Mercedes has the wrong balance between legal worries and customer convenience
Thread Starter
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 180
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From: California
E300
Mercedes has the wrong balance between legal worries and customer convenience
I love the driving characteristics of the car--steering, comfort, ride, handling, fuel economy, acceleration. If only they would correct some really dumb things the car would be great. As it is, the dumb things are too annoying and detract too much.
-to adjust the drivers seat, you have to press the appropriate button and keep pressing until it finishes. This means I have to stand outside, sometimes in the rain and cold, because my wife keeps the seat too far
forward for me to get in. Dumb
-there is no way to preview the navigation route. You just have to follow blindly with no idea how it's taking you Dumb
-the navigation gives very short warning of when to change lanes and to exit a freeway. At 65-70 mph, it can be difficult or impossible to get into the exit lane in time. Dumb.
-the owners manual is crammed with so many legal disclaimers that it's hard to find the instructions. Why not at least put the disclaimers on the left hand page and the instructions on the right?
-overall, there are too many complicated menus within minus within menus. Why not strive for a user friendly car with controls that are fairly self evident and which don't distract you from driving?
i get the impression that legal concerns are behind some of these things. I haven't seen any other car company that appears so preoccupied with legal issues and which is so willing to sacrifice customer convenience friendliness for covering their legal concerns. As a lawyer myself I think Mercedes has the balance all wrong. I fully understand the legal concerns but they should always not outweigh making a car that works well for customers. Mercedes, I hope you're listening.
-to adjust the drivers seat, you have to press the appropriate button and keep pressing until it finishes. This means I have to stand outside, sometimes in the rain and cold, because my wife keeps the seat too far
forward for me to get in. Dumb
-there is no way to preview the navigation route. You just have to follow blindly with no idea how it's taking you Dumb
-the navigation gives very short warning of when to change lanes and to exit a freeway. At 65-70 mph, it can be difficult or impossible to get into the exit lane in time. Dumb.
-the owners manual is crammed with so many legal disclaimers that it's hard to find the instructions. Why not at least put the disclaimers on the left hand page and the instructions on the right?
-overall, there are too many complicated menus within minus within menus. Why not strive for a user friendly car with controls that are fairly self evident and which don't distract you from driving?
i get the impression that legal concerns are behind some of these things. I haven't seen any other car company that appears so preoccupied with legal issues and which is so willing to sacrifice customer convenience friendliness for covering their legal concerns. As a lawyer myself I think Mercedes has the balance all wrong. I fully understand the legal concerns but they should always not outweigh making a car that works well for customers. Mercedes, I hope you're listening.
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2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
Sorry, but they're not--at least not here.
I agree with much of what you have said. I am very critical of things MB does which I feel are ridiculous and idiotic, but the only way I have been able to see anything in the way of confirmation that they are hearing me, is by contacting MBUSA and/or MB corporate in Germany, over and over again.
For anyone who feels they have a legitimate gripe AND some good, clear, constructive comments, you might try a short, concise letter to this gentleman:
Dietmar Exler
President & CEO
MBUSA
I agree with much of what you have said. I am very critical of things MB does which I feel are ridiculous and idiotic, but the only way I have been able to see anything in the way of confirmation that they are hearing me, is by contacting MBUSA and/or MB corporate in Germany, over and over again.
For anyone who feels they have a legitimate gripe AND some good, clear, constructive comments, you might try a short, concise letter to this gentleman:
Dietmar Exler
President & CEO
MBUSA
Thread Starter
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 180
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From: California
E300
Mercedes wrong balance
I already said that I understand the reasons for what they're doing. But companies have to balance legal concerns with customer issues . A company that totally protects itself from legal liabilities but inconveniences and even angers its customers is not going to succeed. Companies certainly have to be aware of legal issues but lawyers and company executives also need to get the balance right. In my opinion as an experienced lawyer, Mercedes has gone much too far in the direction of trying to insinuate itself from liability at the cost of its customers.
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2019 SL450, 2019 E450 Luxury Trim Wagon, 2024 BMW I7 xDrive60
I already said that I understand the reasons for what they're doing. But companies have to balance legal concerns with customer issues . A company that totally protects itself from legal liabilities but inconveniences and even angers its customers is not going to succeed. Companies certainly have to be aware of legal issues but lawyers and company executives also need to get the balance right. In my opinion as an experienced lawyer, Mercedes has gone much too far in the direction of trying to insinuate itself from liability at the cost of its customers.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Sep 2009
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From: California
E300
Thanks Streamliner. My last post was responding to Vicviper who commented that an American lawyer should understand Mercedes legal concerns. I have advised many companies. A lawyer who only worries about liabilities and not about customers is not an effective lawyer, as you already know.
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From: Sweden
S213
I understand, but here in Europe the need for such things are pretty much non existent, I have seen several imported US-spec vehicles with their warning lables and texts written over everything you touch and then some.
This is a culture specific for the US market and I really cant blame Daimler for doing so.
Then again I fully understand you, I wouldnt like it as well.
This is a culture specific for the US market and I really cant blame Daimler for doing so.
Then again I fully understand you, I wouldnt like it as well.
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This thread reads like a seniors convention. Blame the idiot American consumer for all this legal nonsense if that is what those things are truly about. If you change that seat memory button to a one press function, someone will get hurt by a moving seat and sue. It's that simple. Or Mercedes will have to design it to stop moving when it senses an obstruction. Now the smart thing would be the design the key fob with a button to adjust the car to that drivers settings, BEFORE the driver gets in the car. That way the seats can move and whatever else with no fear of crushing anyone.
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This thread reads like a seniors convention. Blame the idiot American consumer for all this legal nonsense if that is what those things are truly about. If you change that seat memory button to a one press function, someone will get hurt by a moving seat and sue. It's that simple. Or Mercedes will have to design it to stop moving when it senses an obstruction. Now the smart thing would be the design the key fob with a button to adjust the car to that drivers settings, BEFORE the driver gets in the car. That way the seats can move and whatever else with no fear of crushing anyone.
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All the warning stickers are a little crazy these days though, probably why no one even reads them anymore.
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This thread reads like a seniors convention. Blame the idiot American consumer for all this legal nonsense if that is what those things are truly about. If you change that seat memory button to a one press function, someone will get hurt by a moving seat and sue. It's that simple. Or Mercedes will have to design it to stop moving when it senses an obstruction. Now the smart thing would be the design the key fob with a button to adjust the car to that drivers settings, BEFORE the driver gets in the car. That way the seats can move and whatever else with no fear of crushing anyone.
M
M
What I see as the "real" problem is that disclaimers are useless in our blame-game society.
What if...when you take delivery of your car you sign a paper (hold harmless disclaimer) that says by taking delivery you accept the automatic one-press operation of the seats, rather than press-and-hold. First of all, it would likely be a 10 page document.
Show of hands how many think it would hold up in court?
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I understand, but here in Europe the need for such things are pretty much non existent, I have seen several imported US-spec vehicles with their warning lables and texts written over everything you touch and then some.
This is a culture specific for the US market and I really cant blame Daimler for doing so.
Then again I fully understand you, I wouldnt like it as well.
This is a culture specific for the US market and I really cant blame Daimler for doing so.
Then again I fully understand you, I wouldnt like it as well.
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From: Dallas TX
2013 650i Coupe, 2010 IS250 AWD, 1999 S500
Yeah, but what if you left a child sleeping on the back seat who rolls onto the floor and then gets crushed when the seat moves back? Or left some stuff on the back seat that barely fit?
All the warning stickers are a little crazy these days though, probably why no one even reads them anymore.
All the warning stickers are a little crazy these days though, probably why no one even reads them anymore.
M
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I tend to agree with you. Regarding seat positioning buttons, what is Mercedes afraid of that Cadillac and others are not?
What I see as the "real" problem is that disclaimers are useless in our blame-game society.
What if...when you take delivery of your car you sign a paper (hold harmless disclaimer) that says by taking delivery you accept the automatic one-press operation of the seats, rather than press-and-hold. First of all, it would likely be a 10 page document.
Show of hands how many think it would hold up in court?
What I see as the "real" problem is that disclaimers are useless in our blame-game society.
What if...when you take delivery of your car you sign a paper (hold harmless disclaimer) that says by taking delivery you accept the automatic one-press operation of the seats, rather than press-and-hold. First of all, it would likely be a 10 page document.
Show of hands how many think it would hold up in court?
There is a saying about all the lab testing in the world doesn't come close to Joe buying Public testing.
M
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Bingo, that's exactly the point. To cover the possibility, no matter how unlikely, that one idiot might do something stupid the rest of us are restricted/punished.
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At least the seat buttons are located within view. That isn't the case with BMW that has the buttons out of sight on the side of the seat near the floor. One touch on the wrong button and one must suffer the consequences.
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...if you think MB does this badly, you should see how Toyota handles it!
I had a Toyota Avalon as a rental this week. You can't even dial a phone # / contact whilst driving. The car grays out the dial options until you're at a complete stop!
I found this out when I went to call the state police to report an accident I saw. Way to go lawyers / enginerds! You've managed to make the car less safe.
I still think it was a mistake for MB to remove the 10-key from their cars. The E-class has long been a businessman's car. I'm not sure about the rest of you, but mine is often my mobile office. MUCH easier to key in my SkyMiles # on the 10-key than the jog/dial or touchpad.
I had a Toyota Avalon as a rental this week. You can't even dial a phone # / contact whilst driving. The car grays out the dial options until you're at a complete stop!
I found this out when I went to call the state police to report an accident I saw. Way to go lawyers / enginerds! You've managed to make the car less safe.
I still think it was a mistake for MB to remove the 10-key from their cars. The E-class has long been a businessman's car. I'm not sure about the rest of you, but mine is often my mobile office. MUCH easier to key in my SkyMiles # on the 10-key than the jog/dial or touchpad.
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I still think it was a mistake for MB to remove the 10-key from their cars. The E-class has long been a businessman's car. I'm not sure about the rest of you, but mine is often my mobile office. MUCH easier to key in my SkyMiles # on the 10-key than the jog/dial or touchpad.
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Why are we seeking for a better balance from MB, why not insist on better legal requirements that allow the user benefits that we are after without a risk for the car manufacturer.
Considering the touch-pad, I understood it was initially supposed to be a combination or the best parts of the two instead of a compromise (which it is now). Like a numerical keypad being implemented as a soft option. Not sure if intellectual property, or some legal sfuff prevented this combination.
Considering the touch-pad, I understood it was initially supposed to be a combination or the best parts of the two instead of a compromise (which it is now). Like a numerical keypad being implemented as a soft option. Not sure if intellectual property, or some legal sfuff prevented this combination.
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S213
Fun fact, older Mercedes models had seat memory tied to the key, adjusting the seat as soon as the vehicle gets unlocked.
The easy entry function also hade the seat moving backwards before exiting.
Have no idea why they ditched these functions.
In my own car I have set the seat moving back to memory position 3, so before exiting I press 3 to make it easy to exit and then entering the next time.
The easy entry function also hade the seat moving backwards before exiting.
Have no idea why they ditched these functions.
In my own car I have set the seat moving back to memory position 3, so before exiting I press 3 to make it easy to exit and then entering the next time.
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Fun fact, older Mercedes models had seat memory tied to the key, adjusting the seat as soon as the vehicle gets unlocked.
The easy entry function also hade the seat moving backwards before exiting.
Have no idea why they ditched these functions.
In my own car I have set the seat moving back to memory position 3, so before exiting I press 3 to make it easy to exit and then entering the next time.
The easy entry function also hade the seat moving backwards before exiting.
Have no idea why they ditched these functions.
In my own car I have set the seat moving back to memory position 3, so before exiting I press 3 to make it easy to exit and then entering the next time.
The easy entry is still available.
