BenzV12

These are the key chains I have in my inventory lol
Having a Keyless GO , I don't get these outta my pocket but on rare occasions , I realize that //// AMG one looks very cool when I insert it in the ignition hole

I have just found an older pic of the car ,so you can literally take the pic in your eyes how it looks when it occupies ignition lock

drz

Boy after reading the deals some received I felt a bit taken.
But after "further review" like an NFL game here's my deal.

I bought my E 350 in June of 2013, very early not many on the lot.
Also Cleveland only has three MB dealers, I see some cities have more dealers to compete with consequently better discounts.

If I look at my deal as an " out the door price " I did OK, not as good as some but I was fine with it.

My car's MSRP was $ 67500.00
I received a $4500.00 discount or 5%
This left $63000.00
I received an additional $4000.00 on my trade in, I say additional because I was offered 4K less by a BMW , and Audi dealer on trade that week.

So it's the old less discount more trade in value game, I'm fine with that because in Ohio you only pay sales tax on the difference in price .

So $40,000 trade in with 7.5% sales tax saved me another $3000.00

My car full MSRP price with tax would have been $72,572.00
My out the door price with tax was $60,425.00.

I must say I was happy with the deal once conceived, because I would have heck of a time getting a 6% deal on a BMW after buying many in a ten year period, and only receiving low book value on trade. With 7.5% sales tax a 6% discount doesn't really add up.

**JAY-V**

LOL!!!

pcsgrp

I have a difficult decision. I picked up a E350 for my wife last year and I am trying to decide between a E350 wagon or a ML350. I do a lot of long distance driving and need some extra space to haul around "stuff" The dealer said that they might have better deals in December but I guess it is going to be the $1k from MBUSA or perhaps $2k. There is nothing on the wagon and I wonder what a good percent off would be for a P! without all the really expensive options just lane assist and or keyless

2006_C350

Depends, where are you located? So Cal has all the good deals

K-A

Like I keep saying. Even with the marketing effect of an extremely reconstructive freshly-facelift, W212's will return to their 15-25% discount "roots". Those who aren't getting these deals aren't looking hard enough or trying out a large enough geographical scope. I wouldn't get a W212 unless I got 20%+ off or at least very close to that. Too many people who do their research get those deals.

I've simply never seen a car get discounted as much as a W212, % wise. It's unbelievable how much they drop the prices on them to let them go for. IMO M-B should just lower the MSRP of the car as such deep discounts isn't even great for the cachet of the car.

Dema

They keep MSRP pair with BMW 5 series and they do it right. MB is just about $2k lower than equally equipped 5 series. I specifically tried to build similar equipped car on BMW site. If MB will reduce price, they will automatically slip to Volvo or even Camry range and it will badly impact reputation of E class. Currently every E class owner can proudly say I drive $70K car although paid just $50K. But only relatively small count people know that. If they lower price everyone will tell hey, you are a cheap guy I know E class it is slightly more powerful Camry with plastic seats. We are E class owners do not want to hear that

GregTR

I think this whole discussion about discounting is moot. What it comes down to is that it's obviously better to discount on the dealer side than on the customer side for multitude of reasons.

1) It is easier to hide it from the customers.
Not everyone is as knowledgeable about car buying as the people on this group. I'd venture to say that 90%+ of the customers have no idea nor desire to seek out the best and cheapest deal there is. When the manufacturer offers back-end cash incentive to the dealers to help them move inventory the dealer won't tell it to every customer that there is $4K cash support on every new E-class. They can use their discretion to discount to some customers to make the deal but keep most of that money with other buyers. Instead of thinking those customers are fools and idiots you should thank them because they are the deals that allow the dealer to make your 16% off MSRP possible. If they sold every car at 16% off MSRP they would go out of business at a fast pace.

2) It is easier to take it away.
When GM gives $8K buyer cash on every new truck it is close to impossible to ever take that money away. But when the cash is mostly invisible to the general population it's a lot easier to reel it in and get rid of it when BMW decides to hike their price or MBUSA knows that they're in the lead.

3) It helps with the brand image. If you were offering cash incentives to buyers it would devalue the brand and MB would be like GM. Obviously MB is banking on brand image and the last thing they would want to do to it is dilute it, at least here in North America.

4) It's a form of price discrimination. It is the manufacturer's and the dealer's best interest to maximize sales volume and profit by selling every single unit at a price that the individual will bear. This is why the P1 package costs $4k, not because the SatNav costs $4k. This is why you can get a $50k E-350 or pay twice that for an E63 which is essentially the same car. Is the E63 really has twice the engineering and material cost of the E350? No! But this way they can sell the same thing at multiple price points to people who can and are willing to pay that price for a little more. It's called rate of diminishing returns in economic terms. I find in amazing that Acura was a one price for all for the longest time and did not catch on to do this. I think they royally screwed themselves with one pricing something that comes off a US manufacturing line where a-la-carte ordering would be completely possible with a reasonable ordering time frame. They finally started to see the light and realized that they need to do some sort of price discrimination otherwise they will be left behind so with the latest MDX they did that by offering packages and 2wd and awd models to cover a wider range of pricing. It's still not the breadth of the W212 line but at least it's something.

I kind of find the notion ridiculous that people who cross-shop BMW, Audi and Mercedes will make a decision based on cost alone. I can assure you that most customers who're deciding between the A6, 525 and the E350 look at a lot more differentiating factors than the bottom price. $2K on $60K is 3%. I really don't think the 3% is what makes or breaks a deal. It would certainly not be enough to make me go from one to another if I made my decision based on other factors such as looks/features/driving characteristic/image etc.

Everyone seems so caught up on the "image". I find it laughable that most of you buy a car for the image it represents. I think you all are missing out on what really matters which is just how great these cars drive and how beautiful and refined the interiors are and how advanced the technology is that went into it. Those are the reasons to buy a MB, not because it has a star on the hood.

**JAY-V**

Don't think it has anything to do with image. MB just wants the bragging rights on volume #'s over BMW, Audi, Lexus, etc......

Trust me, they are still making money. There are still folks out there paying MSRP on mass produced vehicles due to lack of knowledge. Which is good for the MFR

T.H.Carrera

Thanks for pouring your heart out....

GregTR

The ML350 looks over $10k cheaper on paper but if you add 4matic, P01, Harman/Kardon, ambient lighting, rear side sunshades to it then a comparable E350 wagon is "only" $7K more (only P01). The ML is made in the USA, the E350 is made in Germany. The E350 drives like a car, the ML drives like an SUV. The E350 will seat 7 (2 children under 9 in the trunk) the ML will seat 5. The ML will tow, the E350 will not (I'm putting a hitch on mine, so it will tow my 8ft trailer with dirt bikes just fine).

It just depends on what you're looking for and how much you're willing to pay for it. On a wagon I think you can get $500-$750 over invoice in a competitive market, maybe even a bit less, but you will not get the discounts that people are getting on the sedan.

GregTR

No problem! I'm just sick of reading "luxury" this, "image" that followed by "what's the cheapest possible way I can get one of this amazing machines that really show I have arrived and I'm successful as sh*t?" I don't give a flying f*ck about any of that and quite honestly it amazes me that most forumites do while forgetting how great these cars really are.

**JAY-V**

The ML350 I optioned out had an MSRP of $7k less than the E350. There are absolutely zero incentives on the ML. And the money factor/residuals tend to suck on MB SUV products.

Dema

I am confused here, I can read tons posts claiming like
My Infiniti has a way better backup camera
My Honda has much better navigation
My Avalon coming with leather in stock
People are really angry to see that $60k priced car is lacking in many obvious things that $30k or even $20k may have. Is E is fastest car in the group unless we talk about E63? Even much cheaper Mustang will be faster. Does E class have best handling? BMW, Audi and many other cheaper cars will play better here. Refined interior? Only MB make $60k cars with vinyl covered seats. Big discount reflects that MB can't hold competition, so they heavily discount cars for people who still take them for Mercedes 3 points star.

**JAY-V**

Agreed.

Even the 5 series and X5 now have navi as a standard feature.

GregTR

Show me another vehicle in the US market that will carry 7 passengers, has the trunk space, drives like a German car and has distronic, park assist, ventilated seats and rear entertainment for less than an E350 wagon and I'll buy it. The closest to it was the Acura MDX until I drove it. That SUV/CUV (Whatever the f it is) drives like sh*t. As for all the sedan owners, I have no idea why anyone would buy that over a 5 series BMW...

I often ask myself "WTF costs $45K+ in my E90 or the A4 Avant?" but every time I get a ride or rent a domestic or Japanese car the answer becomes self evident.

Dema

As I understood E wagon is discounted much less. But you are right, I never have shopped for wagon, so I do not know competition. My point was toward to a sedan. You can also observe that most people here are fence sitters, if they can squeeze discount more than $12k then they will buy, so otherwise what they do? Walk? They will buy other make or live with current cars. So a reason of buying MB is only low price. But again I opposite KA point to lower price of E sedan. It will certainly impact car image, and will be a clear evidence than MB lost competition. I am fine with hidden discounts, but not lowering price

pcsgrp

I have to say, I was happy with my cars until I gave my wife a E350 for her birthday. The way I looked at it, she needed a car and the cost of a acura or Nissan was about 15k less then the MB and I felt better with her driving in a safer car. I want more room for stuff and am really torn between the us made M class and a E wagon. One of my employees had a M class and was T-boned by a 18 wheeler and the cop said he should have been killed but for the robustness of the ML he was driving. Since I am somewhat concerned about environmental issues I would like to get the best MPGs possible, hence my concerns for an SUV. If both the wagon and suv with as equal as possible equipment were similar in price, the wagon would be the choice. With a price difference there is more then enough difference to make up the cost of less mpg's of the ML. However, I drove the ML and it was just ok, nothing special. I also drove the MDX and it was different. Looking under the MDX, I was not impressed with the bottom of the car and how much things were exposed as compared to the M class. Between the two, the M would be the way to go but here is my quandary. I like the wagon, fits in my garage but it gets really beter mpg's. then the M class So, I am wanting to get the best possible price on a wagon. The dealers around here give you a line that they sell the cars at sticker which is bs. The few that they have include options I don't want and they have been sitting around for a few months. Dam, if I order a P! with lane assist and keyless entry, it will be a few grand less then the ones on the floor. However, if I get a good deal perhaps 10% off list, I might want to take the extra options.

instantfob

No worries. I have sent my contract to my BMW rep. He said BMW corporate knows about it and it's upping the dealer cash to assist to even out the playing field.

Deals on 528i and 535i just got sweeter. So customers save some money when the Germans fight against each other.

**JAY-V**

Damn it man!! Should have done that before I picked up the E!! I really wanted that 535i M Sport!!!

K-A

Bingo. IMO, such deep discounts reflect and introduce the notion that the car NEEDS to be discounted so much to compete. When you think of that, it makes sense that M-B felt they "needed" to do such an out-of-character drastic facelift. IMO lowering the MSRP would not only protect the resale of the car, but would be much fairer to the customers who'd get massive buyers-remorse when thinking that even a 10% discount they got was great... only to find out that E350 Sedans get let go for around 20% almost typically.

Perfectly put. Fact is, whether you like it or not, you ARE paying for the prestige and brand. The E Class or many premium-priced cars for that matter don't do all that many things on paper that much cheaper cars don't. The E has lots of standard features left out that you can find on much cheaper cars, all plastic seating, not a very powerful or torquey engine, MPG is decent, safety scores on par with much cheaper cars (though we all know M-B goes far beyond safety scores when it comes to real-world safety), and worst-in-class handling. A lot of that MSRP IS factoring in the branding and prestige.... which is why it's bothersome when the car gets so deeply discounted as that means that they aren't even protecting that. These are all high margin products after all (premium segment products).

I wouldn't mind that at all as I'd like to get an LCI 535i in White/Mocha and LED Lighting REALLY bad right now, however on the Bimmer boards I'm literally known as the guy who got possibly the BEST deal available practically in the history of well-equipped 535i's (thanks to the site owner), and even THAT didn't touch the discount I received on my 2 W212's which were done in middle of the years (i.e I got my Bimmer at the end of 2012 which meant E350's were leasing for even far cheaper than what mine were at that time).

Every time I'd go to BMW dealers and tell them what I was paying on my E Classes, they'd always look annoyed, as in they've heard it before. They'd remark with something about how M-B discounts their E Class so deeply it almost isn't fair as BMW won't resort to THAT kind of discount on the 5er. However, fast forward now a couple of years later, and BMW almost has no choice but to keep upping the incentives. Even then, I don't think you'll ever see 20-25% discounts on a 535i, which is almost regular fair on an E350 Sedan. I don't think you'll find too many 535i's at 10-15% even, which is considered kind of a low discount on an E350.

Of course, just to note, this is all of course based on my personal shopping experiences with both cars and what I've witnessed being on both boards.

GregTR

K-A, you seem to up the anecdotal discount every time you write about it from 15 to 20 to 25 percent. I have yet to see anyone getting that kind of a deal without employee or professional membership discount applied yet you make it sound like unless you got 25 percent off on a E sedan you were taken for a fool. Seriously, your anecdotal evidence and "expertise" is nil.

I love it how everyone is such a marketing and economic expert on this board and knows what the auto industry obviously has no idea how to do. Gotta love the peanut gallery and armchair auto industry insiders who can't even grasp the basics of supply and demand.

K-A

I've always said that 25% is the highest I've seen (people here have gotten that much last year around Holiday time).

15-20% is the norm if you want to get a doable good deal, based on my research and experience. I got 20% off of my 2011 E350 in the middle of 2011, without any tricks or research (I walked in and got convinced to trade in my 2010 E to drop my payments).

If it was me, considering all the deals I get sent to me from various dealers (which I have PM'd to many people), what I've seen others get, what I got before, and how I like to get a good deal, I wouldn't settle for less than 20% or more on an E350 (Sedan). And that's part of the problem, when they "give them away" like they do, it lowers the perceived value of the car to me, i.e I think "I don't think it's worth it unless I get 20+% off".

fintail

I love it how some assume what others on the forum might know or do. See the first three letters of "assume"? It fits the spoiled bragging type well. Maybe it's some residual 3er driver douchiness seeping through

But seriously, these cars can be discounted plenty and still be profitable. These are not handmade Faberge eggs - they are efficiently made on a modern assembly line like any other mainstream car, and are made as fast and in as great of quantity as realistically possible. Costs are easily recovered, especially on platforms with a few years under them.

And maybe furthermore, the average punter concerned with "image" is only looking at MSRP and has no clue about discounts. These cars could be had with discounts 20++ years ago as well. Didn't matter then, doesn't matter now. Worry more about longterm reliability.

K-A

No M-B's ever got the discounts W212's do. In fact, I don't think any car in history that sells at such high volume has gotten discounts like W212's do. The W211's couldn't be attained so cheaply during their heyday, and back in the day, you might have been able to get discounts on M-B's, but nowhere near "discount brand" territory of 15%++ all day long.

Per dealers I've spoken to, E350 buyers always just want the "cheapest" version, the most basic package, which is why you rarely ever see even P2 Package pre-facelifts. Part of that is probably because shoppers get the taste of blood as to how cheaply W212's are attained for. I.e the "culture of buyer" has been formed to now look at an E350 in terms of how discounted it is, not how well equipped it is, etc.

When I see someone driving an E350, knowing what I do abut what they lease for, I can't help but assume the person got it more-so because it was by far the cheapest to lease out of the competition or "not much more than a loaded Economy car i.e Camry/Accord", not because it was their top choice. And that's another way such deep discounts hurt the cachet of the cars, it gives the impression that they HAVE to be discounted so deeply to entice buyers who aren't enticed about the car UNLESS it's been let go for so cheap to begin with. I had these same feelings when I was a W212 stalwart fan and had my own as well, so it's nothing developed since changing brands.