man, do you have to go around the shifter to get to the command knob?

sheesh

 

Wow, good observation. M-B have always been known to be tops at logical and ergonomic placement, but man is the COMMAND knob more naturally placed than the iDrive knob (ironically, BMW introduced that type of knob to the market first and M-B followed suit).

I don't think I've ever heard BMW drivers complain about knob placement (but I haven't really been listening for it), but in pictures, it does appear to be an uncomfortable setup.

 

Actually, the iDrive knob is perfectly placed as it fals right under your hand when you rest your arm on the armrest. It is actually slightly better placed than the COMAND knob that is a bit too close to the driver and a bit too far back.

 

Yeah I actually started to notice that as I analyzed it more. Naturally you'd be resting your arm on the console which means that you wouldn't have to reach around the shifter, instead it's placed just beside it to your hands view.

 

I couldn't agree more with your analytics. I have a very keen eye to both MB and MB models yet I constantly mistake a 5 for a 7 and a 7 for a 5. BORING. MB has done a very nice job distinguishing differences between the C, E and S which are the bread and butter of their lineup.

 

do 750's come in v12? saw a bmw 750 with v12 badges

 

The 750's are all V8's, but there is a 760Li with a V12

 

LOL!!! he was posing then

 

BMW, Audi and yes...Mercedes all do the same thing. The E looks very similar to the smaller C and the larger S.

Sure, the car geeks can always tell the difference, but lots of folks need to read the badge to tell the model. The C is often mistaken for the E...and I know because I had a C loaner for a week when my E was in for service with an ECU issue.

 

When the 2002 revise Audi A4 came out it was virtually impossible to distinguish from an A6. I remember dealers on the lot running aroung saying "there's the new A4, whoops, there it is, whoops..." Once you got to know the car it was obvious.

To a BMW owner, the differences between the 5 and the 7 are readily obvious as the 7 still has remnants of the "Bangle butt" but are very subtle to "outsiders."

This lack of distinction is a bit curious as these cars were designed for corporate Germany, with the big bosses getting the 7 and middle management getting the 5, so you'd think that the big bosses would want something that screams "I'm a big boss."

 

Family ties, yes, but M-B Designs their cars faaaar more individually.

The E and C couldn't be any more different, for a pair of cars connected as Brothers. The taillights designs, the graphics, the entire grilles, the 4 eyes VS 2 eyes, the character lines, the E's "Pontoon" fenders, the E's more sharp and angular and tension-inspired sheetmetal, etc. etc. They look nothing alike, aside from necessary family ties. The same for the S.

The 5 and 7 (and now 3) literally look like the exact same car, even many of us car geeks will confuse them constantly, inside and out. There's reason why people all over criticize BMW and Audi for this approach, while M-B is mostly exempt from it.

Now, the previous generation, with the W203 and W211, M-B followed the same "Sausage" theme, as those cars were almost indistinguishable from each other, save for the moderate details and size.

Edit: Non car savvy people will indeed usually look past even the most obvious differences, and the underlying "theme/language" and badging is what will draw their eyes in, no arguments there. But from a fundamental standpoint, BMW's practically copy each other, while M-B does a much better job of making blatant differences, whilst keeping the obvious similarities, both historically and modernly intact.

 

 

My biggest gripe with the C and E class styling has more to do with the interior than the exterior. I wish the E class interior was more elegant and flowing. I find the current E class interior disjointed and would have loved some organic curves in the presentation. I've tried really hard to like the new interior and it is not working. IMHO it looks C-Classish to me, no offence intended to the C class.

If not for the ridiculous back seats that just seats 2 I would be considering a CLS550...

 

When I had a C series loaner a few months ago, family, friends and coworkers thought it was my E350.

Of course none of them are car geeks.

 

From what I've noticed most people see the logo and identify it as a Mercedes and then they notice it has 4 doors and the color and that is the extent to which most people look at these cars. Most girls I know retain very little about my car other than it is silver, it's a Mercedes, and they think it is "nice."

I think the other reason for the confusion is that Mercedes now has a dozen different cars and you actually have to be a MB enthusiast to tell them apart

I think you get the most brand value for your buck with the C class especially with the newly redesigned 2012 C class with the color display in the dash...

 

MB does contour the exteriors of their vehicles to allow for individualization. That said, I have found that most folks see the grill and star on a MB.The grill and star are truly automotive icons, and, even those who have no clue about different models recognize a car as a mercedes benz. BMW and Audi also have iconic looks. Their approach is to take a very successful formula and offer it in S, M, and L, seems to work for them.

 

Yeah, not surprising to me. My girlfriend once thought a Silver HYUNDAI (pre-Genesis era, mind you) Compact-Wagon I had as a Rental was my old W220 S-Class. I will give her credit though, she's really grown fond of the nuances of my E-Class, and has been able to tell it apart from my most recent C Loaners. She's learning.

My Dad, however, is a total car-layman. He was checking out his friends 2010 S65, and actually said, when he sat inside that "Oh, this looks just like my Sons car". . When he was riding in mine, he said, "your car looks exactly like my friends car, I can't tell a difference". Yes, I have M-B Tex and the S65 has the finest Leather offered on an M-B.

IMO, the C does give you an ultimate "cache for the buck" value, as most people couldn't notice a difference between it and a CL. However, IMO, the E-Class is the ultimate cache-for-the-buck. The C still has that "bubbly-compact" look that looks a bit more "pedestrian", while the E gets a more luxurious to the eye length and size, rendering it a "Large Benz", thus giving it the ultimate bang for the buck to most I think.

 

After having two W212 MB E350 4matics, I'd go for a 550 xdrive. I currently drive a F10 535 xdrive, non sport with 18" wheels. This car is comfortable. gooof gas mileage and has not been plagued with the quality problems of both my 10 and 11 models.

If anything, the F10 rides more like an MB than a BMW.

Sorry for the bias, but the N55 engine with it's transmission should get you the gas mileage you prefer. I live in heavy pothole country and opted for 18" wheels.

I still have a Mercedes product, but no longer a W212. BMW IMO has leapfrogged the E350. No noise. excellent handling, and a comfortable and great handling car.

The new engine in the 12 models should help, but I do not think it is worth the offset.

I know I am speaking heresy, but I've had 5 MB's since 2006. I've also had 4 BMW's since 07.

I wouldn't get Benz's sport suspension. It does not like bad roads. within 200 miles of new, my 11 W212 was making noise. unacceptable. When we read the posts of the rattles and gremlins of the W212, then we hear from the dealer's that it's just us--that's wrong.

My BMW dealer was glad to get the business back. So haters, go ahead. I've given MB more than ample chance, and I'm still a new 11 M class driver. It rattles.

I would love the E without the rattles, and the cheap MB Tex. No dealers locally (200 mile radius) orders in anything with leather--all MB Tex. There's a difference. BMW has a much, much better HVAC system with air filtration than MB. For some that means nothing, for others that are more sensative it means a day without a headache or irritated eyes.

I think there are good points of the W212. But having two, and both were less than satisfactory, my decision is made.

My W211 Wagon was fine. Quiet and built like a Benz should be. I think the ultra tight build tollerences are rough on U.S. roads. However after some real close examination of build just under the engine bay, i can tell they aren't spending some time with design or mfg. as they used to. just my .02.

it's all on personal judgement and what you want.

but for luxury, after having two W212, I can't see how it compares to the new F10 evenly.

 

The F10 is a beauty for sure. If they would drop the diesel in it with xDrive, I would face almost certain temptation. It is almost a crime that MB does not offer the W212 Bluetec with 4Matic.

 

Haven't checked this tread in a while.

Although Bangle was bashed for some of his designs(especially the E65 7 series) I still think he designed some nice cars. As bad as some think the 7 series was i still think MB did more harm to the S-Class with the W220 then Bangle did to the E65 a few years later. I don't know what MB was thinking when they went from the beautiful wide body of the W140 to the long narrow body of the W220 but they made up for it with the W221. I actually wasn't a fan of any MB car from 2000-2007 except for the E-class and even the CLS. Since 2007 they have been putting out some really beautiful cars.

Glad to see that not everyone on here is Biased just because they own/owned a Benz. The W212, F10 and now even the new A6 are all really nice cars that you cant go wrong with any of them.

ImInPA, Just seen a week ago that BMW is rumored to be rolling out a Diesel 375hp AWD M550

 

The new A6 seems very nice and it seems to have gone more upscale. Especially the great interior with a lot of design elements put in it from the A8... Unlike what happened to us with C class design elements being put in the E class...

I was surprised at how powerful their V6 engine is as it delivers almost as much performance as the new bi-turbo V8.

 

A co worker has driven an A6 for 8 years and is special ordering a 2012 A6. Driving the same car that long says something about it.

 

Could no disagree more on most of the above.

IMO, while new A6 now has a very exciting exterior, its interior disapoints (as compared to W212). Yes some interior design elements from the previous A8 (not current), but execution is far short - the seats are a joke (flat and ugly looking), cheap front storage center console (and even cheaper center rear console on even more expensive A7).

Powerful V6? Are you kidding me? Yes it has horsepower, but typical Audi low torque figures. It maybe better than 2012 MB V6, but to compare it to MB's bi-turbo V8? Its nowhere close to my 5.5 NA V8 in C207.

All above are based on my extensive (2 day) A7 testdrive - a car almost $10K more expensive than A6. Was sold on A7's exterior, but could not overcome shortcomings of V6 performance nor very disapointing (for Audi) interior compared not only to current A8, but even to my much less expensive W212.

 

I agree on everything except for the interior on the A6. Although its not going to give most people a "Wow" feeling once you sit in it, It's still on Par with other cars of its class like the W212 and F10.

But i completely agree on power. The A6's supercharged 3.0 can't compete with the V8 Bi-Turbo's of the W212 and F10. For a 6 banger it has a nice little Pep in its step, But The V8's will eat it up.
With just a simple tune on either of the 550's you would be in the neighborhood of 500bhp!
The 3.0 should have been the smaller engine option for the A6 with a Turbo 4.2 V8(de-Tuned RS6 motor)being the other. FWD 2.0T should not be an option on the A6.

 

I found the interior of the A6 to be lesser than the W212 in a material sense. Found quite a few hard, kind of chintzy plastics, mostly around the center console area, and on the doors, there's not one trace of stitching, just flat vinyl/plastic.

Definitely comparable, and still nice, but if I had to side with one, it'd be the E's, design and materially.