Mike F

At my 30,000 mile service I was made aware that my brake pads were getting thin. I already had all 4 pads changed out at 17,000 miles and this would be the second go around. I searched this site and still had some questions about DIY brakes on SBC equipped cars, but I was ready to bite the bullet, lock the doors, hide the key, and hope the system wouldn't pressurise while I was replacing the pads. I was looking at the Pagids since the OEM create a lot of dust. Well, as fate would have it, even though the dealer told me I had ~1,000 miles left on the pads, 60 miles later the wear indicator light came on. My regular service shop couldn't get me in with a loaner for 3-4 weeks!, so I called another dealer. They would gladly take me today ( of course they would. Just leave your right arm and a ******** at the door!). I dropped the car off, got a ride to work, and got the call from MB service. $680!! WTF? Are you kidding? I told them I had it done in March for $458 and they didn't believe me. They called the other shop and got back to me a few minutes ago. Apparently, my regular shop didn't charge me to deactivate and then reactivate the SBC system. I was told that would be $220. Since they "didn't want to scare me away" since it was my first visit there, they would honor my previous cost this time only. Are they kidding? $220 to do the SBC stuff. I thought that was just a matter of hooking up the computer, pressing a button, and pressing it again when the brakes were done. What gives?
Has ANYONE done pad changes themselves? I can't stomach paying MB almost $700 per year to change my brakes. And what about bleeding the system? Is that posiible or has MB screwed us on this as well. Sorry for the rant, but MB's audacity is getting to me.

konigstiger

I had the rear pads replaced JUN 04 (mileage: 19500) from the dealer where I purchased and was charged $193. The other two dealers in my area quoted $270. All made no mention of an additional charge for deactivating the SBC nor was there an itemized cost for such on my invoice.

BudC

Deactivating/activating shouldn't cost much. Bleeding should cost more because it can take a while to do it. Of course you shouldn't have to pay a wrench $100/hour to sit there and wait for the brakes to finish bleeding. They can multi-task this job but who knows?

Pads from Internet sites are about $100 for the front and $50 for the rear. This is about double what I have to pay for my 300E.

Any dealer brake work from either Mercedes or BMW is a rip off but what can you do? At least with BMW's you can do the work yourself.

If I have to change pads before 20K, I'm dumping my E320.

BudC

Konistiger, which dealer was the cheapest? I'll bet PMC and Schumachers were the most expensive.

konigstiger

Schumacher, Phoenix Motors, Chandler – so far.

BudC

Which one charged you $193?

Mike F

I'm going this afternoon to pick the car up. I'll see what the invoice says about the SBC. It really seems like a quick hook up the computer and press off/on to me. They really have us over a barrel.

larryssf

I was a little surprised by Mike F's experience with the dealership. Not so much the cost (which was extremely high), but apparently not obtaining an estimate before leaving the dealership. While this may not change the cost, it would encourage shopping around if you want to take the time.

In California, the customer must receive a written estimate when the car is left. If there is a significant change in that estimate, the service advisor must contact you, provide a revised estimate, and receive permission to continue.

I am not looking forward to what appears to be frequent brake pad changes on by yet to be received E-500. Is the half life of the brakes that bad or do Mercedes drivers have happy and heavy feet?

SAguirre

"At my 30,000 mile service I was made aware that my brake pads were getting thin. I already had all 4 pads changed out at 17,000 miles and this would be the second go around."

So if the pads are made of butter and wear out so fast, does this mean that the rotors at least last longer? From what I am reading here it looks like you are getting two sets of pads and now going on your third set of pads with the original rotors. That does not sound too bad, but if you think of it rotors should last quite a bit longer than 60k miles if you are easy on them.

What I would like to know is what the exact procedures are for doing the work yourself. Or if it is really possible to even try to do it yourself. 20K miles out the pads (all the way around) is really bad!! I am sure that the people having to replace the pads by 17K are not riding the brakes. To many have had them replaced at this mileage to say that it is bad driving that is causing this premature wear.

I sure hope that we find a way around this before too long!

Steve

marcos

I had my pads changed at 20k and now at 35k the pads and discs/rotors need changing. Its going in tomorrow to have this done as well as 2 new rear air shocks and a damaged air line for the front changed, damn things leaning at strange angles at the moment and handles like a dog with no legs.

konigstiger

Sorry, should have specified in order from most to least expensive (as it relates to my experiences) - Schumacher, Phoenix, Chandler.

Mike F

I normally would have gotten an estimate, but was sort of "stuck" since my usual dealer couldn't get me in with a loaner until after Christmas and the warning light was already on for 215 miles. I was afraid to chance metal on metal and screwing up my rotors (not to mention not being able to stop!).
Well, the outcome was that they indeed agreed to meet my previous repair cost, but I doubt I will use them again. At the least I will call for a quote first, before even wasting my time going down there. Of note: labor charge was $194. At $95 per hour that seems like an awfully long time to change pads at 4 corners. I can do it myself on my 911 turbo in less than an hour easily.
I am still looking for info on DIY brake pad changes if the board can come to some kind of concensus.

MB Fanatic

Damn my dealer charged me 45 dollars and hour to change the pads on the E320 and E55. Something is wrong with this picture. I would have a talk with the GM if I were you.

Randy B

Well I'm having mine done as we speak. I pick the car up later today. I got 43K out of my first set of brakes. All four corners are being replaced with rotors. I was quoted $270 for the front and $230 for the rears. All in all $500.00 plus tax. I had brought the car in for the SBC recall and a broken smart key. I too would have replaced the brakes myself had I not been so scared of the SBC system. If anyone has a breakdown on how to do this I would be very grateful. As I will not be having this done at the dealer again. My garage at home is quite capable with the air compressor and tools. I was thinking about disconnecting both batteries before doing the brake job at the house, but was again afraid to find out something would have to be reset on the car that I could not reset myself. Hopefully All-data will have the service procedures out for this car soon as it will be out of warranty shortly.

Randy

HELL ONA HARLEY

Brakes and rotors and your complaining!!!!! That sounds too good to be true....Yes, I too can work on my own cars, bikes and I do for the most part, but this price you just quoted for brakes and rotors installed and of coarse work guaranteed by MB sounds great. My time is worth far too much with such a great quote in hand as you have, not to mention the potential fiasco with the SBC system....
What dealer did this for you and howa bout a copy of your work order posted here so I can go to my dealer with it when its my turn.....

Randy B

Not sure about posting it (Still not too web savvy), however I will be more than happy to scan and E-mail it to you if you would like to post it. Mercedes Orlando is who is doing the work. I will have the receipt later today when I get the car,
Randy

Marcus Frost

I may be wrong on this, but I believe there is an SBC ECU. If I am right, the easy way of disconnecting the SBC system would be to simply unplug the harness to the SBC ECU, which I believe is located towards the firewall on the driver's side (nearby where the ESP ECU is).

You may also want to check your fuse diagrams to see if there is an SBC fuse (which I doubt).

I may be mistaken though.

FWIW, HELL ON A HARLEY, the work I do on my own cars is vastly superior to any MB dealership. With these cars I don't know how to do 100% of the things I need to, nor do I have the tools needed, but given the same tools and the same job, you better believe I do a better job. I am a busy man too, but working on my car is actually a pleasure sometimes. Way for me to take a load off. Only once in a while though

-m

marcos

I've just got mine back from having the air-matic sorted and new brake pads, no mention on the bill for deactivating SBC. If there was someone at the dealership would get a slap, how can you charge for deactivating a system like that

SAguirre

I have been to enough dealerships where I always find someone who does not know what they are talking about. If I have time, I always call them on it. These are the people who always say:

"To tell you the truth" and "To be honest" That is where I stop them and tell them that whenever I hear those words a LIE usually comes right after them!!

I think that this SBC deactivation charge is someone talking out of their ***! There are a lot of people who work at dealerships with bad information and don't know it. So far, Glauser Mercedes here in CO is the only dealership that has been totally honest and say they don't know if that is the case.


Steve

ATS

What was wrong with your airmatic?

marcos

One of the rear shocks was faulty and an air hose at the front somewhere had a hole in it. Kept getting the 'visit workshop' sign on the dash because it was getting low on pressure. All sorted now though under warranty.

ninefourthree

on SBC-equipped cars, the SBC control unit (computer), hydraulic valve unit,
high pressure pump motor, and high pressure accumulator are all built together
in one unit, located under the hood just behind the right headlamp assembly.
to deactivate and reactivate the system is a simple affair with the STAR diagnosis computer. i am a tech at a busy southern california M-B dealer; most of the guys in my shop simply unplug the SBC unit when replacing pads or rotors. however, what you miss when just unplugging the unit as opposed to
deactivating it properly is the depressurization of the accumulator. so, even if
you disconnect the pump, there is still enough pressure stored in the accumulator to mash the pads together and whatever is in between.
nonetheless, i think the chances of that happening are so slim that i just unplug it and swap the pads (and rotors). i believe the prices for the M-B brake pads
are around 120.00 per axle. on most cars, we charge 0.7hrs per axle for pad replacement. on sbc cars, we charge 1.2hrs per axle (extra .5 hrs hazard pay).
labor rate for brake pad replacement is about $82/hr. As a side note: Bleeding the SBC system requires use of star diagnosis machine and is a major pain in the rear, ask any dealer tech. BTW, there is a dealer technical bulletin out on
"premature rear brake pad wear" for W211 cars. defined in the bulletin as "rear pads wearing out sooner than front pads". so if rear pads are wearing out too quickly, ask about warranty replacement if it the original set of pads.
Also, mb warranty allows replacement of pads before 12,000 miles and less than 50% wear. We usually do that if customer complains of squeaking.
hope some of this info has been helpful.

Fastbuck

Do you have any more info about this bulletin?

SAguirre

Your information is very informative!

I have three questions then. It makes a lot of sense that there would still be pressure left in the brakes if one only unplugged the SBC system. Even the old vacuum boosters held some pressure. I have noticed that if the car is off and no key is in the ignition the SBC pump will still turn on and pump if you press the brake pedal a few times in a row. This would lead me to believe that this car has boosted brakes even with the ignition and the engine off! So would it help if you unplugged the SBC and then pumped the brakes a few times so that the pressure would be released (or used up)? Is there any logic to this?

My next question would be; How exactly do you disconnect the SBC? What is the best way to do it so that there is no error reading or damage?

And my last question is, how does the SBC actually know how much of the pads are left? Is it like my old W124 that simply grounded a sensor on to the rotor and sent a signal or is there an actual travel sensor in the caliper? I am asking this because I would want to know that the computer would realize that the pads are new if I replace the pads and sensors.

Thanks for your information!

Steve A.

Mike F

Finally some authoritative info on the SBC from ninefourthree ! Thanks a lot. looks like next pad change will be my own doing. SAguirre asks an interesting point about depressurizing the system by pumping the pedal. Ninefourthree, care to comment?