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Cool Air = Faster than normal Car

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E-Class (W212) 2010 - 2016: E 350, E 550

Cool Air = Faster than normal Car

 
Old 02-07-2019, 11:20 PM
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Cool Air = Faster than normal Car

It is cold in Vancouver today.
- 1 degree Celsius ... 30 degrees F. Just below freezing.

On the way home after a long day of work, on a deserted country road - i decided to do a standing start on dry pavement.

I must have mashed the accelerator just right - because the V-8, E550 took off like a real beast. The jolt of power really brought a smile to my face.

I know NA engines like cool air - like an inter-cooler gets more HP / Torque.

I must have been well on the way to a well below sub 5 second 0-60 run. Took my foot off the gas because my stomach felt like the start of Rocking Roller Coaster at Disney.

It was awesome ... the ESP light flickering in the darkness as the car was barely holding traction.

Very cool experience ... got close to home and realized I was in Eco mode ...

Usually I switch to Sport as soon as Istart the car.

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Old 02-08-2019, 08:32 AM
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Itís the fastest sedan I have ever owned including the early 4 door C32 AMG. Yes, it loves cold air.
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Old 02-08-2019, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
It is cold in Vancouver today.
- 1 degree Celsius ... 30 degrees F. Just below freezing.

On the way home after a long day of work, on a deserted country road - i decided to do a standing start on dry pavement.

I must have mashed the accelerator just right - because the V-8, E550 took off like a real beast. The jolt of power really brought a smile to my face.

I know NA engines like cool air - like an inter-cooler gets more HP / Torque.

I must have been well on the way to a well below sub 5 second 0-60 run. Took my foot off the gas because my stomach felt like the start of Rocking Roller Coaster at Disney.

It was awesome ... the ESP light flickering in the darkness as the car was barely holding traction.

Very cool experience ... got close to home and realized I was in Eco mode ...

Usually I switch to Sport as soon as Istart the car.
Same here. My car is noticeably stronger with cool weather. I donít get freezing temperatures other than a day or two a year but at 45F it is already stronger.

Another thing that that makes it stronger is to turn the A/C off. The compressor can be running even during cold winter climate for de-frosting. It takes aboit 10% of the fuel mileage so it is quite big power consumer.
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Old 02-08-2019, 10:04 AM
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Cold air is great for engines Simple as that. Imagine if you had the Bi turbocharged E550 With AWD. Sport Mode on. No A/C on too helps
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Old 02-08-2019, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by C280 Sport View Post
Cold air is great for engines Simple as that. Imagine if you had the Bi turbocharged E550 With AWD. Sport Mode on. No A/C on too helps
yes, my exact current 550. I also had a 2010 N/A 550 4M. Both wicked fast and still prefer the sound of the N/A over the TT.
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Old 02-08-2019, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by KEY08 View Post


yes, my exact current 550. I also had a 2010 N/A 550 4M. Both wicked fast and still prefer the sound of the N/A over the TT.
Really? Most people say otherwise. Interesting! Why so? Sound? Feel of it?
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Old 02-08-2019, 02:30 PM
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Cool air has more oxygen in it than hot air. So if you run a fixed air/fuel mixture, you get more power with cool air than hot air.
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Old 02-08-2019, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by C280 Sport View Post
Really? Most people say otherwise. Interesting! Why so? Sound? Feel of it?
the turbos upset the exhaust flow and dampen it. The N/A keeps the exhaust unencombered. You should hear my N/A GT 350. I think itís 100db stock with the exhaust valves open
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Old 02-08-2019, 05:18 PM
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Very cool. Too bad I live in Florida. On the plus side, it was 80 and gorgeous today.
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by thefisch View Post
Very cool. Too bad I live in Florida. On the plus side, it was 80 and gorgeous today.
Ah, yes. . . but at least here in the Upper Rust Belt we get higher air density more often. That said, my turbo car doesn't care - it just keeps the waste gates closed until it hits target pressure.
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:27 PM
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Even if the car is 0.1 second faster, even with stop watch it is not measurable.
So we are talking 99% placebo effect here?
Than remember that dense air make bigger air drag.
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Old 02-08-2019, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by kajtek1 View Post
Even if the car is 0.1 second faster, even with stop watch it is not measurable.
So we are talking 99% placebo effect here?
Than remember that dense air make bigger air drag.
It's definitely measurable. Probably more accurate to say cold air typically has less water vapor than hot humid air. It's a standard phenomenon when flying. Hot summer weather a prop plane doesn't develop as much power and lots of times you hear of small plane crashes where the plane was overloaded for the temperature, the engine just doesn't develop enough power to lift off.

When I worked at a gas power plant, it was evident in the power output, hot summer days the plant struggled to do 270 megawatts, normally it was around 300, in the winter it could go as high as 340.
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Old 02-08-2019, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by thefisch View Post
Very cool. Too bad I live in Florida. On the plus side, it was 80 and gorgeous today.
Ya it was!
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Old 02-09-2019, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by kajtek1 View Post
Even if the car is 0.1 second faster, even with stop watch it is not measurable.
So we are talking 99% placebo effect here?
Than remember that dense air make bigger air drag.
Using the ideal gas law PV = nRT you can easily look into this.

Assuming the volume and pressure stay constant, like is the case with N/A engine we can write the equitation as n = (1/T) x (PV/R). In this formula (PV/R) stays constant as assumed above.

Now the temperature T is the absolute temperature and for 90 F it is 305.4 K and 40 F is 277.6 K

So the amount of air moles (n) at 90 F is n = (1/305.4) x (PV/R) and at 40F n = (1/277.6) x (PV/R)

The ratio of the amount of air moles is then 305.4/277.6 = 1.10, i.e. 40F air has 10% more material than 90F air in the same volume. This means 40F air has 10% more oxygen than 90F air meaning the engine control system can spray 10% more fuel to burn the oxygen. This should result in 10% more power with the same throttle opening.

With an engine with almost 400 hp it is roughly 40 hp increase in power and this should indeed be noticeable. In my car is certainly is. And some tunes advertise only about this magnitude power increase so if those are noticeable so should the effect of the lower air temperature also be.

Turbo engines are probably different and I don't know how the air temperature after turbo chargers is controlled but the max pressure is controlled with the waste gates and volume entering the engine should stay pretty much the same so if the air temperature drops the above calculation should somewhat apply to turbo charged engines too.
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Old 02-09-2019, 03:38 PM
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As the the thermodynamic equation predicts - if in actuality there is a 10% increase in power (considering 90 F air vs 40 F air) ... does that relate directly to 0 to 60 acceleration?

If 5 second run (that may be a common feeling for an E 550 driver - which is impressive enough) turns into a 4.5 second run ... that would probably produce noticeable physical sensations in the body. I believe that is what put the smile on my face.

More than a pure placebo effect. Although that was in play as well.
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Old 02-09-2019, 07:58 PM
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Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
As the the thermodynamic equation predicts - if in actuality there is a 10% increase in power (considering 90 F air vs 40 F air) ... does that relate directly to 0 to 60 acceleration?

If 5 second run (that may be a common feeling for an E 550 driver - which is impressive enough) turns into a 4.5 second run ... that would probably produce noticeable physical sensations in the body. I believe that is what put the smile on my face.

More than a pure placebo effect. Although that was in play as well.
Like I said in my post my car is noticeably stronger in cold weather. It is very easy to feel.
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Old 02-09-2019, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
More than a pure placebo effect. Although that was in play as well.
Well you could always measure it with this butt dyno.

http://kalecoauto.com/index.php?main...&products_id=8


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Old 02-10-2019, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Arrie View Post
Using the ideal gas law PV = nRT you can easily look into this.

Assuming the volume and pressure stay constant, like is the case with N/A engine we can write the equitation as n = (1/T) x (PV/R). In this formula (PV/R) stays constant as assumed above.

Now the temperature T is the absolute temperature and for 90 F it is 305.4 K and 40 F is 277.6 K

So the amount of air moles (n) at 90 F is n = (1/305.4) x (PV/R) and at 40F n = (1/277.6) x (PV/R)

The ratio of the amount of air moles is then 305.4/277.6 = 1.10, i.e. 40F air has 10% more material than 90F air in the same volume. This means 40F air has 10% more oxygen than 90F air meaning the engine control system can spray 10% more fuel to burn the oxygen. This should result in 10% more power with the same throttle opening.
Knowledge bomb! Seriously, thanks for sharing.

Iím going to try my best to remember this little factoid so I can sound smart one day down the road.
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Old 02-10-2019, 11:27 AM
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Old 02-10-2019, 11:57 AM
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After 45 minutes of driving.. at a traffic stop in Houston, TX

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Old 02-10-2019, 01:41 PM
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You have 76F at 8 AM in Houston?
How did you get the oil temp display?
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Old 02-10-2019, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by kajtek1 View Post
You have 76F at 8 AM in Houston?
How did you get the oil temp display?
It was 7:13pm on 02/06/19 to be exact.

You can get the coolant temp + engine temp + current gear display + lap timer etc by activating the AMG Menu on the instrument cluster (even Non-AMG vehicles). Of course you will need MB SDConnect + Vediamo + some expertise.

Last edited by zeemob; 02-10-2019 at 02:06 PM.
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Old 02-10-2019, 07:39 PM
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Last year I tried to show my ditz neighbor why his cheap aftermarket "cold air intake" caused his car to perform worse not better.
It was just sucking in underhood air, and the aluminum tube acted like a big heat sink. I hooked up my scanner to show real time data. This was in Texas late summer.
Stock airbox and inlet IAT temp 96d F
Aftermarket air intake IAT temp 134d F
MAF sensor gm/sec reading increased with cooler air inlet temps, I figured due to denser air.
Short term fuel trim range also increased with the after market intake, I took it to be due to a leaner condition. I doubted the cone filter flowed any better than a good quality stock paper filter.
It was actually a hot air intake that made more noise.
I think cooler denser air is a good thing especially when its free as in outdoor temperature drop. The nice thing is that with computer controls the vehicle can take advantage of it!
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Old 02-21-2019, 11:16 PM
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Another near freezing night and a good acceleration run on the way home.

Has anyone ever noticed how the car reacts differently when the gas pedal is stabbed very quickly? Toe pushed up into the footwell.

i donít think it is my imagination.

Gas pedal monitored for maxacceleration under under certain movements of the pedal?
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Old 02-21-2019, 11:31 PM
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Originally Posted by ChrisB View Post
Has anyone ever noticed how the car reacts differently when the gas pedal is stabbed very quickly? Toe pushed up into the footwell.
My E550 takes off like a damn rocket then lurches like it hit the end of a bungee cord when it shifts. I'm not sure if it's due to transmission, ESC, whatever other reason. Some time I'll record my instrument cluster while doing this because I'm usually too concerned with keeping my eyes on the road to see what's going on.
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