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Gracenote database not recognizing CD's properly

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Gracenote database not recognizing CD's properly

 
Old 11-01-2010, 05:24 PM
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Question Gracenote database not recognizing CD's properly

Hi Folks,

Recently took delivery of an 2011 E550 and noticed the Gracenote database isn't accurately identifying my store bought "Eagles - Hell Freezes Over" CD. Gracenote identifies the group as Daft Punk as the album as Discovery. All songs have incorrect names listed as well but they play properly. So far this is the only disc this happens with but still have many more to load. Also tried burning a CD from my iTunes with same result.

I was wondering if others on this board have experienced the same or similar problems when recording to hdd and what you did to correct it. Have a call into my service adviser about this but haven't heard back yet.

Thanks,
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Old 11-02-2010, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by rhampar View Post
Hi Folks,

Recently took delivery of an 2011 E550 and noticed the Gracenote database isn't accurately identifying my store bought "Eagles - Hell Freezes Over" CD. Gracenote identifies the group as Daft Punk as the album as Discovery. All songs have incorrect names listed as well but they play properly. So far this is the only disc this happens with but still have many more to load. Also tried burning a CD from my iTunes with same result.

I was wondering if others on this board have experienced the same or similar problems when recording to hdd and what you did to correct it. Have a call into my service adviser about this but haven't heard back yet.

Thanks,
Ok 100 views and no one is having a similar problem with their Gracenote music database??

BTW went to the dealer today to have them take a look at it. Unfortunately was told my software is up to date and they weren't aware of any fixes for this. Anyone have ideas other than trying another Eagles disk (which is on order). Also have an email to Gracenote customer support but not holding my breath that I'll get a fix from them for this problem.

Thanks,
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Old 11-02-2010, 08:51 PM
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Gracenote

I have Gracenote integrated into my music server at home and i am finding more & more album artwork not showing up. I have e-mailed them with no response. Let me know if they get back to you.
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Old 11-03-2010, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by rhampar View Post
Ok 100 views and no one is having a similar problem with their Gracenote music database??

BTW went to the dealer today to have them take a look at it. Unfortunately was told my software is up to date and they weren't aware of any fixes for this. Anyone have ideas other than trying another Eagles disk (which is on order). Also have an email to Gracenote customer support but not holding my breath that I'll get a fix from them for this problem.

Thanks,
I don't have that Eagles disk, and I am not an expert on Gracenotes. My understanding of Gracenotes, though, indicates your current disk is likely not the problem.

Here is how I understand it: The CD itself does not contain the artist and track title info (for some reason the recording industry opposes this). So to get the artist and title info, the CD player generates a checksum using the number and length of the tracks, and matches this checksum to a database. It is possible for two CDs to have the same number, and for the wrong information to be displayed.

I think there is a way to manually override this by burning the disk in iTunes, manually changing the track and artist info, and then burning a new CD WITH the information you have entered. I did this a long time ago accidentally with incorrect info (don't ask), and every time the CD plays it comes up with the incorrect info.

EDIT: by burning the CD with the info, the CD player will use that info rather than check the Gracenotes database, I think

Last edited by ttoE550; 11-03-2010 at 09:26 AM.
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Old 11-03-2010, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by rhampar View Post
Ok 100 views and no one is having a similar problem with their Gracenote music database??

BTW went to the dealer today to have them take a look at it. Unfortunately was told my software is up to date and they weren't aware of any fixes for this. Anyone have ideas other than trying another Eagles disk (which is on order). Also have an email to Gracenote customer support but not holding my breath that I'll get a fix from them for this problem.

Thanks,
Gracenote uses the total playing time and then the length of individual tracks (the Table of Contents [TOC]) to identify a CD. If two CDs are the same in this regard, it is for the developer of MB's software to recognise this possibility or it will default to the first match it finds. I have not uploaded anything to the Music Register but would not be surprised to find no interactivity and so no opportunity to select from multiple matches. Hopefully someone can tell me I'm wrong.

Until Gracenote or someone else develops a CD database (CDDB) sophisticated enough to recognise waveforms, it should be obvious to anyone writing software that references such a database that it would eventually be possible to encounter two CDs with the same Table of Contents data. The likelihood of two different CDs having the same track lengths might seem infinitesimal but in reality most CDs’ total playing times fall within a narrow band as do the number of tracks. As a programmer, I would at least have to countenance the possibility that one day there will be duplication. Even if there is no duplication, it only takes one person to have mis-identified a CD and uploaded the data for it to appear on the CDDB. If someone takes a snapshot of the CDDB before the error is corrected and uses it as the basis of a static database such as the Music Register - you are stuck with the error until a) the error is corrected on the live database, b) Mercedes procure a subsequent snapshot, and c) this new snapshot is applied to your vehicle.

Whether there are two CDs with similar TOCs or there is an error in the database, you have a snapshot of the database that includes the anomaly so I don’t see another copy of this mass-produced CD providing a different result. If there is indeed a coincidental TOC duplication, it will presumably still be there now and would show up in any application that uses the dynamic version of Gracenote where you would be asked to select between the Eagles and the Daft Punk CDs (and in any future snapshot of the CDDB that Mercedes offer where it would still default to one or other of the CDs). If it was an error and the two albums are dissimilar, it is likely to have already been corrected in the live CDDB. The static database in your car, already months out of date, will need updating and only Mercedes get to decide when they will make a revised snapshot available. Even if it turns out to be a problem with Gracenote and they fix it, don't rely on it getting to your car via Mercedes any time soon if their Nav map updates are any indication.

Until there is a ‘connected’ version of COMAND (surely in the pipeline) your problem is increasingly likely to occur. The current system needs some kind of fuzzy-logic interactive approach to work around it and I see it as a major oversight if there is none. It's just my experience that Mercedes innovate when it comes to safety etc. but are often behind the game elsewhere. Fortunately the iPod interface and iTunes’ access to the dynamic Gracenote CDDB makes the Music Register’s shortcomings irrelevant for many, which might explain why so few have encountered this problem.

Last edited by Beausoleil; 11-03-2010 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 11-03-2010, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ttoE550 View Post
I don't have that Eagles disk, and I am not an expert on Gracenotes. My understanding of Gracenotes, though, indicates your current disk is likely not the problem.

Here is how I understand it: The CD itself does not contain the artist and track title info (for some reason the recording industry opposes this). So to get the artist and title info, the CD player generates a checksum using the number and length of the tracks, and matches this checksum to a database. It is possible for two CDs to have the same number, and for the wrong information to be displayed.

I think there is a way to manually override this by burning the disk in iTunes, manually changing the track and artist info, and then burning a new CD WITH the information you have entered. I did this a long time ago accidentally with incorrect info (don't ask), and every time the CD plays it comes up with the incorrect info.

EDIT: by burning the CD with the info, the CD player will use that info rather than check the Gracenotes database, I think

I believe I've tried what you are proposing except for manually retyping artist and song info.

Here's what I did:

Loaded CD into iTunes and copied to song library on my laptop. Created a playlist and copied songs to newly created playlist. Burned album to disk as an audio CD. Installed to music register with same result as store bought CD.

That said I missed the step where you recommend I go into my iTunes music library and delete / overwrite existing information and manually type artist & song information before burning a new audio CD. I'll give that a whirl but wanted to ask if I can do this on the playlist information instead of the main music library.


Also an interesting thing happened when I burn songs as an MP3 disk. All songs are recognized properly in the car but unfortunately we can't record mp3's onto music register.

Finally this Eagles CD was 1st release and purchased in 1994 when Gracenote technology was probably in it's infancy or maybe not yet even thought of. My thinking (and hope) in getting a new CD is that disk may now be encoded a little differently than the original and will be properly recognized by gracenote software on our cars.
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Old 11-03-2010, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by rhampar View Post
I believe I've tried what you are proposing except for manually retyping artist and song info.

Here's what I did:

Loaded CD into iTunes and copied to song library on my laptop. Created a playlist and copied songs to newly created playlist. Burned album to disk as an audio CD. Installed to music register with same result as store bought CD.

That said I missed the step where you recommend I go into my iTunes music library and delete / overwrite existing information and manually type artist & song information before burning a new audio CD. I'll give that a whirl but wanted to ask if I can do this on the playlist information instead of the main music library.


Also an interesting thing happened when I burn songs as an MP3 disk. All songs are recognized properly in the car but unfortunately we can't record mp3's onto music register.

Finally this Eagles CD was 1st release and purchased in 1994 when Gracenote technology was probably in it's infancy or maybe not yet even thought of. My thinking (and hope) in getting a new CD is that disk may now be encoded a little differently than the original and will be properly recognized by gracenote software on our cars.
I realized that one step in my instructions was not clear. When you burn the songs to a new CD, you have to select an option -- I do not recall exactly what the option says, but it is something like Include Song Information in a Text File or something similar. Something that conveys that it will place an extra information file on the CD. It has been a while, but I think it shows up just as you click to burn the new CD.

Manually entering the information is not important -- telling iTunes to burn the correct information file onto the new CD is important. For the CD I have, COMAND loads the information file and displays that information.

My bad memory makes this difficult to explain, and the recent 4000 version changes of iTunes might mean the method is completely different now.

I have many CDs older than yours, including some not available on iTunes (AC/DC, for instance). Gracenotes in the car has been accurate on every one I've tried. It does goof on a Kelly Clarkson CD my daughter likes, but it at least gets the correct artist and some songs correct (maybe she has two versions of the same album?). I like independent Joe Walsh a lot, but Don Henley grates on me, so I don't own any Eagles and I can't try it.
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Old 11-03-2010, 08:31 PM
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I'm such a dumb*ss. I just opened up iTunes and pretended to burn a disc. In the burn settings that comes up when you burn the disc, choose Audio CD and select "Include CD Text" I think that will do it.
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Old 11-03-2010, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ttoE550 View Post
I'm such a dumb*ss. I just opened up iTunes and pretended to burn a disc. In the burn settings that comes up when you burn the disc, choose Audio CD and select "Include CD Text" I think that will do it.
Followed your suggestion and worked like a champ. Thanks very much.

One suggestion when you do this in the future. Put the album name in as the playlist folder title ie Hell Freezes Over. This will ensure album name is recognized properly when the CD is burned and subsequently recorded to music register. I'm a happy MB owner again.
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Old 11-03-2010, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by rhampar View Post
Followed your suggestion and worked like a champ. Thanks very much.

One suggestion when you do this in the future. Put the album name in as the playlist folder title ie Hell Freezes Over. This will ensure album name is recognized properly when the CD is burned and subsequently recorded to music register. I'm a happy MB owner again.
Great! Glad I could help. Makes me feel good.

A question for you: When you record your CDs to the hard drive, is it "real time?" By this I mean, for example, if the CD is 1 hour long, does it take 1 hour to record the CD? If it does it faster, do you have a guess on how much faster? TIA
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Old 11-04-2010, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by ttoE550 View Post
Great! Glad I could help. Makes me feel good.

A question for you: When you record your CDs to the hard drive, is it "real time?" By this I mean, for example, if the CD is 1 hour long, does it take 1 hour to record the CD? If it does it faster, do you have a guess on how much faster? TIA
Recording CD's to music register is actually very quick. My experience so far is about 8 - 12 minutes to record a 10 - 15 song CD. Also seems to record very clean i.e. no change in fidelity during the transfer.
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Old 11-04-2010, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ttoE550 View Post
Great! Glad I could help. Makes me feel good.

A question for you: When you record your CDs to the hard drive, is it "real time?" By this I mean, for example, if the CD is 1 hour long, does it take 1 hour to record the CD? If it does it faster, do you have a guess on how much faster? TIA
The screen shows you how many tracks have recorded and then tells you when finished. It plays the CD at regular "speed," so will continue to play after CD recorded.
You may want to pick a folder destination before you start recording. This will allow you to rename the folder after it records-or you can rename it anyway. So far, for single artists CD's, it has correctly titled the folders, except for one. For some reason it went to Various folder.
One problem I have found is that for CD's with various artists, unless you pick a destination folder, the CD will record to a Various folder and may create two or more Various folders. You then have to open those folders to find the files (CD's) in it.
Also, you cannot delete files, only individual tracks. And you cannot move files from one folder to another.
I have about 15 CD's in two different various folders now.
As for Gracenote, have never had a problem with it recognizing the correct artists.
When I was loading the Music Register I found it to be a great excuse for taking long rides in the country.
WARNING! Be very careful recording to Music Register while driving-it is very distracting, especially if you want to type in new titles, pick destinations, etc. Best to pull over, do the entries and the drive when recording starts.
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Old 09-26-2014, 10:16 PM
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I have a 2014 Acura TL and i am experiencing periodic issues when ripping CD's onto the HDD drive in my car. I bought a 2014 CD and it started recording onto the HDD with "No titles" for the songs. Why is this happening?
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Old 09-03-2017, 11:59 AM
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wrong info

Gracenote thinks Coldplay X&Y is a Greenday album, but the song titles were correct. I just copied it into the hard drive and changed the Album artist and title.
my problem is I started to copy a CD but didn't have time to copy it all so I copied 4 songs into it and shut off the car. Now that CD only shows those 4 songs and I can't even play the rest of the album from CD. any idea how i can fix this???
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Old 09-03-2017, 12:55 PM
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Use Options to Delete and Start Over

Originally Posted by Tony B View Post
Gracenote thinks Coldplay X&Y is a Greenday album, but the song titles were correct. I just copied it into the hard drive and changed the Album artist and title.
my problem is I started to copy a CD but didn't have time to copy it all so I copied 4 songs into it and shut off the car. Now that CD only shows those 4 songs and I can't even play the rest of the album from CD. any idea how i can fix this???
I would use the options and delete. Make sure you just delete this one folder and not entire Music Register.
Then start over when you have more time for it to record. Takes about 20 minutes on ones I have done.
The screen will briefly show when recording is finished.

I have over 1,000 "songs" on my MR (hard drive) and system recognized about 98% of them correctly. With the exception being some I recorded to CD on my computer from CD's or vinyl and a few really old CD's.
I use the options and so forth to enter correct titles for folders and files (Albums and songs).
Good luck and Happy Motoring!
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