What Is The Real Prevalence Of CDI Intercooler Hose Problems
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2007 GL450
What Is The Real Prevalence Of CDI Intercooler Hose Problems
I know that the guys on this forum who have had intercooler hose problems are really frustrated and upset. I understand that. But I have been doing all sorts of internet searches to try to find out more about this problem and the only "hits" that come up are links to the posts about the problem on this GL forum. There are no posts about intercooler hose problems that I could find on the MBWorld ML forum.
So do we have 5 or 6 unlucky guys on this forum? Is it a big problem throughout the country? I can't figure it out. Are 5 or 6 problems out of 10,000 CDI engines a recall issue ( I made up the 10,000 engine number, I have no idea how many are out there, but I imagine it is a lot)
Everything in life is a Bell Curve. There are outlier issues on both ends. But does the data support that is is a total design flaw or just a few bad manufacturing days in Germany?
Nevada Jack said he cancelled his 320 CDI order because of this hose issue. Does the data support his decision?
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
Does anyone have any real data??
So do we have 5 or 6 unlucky guys on this forum? Is it a big problem throughout the country? I can't figure it out. Are 5 or 6 problems out of 10,000 CDI engines a recall issue ( I made up the 10,000 engine number, I have no idea how many are out there, but I imagine it is a lot)
Everything in life is a Bell Curve. There are outlier issues on both ends. But does the data support that is is a total design flaw or just a few bad manufacturing days in Germany?
Nevada Jack said he cancelled his 320 CDI order because of this hose issue. Does the data support his decision?
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
Does anyone have any real data??
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Joined: Mar 2007
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From: South of the Mason Dixon, North of the Gulf
2007 GL 320 CDI, 2008 M5
I have been doing all sorts of internet searches to try to find out more about this problem and the only "hits" that come up are links to the posts about the problem on this GL forum. There are no posts about intercooler hose problems that I could find on the MBWorld ML forum...
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
But MBUSA is aware of the hose problem in the GL. There are service bulletins out there about how to handle them. One of them instructs the dealer to look at the hose on the first visit and replace it if is of a suspect identification batch.
That said, the problems appear to be related to early builds with the diesel in the GL. I have been under the impression that most of the problems, while irritating, have been fixed. This of course does not include the two guys who each had four hoses blow.
As you say, life is all about the bell shaped curve. You pays your money and you takes your chances. I have had no problems with my GL 320 and I'm glad I bought it.
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From: NC
2019 Volvo XC90 Magic/Amber, '95 E320 Cabriolet Midnight,'14 GL350 Lunar/Almond was '07 GL320CDI
The short answer is "No, I would not cancel my orders." As you say, the hose problem appears to be GL specific, with no reports that I know of in R or ML class diesels.
But MBUSA is aware of the hose problem in the GL. There are service bulletins out there about how to handle them. One of them instructs the dealer to look at the hose on the first visit and replace it if is of a suspect identification batch.
That said, the problems appear to be related to early builds with the diesel in the GL. I have been under the impression that most of the problems, while irritating, have been fixed. This of course does not include the two guys who each had four hoses blow.
As you say, life is all about the bell shaped curve. You pays your money and you takes your chances. I have had no problems with my GL 320 and I'm glad I bought it.
But MBUSA is aware of the hose problem in the GL. There are service bulletins out there about how to handle them. One of them instructs the dealer to look at the hose on the first visit and replace it if is of a suspect identification batch.
That said, the problems appear to be related to early builds with the diesel in the GL. I have been under the impression that most of the problems, while irritating, have been fixed. This of course does not include the two guys who each had four hoses blow.
As you say, life is all about the bell shaped curve. You pays your money and you takes your chances. I have had no problems with my GL 320 and I'm glad I bought it.
I've got 8k miles, have had both hoses blow, and now as the whole time, LOVE MY GL320CDI...
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Joined: Apr 2004
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From: N. Illinois, USA
2021 GLS450, 2015 E250BT 4Matic, 2007 GL320CDI, 2005 SLK350, 2001 SLK320
Don't cancel the orders. There are no known hose problems with the ML. The GL with the Q3 hose has been holding up well. There have been no Q3 hose failures reported on this forum. Most of the failures have been on the Q1 and there have been some Q2 failures.
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From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
I know that the guys on this forum who have had intercooler hose problems are really frustrated and upset. I understand that. But I have been doing all sorts of internet searches to try to find out more about this problem and the only "hits" that come up are links to the posts about the problem on this GL forum. There are no posts about intercooler hose problems that I could find on the MBWorld ML forum.
So do we have 5 or 6 unlucky guys on this forum? Is it a big problem throughout the country? I can't figure it out. Are 5 or 6 problems out of 10,000 CDI engines a recall issue ( I made up the 10,000 engine number, I have no idea how many are out there, but I imagine it is a lot)
Everything in life is a Bell Curve. There are outlier issues on both ends. But does the data support that is is a total design flaw or just a few bad manufacturing days in Germany?
Nevada Jack said he cancelled his 320 CDI order because of this hose issue. Does the data support his decision?
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
Does anyone have any real data??
So do we have 5 or 6 unlucky guys on this forum? Is it a big problem throughout the country? I can't figure it out. Are 5 or 6 problems out of 10,000 CDI engines a recall issue ( I made up the 10,000 engine number, I have no idea how many are out there, but I imagine it is a lot)
Everything in life is a Bell Curve. There are outlier issues on both ends. But does the data support that is is a total design flaw or just a few bad manufacturing days in Germany?
Nevada Jack said he cancelled his 320 CDI order because of this hose issue. Does the data support his decision?
I have two CDI's on order right now, for November build dates, one in a GL and one in a ML. Do I cancel these orders?
Does anyone have any real data??
I would not cancel the orders since I am sure the problem has been reduced to earlier builds. The GL320 CDI is getting great reviews and reports of resale value are excellent. It is a solid buy in my estimation.
As to my decision, supported or not, I had serious concern since AutoSaurus is a friend and I had first hand knowledge of his episodes with the hose problem as they occurred. I could not take delivery on a truck that was at the time a question mark in reliability and had the possibility of being stranded. A complication with my own hoses (blood clot) just before delivery coupled with the CDI hose problem brought me to the conclusion to cancel. Both hose problems appear now to be under control...:-)
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Tell me you'll still love you GL if this happens to you...please.
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2007 GL450
Cancelling My Order Was A Rhetorical Question
I did not really think it was necessary to canel my order. I have been following the problem and the posts to this site prior to placing the orders for my vehicles. I have to say that I trust Mercedes to make a quality product and if a recall was necessary they would do it.
I was just trying to understand the degree of the problem and it seems limited. Mercedes also seems to already understand it and has addressed it.
The posts on this site by the guys who have had the problem are certainly legitimate. No doubt. But the posts are a bit alarmist without the data to back up the degree of the fear.
vdshenoy, I fully understand your frustration. However, I was once stuck on the interstate in the middle of the summer in Alabama from a blown water pump. There are a lot of things that can get your stuck on the side of the road.
Why is the problem specific to the GL. Some earlier posts have indicated that the Q1 problem was due to a clamp that was too weak. A recent post seemed to indicate that the problem in the GL was the space in the engine compartment, perhaps surmizing that the hose was rubbing on some prominence in the engine compartment which causes the hose to get knocked off?
So what is different about a Q3 hose in a GL? Is it a better clamp? Or is it a different shaped hose so it does not rub on the inside of the engine compartment?
Does anybody know exactly what the fix is with a Q3 hose?
Thanks for the good discussion!
I was just trying to understand the degree of the problem and it seems limited. Mercedes also seems to already understand it and has addressed it.
The posts on this site by the guys who have had the problem are certainly legitimate. No doubt. But the posts are a bit alarmist without the data to back up the degree of the fear.
vdshenoy, I fully understand your frustration. However, I was once stuck on the interstate in the middle of the summer in Alabama from a blown water pump. There are a lot of things that can get your stuck on the side of the road.
Why is the problem specific to the GL. Some earlier posts have indicated that the Q1 problem was due to a clamp that was too weak. A recent post seemed to indicate that the problem in the GL was the space in the engine compartment, perhaps surmizing that the hose was rubbing on some prominence in the engine compartment which causes the hose to get knocked off?
So what is different about a Q3 hose in a GL? Is it a better clamp? Or is it a different shaped hose so it does not rub on the inside of the engine compartment?
Does anybody know exactly what the fix is with a Q3 hose?
Thanks for the good discussion!
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Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Scottsdale, AZ
2007 GL320 CDI, 2001 TJ Rockcrawler, 2005 Scoobie STI
My GL came with the Q3 hose from the factory... 4000 miles and no problems at all with the vehicle...
Its really been a great vehicle! and has surpassed both my and my wife's expectations.
Its really been a great vehicle! and has surpassed both my and my wife's expectations.
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From: South of the Mason Dixon, North of the Gulf
2007 GL 320 CDI, 2008 M5
Try living in Houston in the middle of summer, and having your stupid hose blow off, and get stranded on a super narrow shoulder with cars flying by you at 70 mph, with no A/C because your engine wont stay on, no way to get out of the car because of the traffic, and have your dog almost die from dehydration and heat-exhaustion while waiting for your tow to get there. Outside temperature was in excess of 95 degrees, and inside was probably at 100-105 with even the windows open. I had to call HPD after about 30 minutes and had an officer come over there to re-direct traffic while I moved my dog to his car.
Tell me you'll still love you GL if this happens to you...please.
Tell me you'll still love you GL if this happens to you...please.
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From: Scottsdale, AZ
2004 RX330, 2008 Scion xB, 2001 Honda Insight Hybrid, 2010 Toyot Prius v ATP
I think the percentage is statistically significant
When I mentioned the hose issue at Phoenix Motor Co, they said they'd never heard of it and it had never happened to them before. Then suddenly they had information on it from MBUSA, etc. etc. When I mentioned it to the Service Advisor at Schumacher European, he said I was the third he'd heard of. I think the fact that one service advisor is aware not only of three hose pops but of one person having both the front and back pop suggests that while it's not a model-wide problem, it is statistically significant. I'm over 10k miles (man, I drive a lot!) on a Q2 hose with an extensive and very specific installation method, but I believe I had a Q1 hose originally and it did pop off, once on my wife and then immediately after being replaced on to the truck.
What is really weird to me is that my wife was able to drive through the mountains out of Albuquerque (slowly) after the hose let go, whereas vdshenoy couldn't even keep his engine running. I wonder what the significance of the difference is? VD, did you lose the back hose or the front one? It's weird.
What is really weird to me is that my wife was able to drive through the mountains out of Albuquerque (slowly) after the hose let go, whereas vdshenoy couldn't even keep his engine running. I wonder what the significance of the difference is? VD, did you lose the back hose or the front one? It's weird.
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2007 GL450
Steve, Do You Feel OK About It Now?
Steve,
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
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From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
Steve,
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
As far as how widespread it is, any vehicle built up to March (or when the problem first showed up) is subject to the failure. How many actually had the failure or could still have the failure is only known by MB. This problem was never picked up by the press as far as I know but MB did issue a Tech paper on it.
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From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
Steve,
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
Thanks for the information. How do feel now, after the proper fix? Do you trust the fix?
Did your service guys actually tell you what the issue is? Is it a poorly designed clamp; not strong enough? Or is it the contours (shape) of the hose, so that the new one does not rub somewhere in the engine compartment? What is different about a Q3 hose?
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
Gordon
Apr 9, 2007
T-B-09.41/28
MY2007 Model 164.822 (GL320 CDI)
Check Engine Light Illuminated / Code 2359-001 or 2355-002
Check/replace charge air cooler hose, if Q1 replace with Q2, part number 164 528 11 82
UPDATE: Owner reports GL320 CDI produced on May 16 comes with Q3 installed.
UPDATE2: Problem may be solved, June 20, 2007
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2007 GL450
Thanks Jack
NJ,
I found the hose pictures you referred to, thanks. I must have missed those before as I was searching for answers to this problem.
Thanks for both of your posts.
It seems like the problem is solved and should not be an issue on a MY 2008 GL320 to be built in November 2007.
Thanks again.
Gordon
I found the hose pictures you referred to, thanks. I must have missed those before as I was searching for answers to this problem.
Thanks for both of your posts.
It seems like the problem is solved and should not be an issue on a MY 2008 GL320 to be built in November 2007.
Thanks again.
Gordon
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From: Scottsdale, AZ
2004 RX330, 2008 Scion xB, 2001 Honda Insight Hybrid, 2010 Toyot Prius v ATP
I will gently take issue with you calling it "statistically significant", because that terminology implies that we have analyzed real numbers and know real failures rates. We do not. Maybe Mercedes Benz Corporate does? I am still trying to understand what is causing the failure.
) but I don't know how we could analyze real numbers without MB's help.I feel fine about the fix at this point, though again it's without any real reason. The implication (and nothing more) from Phoenix Motor was the installation originally allowed for oil of some kind to get between the hose and its attach point on either the turbo or the engine. In reality, they told me nothing other than that it was a redesigned hose I was getting, which made me think I may have originally had a Q1 hose. I know from direct observation that I've got a Q2 now. I'd feel best knowing I had a Q3 hose.
STP
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From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
NJ,
I found the hose pictures you referred to, thanks. I must have missed those before as I was searching for answers to this problem.
Thanks for both of your posts.
It seems like the problem is solved and should not be an issue on a MY 2008 GL320 to be built in November 2007.
Thanks again.
Gordon
I found the hose pictures you referred to, thanks. I must have missed those before as I was searching for answers to this problem.
Thanks for both of your posts.
It seems like the problem is solved and should not be an issue on a MY 2008 GL320 to be built in November 2007.
Thanks again.
Gordon
A lot of exchange takes place on this forum which is not only informative, but much of the time is comical and just plain funny (and I mean that in a positive sense.) I don't know how the rest of the MB owners who do not know about this forum survive...:-)
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 857
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From: NC
2019 Volvo XC90 Magic/Amber, '95 E320 Cabriolet Midnight,'14 GL350 Lunar/Almond was '07 GL320CDI
Try living in Houston in the middle of summer, and having your stupid hose blow off, and get stranded on a super narrow shoulder with cars flying by you at 70 mph, with no A/C because your engine wont stay on, no way to get out of the car because of the traffic, and have your dog almost die from dehydration and heat-exhaustion while waiting for your tow to get there. Outside temperature was in excess of 95 degrees, and inside was probably at 100-105 with even the windows open. I had to call HPD after about 30 minutes and had an officer come over there to re-direct traffic while I moved my dog to his car.
Tell me you'll still love you GL if this happens to you...please.
Tell me you'll still love you GL if this happens to you...please.
I do hope your dog is ok and i meant nothing personal-
i still maintain you don't have a piece of crap-and i predict you will end up loving your GL!
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2007 GL450
Every Q1 At Risk?
StevethePilot,
Thanks for your post. I am gald you feel good about your GL now. I am looking forward to getting my desiel. I feel confident that I should not have any issues regarding the hoses.
Do you think every Q1 hose out there is at risk for failure? And, eventually they will all fail and therefore all get slowly replaced?
Or, do you think it was just a bad set of engines built on a certain day or week on the production line?
Boy, I would love to know the real story and real numbers straight from MB!
Gordon
Thanks for your post. I am gald you feel good about your GL now. I am looking forward to getting my desiel. I feel confident that I should not have any issues regarding the hoses.
Do you think every Q1 hose out there is at risk for failure? And, eventually they will all fail and therefore all get slowly replaced?
Or, do you think it was just a bad set of engines built on a certain day or week on the production line?
Boy, I would love to know the real story and real numbers straight from MB!
Gordon
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Posts: 5,517
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From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
StevethePilot,
Thanks for your post. I am gald you feel good about your GL now. I am looking forward to getting my desiel. I feel confident that I should not have any issues regarding the hoses.
Do you think every Q1 hose out there is at risk for failure? And, eventually they will all fail and therefore all get slowly replaced?
Or, do you think it was just a bad set of engines built on a certain day or week on the production line?
Boy, I would love to know the real story and real numbers straight from MB!
Gordon
Thanks for your post. I am gald you feel good about your GL now. I am looking forward to getting my desiel. I feel confident that I should not have any issues regarding the hoses.
Do you think every Q1 hose out there is at risk for failure? And, eventually they will all fail and therefore all get slowly replaced?
Or, do you think it was just a bad set of engines built on a certain day or week on the production line?
Boy, I would love to know the real story and real numbers straight from MB!
Gordon
I guess you could find out the lowest VIN number for US production of the GL CDI in Vance and then determine when the change took place and use the first Q3 hose engine VIN as the fix date. I guess all engines prior to the install of the Q3 hose could be susceptible to a failure but that is probably not likely to occur. If the number of failures were really significant then there would have been a recall requiring all owners with a certain VIN to have their dealers install the Q3 hose.
The "real story" is they screwed up in Germany when they designed the intercooler hose for the UD GL320CDI.
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From: Scottsdale, AZ
2004 RX330, 2008 Scion xB, 2001 Honda Insight Hybrid, 2010 Toyot Prius v ATP
MBWorld Fanatic!
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Posts: 5,517
Likes: 20
From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,517
Likes: 20
From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: LA LA Land
'07 GL 450, '02 S 80 T6
Originally Posted by Nevada Jack
Yeah Steve...someone must have messed up my keyboard...:-)
