anyone actually have stag's on a 4matic?
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BMW 335
anyone actually have stag's on a 4matic?
I've done all the searches, sifted through pages and pages of posts regarding staggered wheel sets on 4matics.
What I haven't seen is a post from anyone who has actually said that they've done it. There are many posts stating that "others have done it"...but I'm hoping to hear some info first-person, so to speak.
I can't figure out what all the "hubub" is about. Based on my experience with other cars, so long as you keep the front and rear tires very close to the same OD, everything is fine. I did it on my previous car, an '08 BMW 335xi. I had zero problems in 30,000 miles.
Anyone out there? There's got to be a few...
Thanks in advance!
What I haven't seen is a post from anyone who has actually said that they've done it. There are many posts stating that "others have done it"...but I'm hoping to hear some info first-person, so to speak.
I can't figure out what all the "hubub" is about. Based on my experience with other cars, so long as you keep the front and rear tires very close to the same OD, everything is fine. I did it on my previous car, an '08 BMW 335xi. I had zero problems in 30,000 miles.
Anyone out there? There's got to be a few...
Thanks in advance!
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For what its worth..my C Sport 4matic came with staggered width rims from the factory. Even though if you read the website or the brochure, they explicitly say not to lol. My car wasn't a fluke either, for at least the 2008 model year, all 4matic Sports came with staggered width rims.
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tarsky68,
As I stated before in other treads, I was and still am running staggered on 4matic E class - W210, W211 and now W212.
Sizes I provided prior, are the sizes I actually use(d).
IMO its mostly for looks, unless you're running V8s were its beneficial, but for V6s, it actually hurts accelaration.
So IMHO for E class 4matics - V8 its OK to stagger, for V6 - stay same size.
As I stated before in other treads, I was and still am running staggered on 4matic E class - W210, W211 and now W212.
Sizes I provided prior, are the sizes I actually use(d).
IMO its mostly for looks, unless you're running V8s were its beneficial, but for V6s, it actually hurts accelaration.
So IMHO for E class 4matics - V8 its OK to stagger, for V6 - stay same size.
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BMW 335
ThreeMB's,
Thank for the info.
I've been confident that it's possible, but just wanted to confirm with someone who has actually done it. I guess I missed your post(s) where you posted the sizes. I'll do a search for your posts and try to find it.
Right now, I'm thinking:
245/35-19 - fronts
275/30-19 - rears
So far my tires searches have put most of the manufacturers in those sizes within about 1% of each other in regards to revolutions per mile and overall diameter, so it should be fine.
For me...it's all about the look. Sport sedans, coupes, etc were meant to have wider tires and deeper wheels in the back.
I guess one could argue whether the E350 is a sport sedan, but in my eyes, it is
Thanks again!
Thank for the info.
I've been confident that it's possible, but just wanted to confirm with someone who has actually done it. I guess I missed your post(s) where you posted the sizes. I'll do a search for your posts and try to find it.
Right now, I'm thinking:
245/35-19 - fronts
275/30-19 - rears
So far my tires searches have put most of the manufacturers in those sizes within about 1% of each other in regards to revolutions per mile and overall diameter, so it should be fine.
For me...it's all about the look. Sport sedans, coupes, etc were meant to have wider tires and deeper wheels in the back.
I guess one could argue whether the E350 is a sport sedan, but in my eyes, it is
Thanks again!
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Glad to help.
It is very difficult to find 245/35-19(25.8 for most) front and 275/30-19(25.5 for most, 25.6 for few) tires in the same (or close, within .1) diameter and rev/mile.
For 99% of tires, 285/30-19(25.8 for most) rears will "match" 245/35-19 fronts better. 285/30-19 fits with zero issues on a 9.5 wide wheel with offsets between 38mm and 48 mm. Just keep in mind that W212 E-class comes with 97 load rated tires from factory. Most or all 245/35-19 tires are rated at 93 load max. Its not a problem, just remember to run front tire pressure at least 4lbs more than you were running stock fronts to compensate for lower load rated tire.
It is very difficult to find 245/35-19(25.8 for most) front and 275/30-19(25.5 for most, 25.6 for few) tires in the same (or close, within .1) diameter and rev/mile.
For 99% of tires, 285/30-19(25.8 for most) rears will "match" 245/35-19 fronts better. 285/30-19 fits with zero issues on a 9.5 wide wheel with offsets between 38mm and 48 mm. Just keep in mind that W212 E-class comes with 97 load rated tires from factory. Most or all 245/35-19 tires are rated at 93 load max. Its not a problem, just remember to run front tire pressure at least 4lbs more than you were running stock fronts to compensate for lower load rated tire.
Last edited by threeMBs; Jan 13, 2011 at 09:40 AM.
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BMW 335
Great info, thanks.
You mentioned the front offset at 38-48mm. What is the correct offset for the rears, assuming 275 or 285 tires?
I don't want the Carolla, "look at my fat tires sticking out" look. Nicely tucked is the look I'm looking for.
I may go 245's all around and find an 8.5" wheel that has a decent lip on it. Then might add a 10mm spacer in the rear to get the proper fit.
Haven't made my final decision yet, but do appreciate the help
Thanks again!
You mentioned the front offset at 38-48mm. What is the correct offset for the rears, assuming 275 or 285 tires?
I don't want the Carolla, "look at my fat tires sticking out" look. Nicely tucked is the look I'm looking for.
I may go 245's all around and find an 8.5" wheel that has a decent lip on it. Then might add a 10mm spacer in the rear to get the proper fit.
Haven't made my final decision yet, but do appreciate the help
Thanks again!
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IMO, best wheel width/offset/tire size staggered combo for W212 is:
front: 19x8.5|et38-et40|255/35-19(RWD)&245/35-19(AWD)
rear: 19x9.5|et43 is ideal|285/30-19(RWD&AWD)
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Above offset range will work for both front and rear. Lower offset than that, but not lower than 33-34, will also work.
IMO, best wheel width/offset/tire size staggered combo for W212 is:
front: 19x8.5|et38-et40|255/35-19(RWD)&245/35-19(AWD)
rear: 19x9.5|et43 is ideal|285/30-19(RWD&AWD)
IMO, best wheel width/offset/tire size staggered combo for W212 is:
front: 19x8.5|et38-et40|255/35-19(RWD)&245/35-19(AWD)
rear: 19x9.5|et43 is ideal|285/30-19(RWD&AWD)
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If looks are that important to you, then go for it.
But you're only adding unsprung weight to the chassis. That's a big negative performance-wise......
......I guess I just come from the "performance is priority and looks come in last" club.
But you're only adding unsprung weight to the chassis. That's a big negative performance-wise......
......I guess I just come from the "performance is priority and looks come in last" club.
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Yep, I understand...and agree, it's a trade-off. I put wheels/tires on almost every car I own. I've made the mistake of putting larger/heavier wheels on cars and have ruined the handling characteristics on a few.
There are lots of ways to look at it. For me, the E350 is not a performance machine at all...in fact, it's dog slow and ain't no handling dream. But, it is a good looking sedan that looks even better with aftermarket wheels/tires.
I am concerned about the ride quality though. I'm looking very closely at the weights of the wheels and tires. It's mostly an issue with the 285 meats on the back that will add the weight. Going from stock 18's to 19's, adds very little weight with the right wheels, but those danged 30 pound rear tires will add an additional 4 lbs on each rear wheel.
This may in fact, lead me to looking at a staggered set of 18's as another option...
Something to think about, for sure!
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I am concerned about the ride quality though. I'm looking very closely at the weights of the wheels and tires. It's mostly an issue with the 285 meats on the back that will add the weight. Going from stock 18's to 19's, adds very little weight with the right wheels, but those danged 30 pound rear tires will add an additional 4 lbs on each rear wheel.
This may in fact, lead me to looking at a staggered set of 18's as another option...
Something to think about, for sure!
This may in fact, lead me to looking at a staggered set of 18's as another option...
Something to think about, for sure!
I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
Last edited by threeMBs; Jan 13, 2011 at 05:28 PM.
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Current: 2011 W212 Previous: 2008 W211 2006 550 2001 Rover 1997 W210
Now that I read above, I assume that you have E350 4matic. Staying with 18s and staggering is a waist of money IMO as you wont achive much in appearance.
I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
I would also opt with the above where you just get the look w/ spacers/bolts while keeping the non-staggered setup. Any kind of performance you get from the staggered setup is really minimal. Different story if you are changing out the wheels for the appearance.
Last edited by EmE247; Jan 13, 2011 at 06:19 PM.
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All valid points guys and the feedback is appreciated.
I just can't stick with the stock wheels. I can't remember the last car I had that had stock wheels on it. My friends would would probably make me go to the doctor to make sure that I was OK.
However, I may go non-staggered....
Decisions, decisions
I just can't stick with the stock wheels. I can't remember the last car I had that had stock wheels on it. My friends would would probably make me go to the doctor to make sure that I was OK.
However, I may go non-staggered....
Decisions, decisions
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BMW 335
Now that I read above, I assume that you have E350 4matic. Staying with 18s and staggering is a waist of money IMO as you wont achive much in appearance.
I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
Whether I choose to go this route or not, it's great advice for anyone with a 4matic.
I know alot about wheels and tires, just not much about Merc's...yet
I'm sure that plenty of people can benefit from this info threeMBs, thanks!
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Same here. Most of the time, already had "replacements" ahead of bringing a new MB car home. Currently have 4 MBs. None with stocks -sold them all. (Actually its not 100% true - I still have W212 sedan's wheels/tires as I just bought it last weekend, but since they're off the car now, I'm sure they'll be sold sooner than later too.)
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I would do the following instead. Your stock wheels are 18x8.5 et48. The best way to enhance your car's appearance is to stay with exactly what you have, but to add H&R wheel spacers instead: 10mm spacers upfront, 15mm spacers for rear. Your car's stance will look a lot sportier and much more aggressive (and handling will improve noticably as you'll widen your tracks), without adding much of unsprung weight and saving a bunch in your pocket. You'll need 20 longer round/ball seat bolts (43mm) than stock (28mm). You can get spacers and bolts at ecstuning.com for total of about $225 shipped. Then when your stock tires are ready to be replaced, install 255/40-18 tires instead of stock 245/40-18 at all corners for even wider look.
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Actually, the potential problems with staggered wheels/tires are not so much the change in stance (widened track), as the following:
1) any difference in OD front to rear will cause differences in rev's/mile, which may (in theory) put a strain on the AWD system. I'm not really concerned with this, as I can correct for OD and rev/mi through proper tire selection
2) adding unsprung weight via heavier wheels/tires can negatively effect ride quality and acceleration
3) greater rolling resistance from wider tires will certainly reduce fuel economy
But...it will LOOK GOOD
1) any difference in OD front to rear will cause differences in rev's/mile, which may (in theory) put a strain on the AWD system. I'm not really concerned with this, as I can correct for OD and rev/mi through proper tire selection
2) adding unsprung weight via heavier wheels/tires can negatively effect ride quality and acceleration
3) greater rolling resistance from wider tires will certainly reduce fuel economy
But...it will LOOK GOOD
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Actually, the potential problems with staggered wheels/tires are not so much the change in stance (widened track), as the following:
1) any difference in OD front to rear will cause differences in rev's/mile, which may (in theory) put a strain on the AWD system. I'm not really concerned with this, as I can correct for OD and rev/mi through proper tire selection
2) adding unsprung weight via heavier wheels/tires can negatively effect ride quality and acceleration
3) greater rolling resistance from wider tires will certainly reduce fuel economy
But...it will LOOK GOOD
1) any difference in OD front to rear will cause differences in rev's/mile, which may (in theory) put a strain on the AWD system. I'm not really concerned with this, as I can correct for OD and rev/mi through proper tire selection
2) adding unsprung weight via heavier wheels/tires can negatively effect ride quality and acceleration
3) greater rolling resistance from wider tires will certainly reduce fuel economy
But...it will LOOK GOOD
One benefit, in addition to looking good, that is overlooked when staggering (even for rear biased AWD as MB's 4matics are) is better traction during dry accelaration (this of course applies much more to 550 than 350) and dry cornering (regardless of the engine).
Also, for point number 2) above - for 550 engine, one will not feel any accelaration degradations at all, for 350 though I do agree.
