Let's Hope MBUSA Doesn't Pick Up This Disgusting Add-On
#1
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Let's Hope MBUSA Doesn't Pick Up This Disgusting Add-On
I will be mighty ticked if all of the sudden MBUSA starts this ridiculous subscription fee: https://www.idropnews.com/news/want-...=notifications
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rbrylaw (07-24-2019)
#3
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From: Los Angeles, California
2020 MB E450, 2007 VW GTI
If MBUSA thinks it won't affect sales, then they will go ahead and start charging for Apple CarPlay. However, if MBUSA does that, then Mercedes fans will start to get vocal and it may just start pushing potential customers to consider other brands that don't have as many pissed off customers. I don't see this as being a good long term play.
#4
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MB W213 E300 4MATIC Luxury Model
I will be mighty ticked if all of the sudden MBUSA starts this ridiculous subscription fee: https://www.idropnews.com/news/want-...=notifications
#6
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#7
On lower-end models, like the base CLA, it is an optional paid extra: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/bu...=entertainment
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#8
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I'm in the US. In higher-end models it is indeed standard, which is why I said some models.
On lower-end models, like the base CLA, it is an optional paid extra: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/bu...=entertainment
On lower-end models, like the base CLA, it is an optional paid extra: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/bu...=entertainment
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ardenne90 (10-21-2019)
#9
I'm in the US. In higher-end models it is indeed standard, which is why I said some models.
On lower-end models, like the base CLA, it is an optional paid extra: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/bu...=entertainment
On lower-end models, like the base CLA, it is an optional paid extra: https://www.mbusa.com/en/vehicles/bu...=entertainment
It is somewhat similar to the subscription service to Verizon that allows you to have a Wi-Fi hotspot in the car in the US, but it's very easy to live without that option, whereas if you are used to Apple Carplay (I use it a lot for Waze and Google Maps), you will feel robbed of a feature you previously took for granted, all for some mean stingy customer nickel-and-diming. If MBUSA is clever, they will do nothing and let angry BMW customers flock to them... On the other hand, Daimler-Benz just posted the first quarterly loss since 2009, so stinginess may strike here too... https://fortune.com/2019/07/24/merce...candal-airbag/
#10
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Count me as someone who uses Apple CarPlay a LOT. I just cancelled my Pandora account, when a forum member here let me know I could set up all my Pandora stations in the SiriusXM app for free and it's included in the CarPlay app list. If MBUSA decides I should have pay a subscription fee to use something I already have, would just be wrong.
#11
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Is BMW simply trying to recover revenues lost because they offer free periodic maintenance for X years (and MBUSA does not)? Seems like it might be a wash to me...
#12
Are not subscription fees for something you get every month with content or bandwith?
Like magazines, newspapers, Cable or satelite, Netflix, Cellular service....
So what would this subscription cover?
I have Never used Apple car play as none of my vehicles have it and having never used it I have no idea what I am missing...
Is not Apple Car Play a radio that can talk to your Apple Cell phone and use what is on the phone and have a special screen that is pretty much common for all apple car play cars?
What happens if you pay for it one month - and then never pay again - how can BMW turn it off? (yeah visit dealer)
But if you do not have the car connected to internet because your are cheap (ME) then how?
Are they in radio contact with cars all the time? that scares me more.
Whats next you have to pay monthly to use any other option on the car like distronic or ventilated seats?
Oh you want to use the AC - pay $50 a month.
My brain cannot wrap itself around this one... nor the thinking of the bean counters...
I have no problem paying for option of this (if I want it) but monthly subscriptions! hell no.
Like magazines, newspapers, Cable or satelite, Netflix, Cellular service....
So what would this subscription cover?
I have Never used Apple car play as none of my vehicles have it and having never used it I have no idea what I am missing...
Is not Apple Car Play a radio that can talk to your Apple Cell phone and use what is on the phone and have a special screen that is pretty much common for all apple car play cars?
What happens if you pay for it one month - and then never pay again - how can BMW turn it off? (yeah visit dealer)
But if you do not have the car connected to internet because your are cheap (ME) then how?
Are they in radio contact with cars all the time? that scares me more.
Whats next you have to pay monthly to use any other option on the car like distronic or ventilated seats?
Oh you want to use the AC - pay $50 a month.
My brain cannot wrap itself around this one... nor the thinking of the bean counters...
I have no problem paying for option of this (if I want it) but monthly subscriptions! hell no.
#13
Tell me how to transfer stations
Count me as someone who uses Apple CarPlay a LOT. I just cancelled my Pandora account, when a forum member here let me know I could set up all my Pandora stations in the SiriusXM app for free and it's included in the CarPlay app list. If MBUSA decides I should have pay a subscription fee to use something I already have, would just be wrong.
#14
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I read that Mercedes will charge for ACP (announced July 27, 2019). Looks like the first year is free...
"The luxury German automaker has confirmed it will charge a subscription fee for Apple CarPlay for drivers of 2019 models onward. It should be noted that buyers will receive one year's access for free, but it will cost $80 per year from then on. Jul 27, 2019"
Has anyone received notice of this from MBUSA?
https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...4dUDCAs&uact=5
"The luxury German automaker has confirmed it will charge a subscription fee for Apple CarPlay for drivers of 2019 models onward. It should be noted that buyers will receive one year's access for free, but it will cost $80 per year from then on. Jul 27, 2019"
Has anyone received notice of this from MBUSA?
https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...4dUDCAs&uact=5
Last edited by DFWdude; 10-20-2019 at 12:29 PM.
#15
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2018 S560 and 2019 E450 Wagon.
I wonder about the legalities of BMW doing this where as Car play is a apple thing, there could be a lawsuit. I think Benz would be foolish to follow, they are gonna loose more customers than the money they make for this charge and potential legal fees. I think BMW is just desperate, from what I heard they have financial troubles.
#16
I read that Mercedes will charge for ACP (announced July 27, 2019). Looks like the first year is free...
"The luxury German automaker has confirmed it will charge a subscription fee for Apple CarPlay for drivers of 2019 models onward. It should be noted that buyers will receive one year's access for free, but it will cost $80 per year from then on. Jul 27, 2019"
Has anyone received notice of this from MBUSA?
https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...4dUDCAs&uact=5
"The luxury German automaker has confirmed it will charge a subscription fee for Apple CarPlay for drivers of 2019 models onward. It should be noted that buyers will receive one year's access for free, but it will cost $80 per year from then on. Jul 27, 2019"
Has anyone received notice of this from MBUSA?
https://www.google.com/search?safe=o...4dUDCAs&uact=5
Are you just trying to be funny, are you confused, or do you actually have news of MBUSA making the very same decision BMW made, and on the very same day BMW made its announcement, but that all of us missed?
#17
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Your link talks about BMW making this announcement on July 27, 2019, but then you attribute it to Mercedes and ask who has received the BMW notice from MBUSA??
Are you just trying to be funny, are you confused, or do you actually have news of MBUSA making the very same decision BMW made, and on the very same day BMW made its announcement, but that all of us missed?
Are you just trying to be funny, are you confused, or do you actually have news of MBUSA making the very same decision BMW made, and on the very same day BMW made its announcement, but that all of us missed?
Doesn't matter to me as I don't drink the apple cool-aid.
Last edited by DFWdude; 10-20-2019 at 03:35 PM.
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usc96 (10-20-2019)
#18
I will be mighty ticked if all of the sudden MBUSA starts this ridiculous subscription fee: https://www.idropnews.com/news/want-...=notifications
#19
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From: South Carolina
2020 MB E450 Estate, 2019 Kia Niro Touring
Sales people today are making a (relatively) big deal about Apple Carplay and Android Auto both being free on MB, with only Apple Carplay offered by BMW and at a price. I certainly hope they keep offering it free. But based on what we're seeing on traffic, etc., who knows. The following article, referring to the BMW, is pretty good at explaining the complexities and rationale involved, and makes some good points, many of which apply to MB owners (like if we're paying for AA, they'd probably make sure wide screen, etc. were supported):
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...ost-explainer/
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...ost-explainer/
#20
The status of these subscriptions are verified periodically with the server by the car's headunit/infotainment system. And BMW's lackluster way of implementing this already created an outage in May of this year. BMW owners were unable to use CarPlay on their cars during the period of the outage even if they had a valid subscription.
https://9to5mac.com/2019/05/09/bmw-carplay-outage/
https://www.engadget.com/2019/05/10/bmw-carplay-outage/
Car makers are looking for additional revenue streams, and I would not be surprised if more such subscriptions start popping up in future vehicles. Car makers can build the same hardware for all vehicles and then use software to enable/disable features behind a subscription. In terms of cost this might not work for all hardware, especially expensive mechanical components. However, it is very much possible to develop just one infotainment/headunit hardware and provide premium experiences gated behind software subscriptions. Car makers save a lot by avoiding R&D and upfront costs manufacturing different kinds of parts.
Vast majority of consumers think twice about paying a cost upfront but do not mind paying a smaller subscription amount (even if they are actually paying more over time). Most consumers also do not bother canceling subscriptions even if they are not using it. They set up billing with their credit card for the subscription and forget about it altogether. Monthly phone plans (vs prepaid), Netflix subscriptions, Amazon Prime subscriptions, etc. are good examples here. Many folks have redundant subscriptions. Some of them do offer value and exclusive benefits, but it's just typical consumer tendency to not cancel subscriptions.
https://9to5mac.com/2019/05/09/bmw-carplay-outage/
https://www.engadget.com/2019/05/10/bmw-carplay-outage/
Car makers are looking for additional revenue streams, and I would not be surprised if more such subscriptions start popping up in future vehicles. Car makers can build the same hardware for all vehicles and then use software to enable/disable features behind a subscription. In terms of cost this might not work for all hardware, especially expensive mechanical components. However, it is very much possible to develop just one infotainment/headunit hardware and provide premium experiences gated behind software subscriptions. Car makers save a lot by avoiding R&D and upfront costs manufacturing different kinds of parts.
Vast majority of consumers think twice about paying a cost upfront but do not mind paying a smaller subscription amount (even if they are actually paying more over time). Most consumers also do not bother canceling subscriptions even if they are not using it. They set up billing with their credit card for the subscription and forget about it altogether. Monthly phone plans (vs prepaid), Netflix subscriptions, Amazon Prime subscriptions, etc. are good examples here. Many folks have redundant subscriptions. Some of them do offer value and exclusive benefits, but it's just typical consumer tendency to not cancel subscriptions.
#21
Not at all confused, not being funny. I simply googled, "does Mercedes charge for apple car play" and the quote is what I got. Why google gave me a result for Mercedes' chief competitor, I have no idea. I just wondered if it was true and MBUSA followed suit. Apparently it isn't.
Doesn't matter to me as I don't drink the apple cool-aid.
Doesn't matter to me as I don't drink the apple cool-aid.
Last edited by ua549; 10-20-2019 at 06:38 PM.
#22
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It's crazy what BMW is doing, it's not like it even costs them any money for a cloud service with servers and all like it does MB with the Mercedes me app. Basically they offer this feature to be competitive with the other manufactures for the convenience of the custom and it does not cost them much of anything and are trying to nickel and dime the customer.
#23
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From: South Carolina
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https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...ost-explainer/
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CarFan1 (10-21-2019)
#25
Did you read the BMW article I quoted above? It actually makes some pretty good points on why offering this service certainly /does/ cost them money. By charging for it, they/we would be pretty certain it would stay available and up-to-date, like with, uh, widescreen support? The article is here:
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...ost-explainer/
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a2...ost-explainer/
With Carplay/Android Auto, there are two sides - the software on the head unit and the software on the phone side. To ensure better quality control and interoperability, reference APIs and certification programs are developed by Apple/Google. In other words, when a Car manufacturer comes up with a new head unit for one of the models, they already do these certifications to ensure broader compatibility across different AndroidAuto/CarPlay versions and phone models. Similarly Apple/Google do the other side of compliance ensuring compatibility while developing new versions of their software across a wide range of reference platforms. I agree, that there are bugs when one side changes and probably requires changes from the other side to continue working, but the reference platform and certifications programs are supposed to minimize this especially for the manufacturers. Car manufacturers are also in general weary about pushing new software OTA updates just because it is added overhead cost in general developing, qualifying, certifying and maintaining these software releases.
Now with the subscription model, the expectation is that BMW constantly invests in R&D for this re-certification and fixes any bugs they discover. There is still no promise from BMW regarding how many years after a car's launch they have plans to support the headunit's software. Yes, you can pre-pay for 20 years for a flat rate of $300 which is a small cost. But my point is, BMW has so far not disclosed any plans to do this R&D for any said timeframe for a given car model. Yes, it will be usable for 20 years, but how many years of planned major software updates? How much difference does it make compared to getting only very minor or no software updates from the manufacturer? Does that justify the cost of the subscription? Another aspect is would BMW really fix the bugs or just try to minimize cost on their side to invest that R&D instead just for newer models?
Do check out the BMW CarPlay outage I shared earlier. Even though you had a valid CarPlay subscription, you couldn't use it because the Head Unit couldn't authenticate with the server to confirm the subscription. These kind of license validation and DRM related problems have been solved reliably by companies with great software engineering expertise to tolerate such outages, and we can see already how far BMW is lagging behind compared to traditional software companies.
I feel the whole subscription model in general is a good seller point since most folks just think in terms of per term (i.e. per month, per year) cost and consider that they always have the flexibility to cancel if they do not need. However what most folks fails to realize is that they add the subscriptions to Auto-pay and really forget how much they are paying among all subscriptions combined. People also rarely cancel subscriptions.
Google/Apple on the other hand have had better history with respect to retaining backwards compatibility and reliability when developing new software versions, and they have the resources to achieve this better than the car manufacturers. So if the car's head unit software does not change, there is a very high chance that the newer versions of AndroidAuto/CarPlay continue to work with the existing head unit.
This was one of the reasons I avoided a BMW when purchasing my 2019 AMG C63S, especially since I work in similar software product area and understand the associated complexities. Having said that, at the same time I am still disappointed that MB just stuck the SD version of Android Auto in our widescreen head units with a hardcoded logo on one side instead of supporting the HD one (i.e. widescreen AA).
My point being, car manufacturers have control over the head unit software and have no intention to become Apple or Google when it comes to delivering OTAs for their devices irrespective of whether you pay a subscription fee or not.