage, and hope that those who were unlucky will have the problem resolved by MB. Thanks again for your help, 516mbtek.
your welcome
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 315
Likes: 0
From: HOUSTON, TX
'06 CLS55 P030
Originally Posted by RJC
Thanks for the feeback. Let me ask #1 in a different way. Out of all the 2003 E's and 2003 CLK's you see what percentage has come in for the radiator/trans issue?
Thanks
Thanks
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,061
Likes: 326
From: 2000 ft over the FL coast in a B-17
Various
Thanks 516 mbtek for all the above info. I checked my radiator again and it's a Valeo and made in France. I went to Valeo's web site,and they have plants all over Europe. I'm hoping the French produced radiators are OK but my Vin falls right into the effected range.
Here's a link to Valeo in this page and you can see where specific items are made; they make lots of things for cars.http://www.valeo.com/automotive-supplier/Jahia/pid/12
Here's a link to Valeo in this page and you can see where specific items are made; they make lots of things for cars.http://www.valeo.com/automotive-supplier/Jahia/pid/12
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: London, UK
CLK 320
Hi dyn,
I am experiencing similar problem, late 2002 CLK with 16000 miles only. humming noise from rear and jumping gears, judder in uphill climbs. Early December MB could not find any fault whatsoever with the car, then just after chritmas MB mobile mechanic thought it was the diff, but yesterday my MB local dealership says transmission damage caused by leaking coolant - new gear box and coolant system required costing mega bucks for what I still consider to be a brand new vehicle. Major problems like this should not occur these days.
I have managed to agree that MB (Germany) will pay for the replacement parts, however I am left with the very large labour bill for 20% of the repair. I AM NO LONGER A HAPPY MB OWNER.
I am experiencing similar problem, late 2002 CLK with 16000 miles only. humming noise from rear and jumping gears, judder in uphill climbs. Early December MB could not find any fault whatsoever with the car, then just after chritmas MB mobile mechanic thought it was the diff, but yesterday my MB local dealership says transmission damage caused by leaking coolant - new gear box and coolant system required costing mega bucks for what I still consider to be a brand new vehicle. Major problems like this should not occur these days.
I have managed to agree that MB (Germany) will pay for the replacement parts, however I am left with the very large labour bill for 20% of the repair. I AM NO LONGER A HAPPY MB OWNER.
Originally Posted by dyn
Help
I drive a late 2002 registered (uk) E270cdi with auto tiptronic (one of the very first w211) with less than 30,000 miles, recently I started to have problems with the speed as the car slips as I try pull away, then jolts very badly as if the handbrakes were on and it does not want to move. sometimes when I take my foot off the acceleration and try to pull away again it jolts agains and then responds but when I try to move faster same problem again. I took it to the garage and after various test they said it a transmission problem. They said that the gear oil coolant (located within the radiator) had taken in water.AS a result the water has got into the gear box and oil has got into the torque converter. so they all have to be replaced. gear box,torque converter, radiator, reflushing of transmission after replacement.
big unbeliveable bill at the moment
I heard from unconfirmed sources that mercedes placing the problem prone gear oil coolant in the radiator is design flaw waiting to cause major problems as in this case where a faulty / licking gear oil coolant seems to have caused major problems by drawing water into gear box. How this could also have caused oil to be draw into the torque convertor, I don't know. please educate me
I drive a late 2002 registered (uk) E270cdi with auto tiptronic (one of the very first w211) with less than 30,000 miles, recently I started to have problems with the speed as the car slips as I try pull away, then jolts very badly as if the handbrakes were on and it does not want to move. sometimes when I take my foot off the acceleration and try to pull away again it jolts agains and then responds but when I try to move faster same problem again. I took it to the garage and after various test they said it a transmission problem. They said that the gear oil coolant (located within the radiator) had taken in water.AS a result the water has got into the gear box and oil has got into the torque converter. so they all have to be replaced. gear box,torque converter, radiator, reflushing of transmission after replacement.
big unbeliveable bill at the moment
I heard from unconfirmed sources that mercedes placing the problem prone gear oil coolant in the radiator is design flaw waiting to cause major problems as in this case where a faulty / licking gear oil coolant seems to have caused major problems by drawing water into gear box. How this could also have caused oil to be draw into the torque convertor, I don't know. please educate me
