Nitrogen for tires
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,517
Likes: 20
From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
Nitrogen for tires
Has anyone found any advantage to using Nitrogen instead of air in their tires? The local dealer Fletcher Jones has a special on for 50% off to inflate them with Nitrogen (normally $69.95.) Also, how much longer and how well is the pressure maintained with Nitrogen?
Any input?
Any input?
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 405
Likes: 1
From: Scottsdale, AZ
2007 GL320 CDI, 2001 TJ Rockcrawler, 2005 Scoobie STI
Has anyone found any advantage to using Nitrogen instead of air in their tires? The local dealer Fletcher Jones has a special on for 50% off to inflate them with Nitrogen (normally $69.95.) Also, how much longer and how well is the pressure maintained with Nitrogen?
Any input?
Any input?
Here is a site that is worth reviewing that gives you the facts about Air vs. Nitrogen vs. CO2 for inflating tires...
It invites you to examine the facts and decide for yourself.
http://www.powertank.com/truth.or.hype/
Having done so, my conclusion is that putting Nitrogen in your tires for any cost but free is a complete waste of money... However, you too can decide for yourself.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,046
Likes: 1
From: Colorado Rocky Mtns.
'06 A6 & '08 GL550
Jack,
Here is a site that is worth reviewing that gives you the facts about Air vs. Nitrogen vs. CO2 for inflating tires...
It invites you to examine the facts and decide for yourself.
http://www.powertank.com/truth.or.hype/
Having done so, my conclusion is that putting Nitrogen in your tires for any cost but free is a complete waste of money... However, you too can decide for yourself.
Here is a site that is worth reviewing that gives you the facts about Air vs. Nitrogen vs. CO2 for inflating tires...
It invites you to examine the facts and decide for yourself.
http://www.powertank.com/truth.or.hype/
Having done so, my conclusion is that putting Nitrogen in your tires for any cost but free is a complete waste of money... However, you too can decide for yourself.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 5,517
Likes: 20
From: Las Vegas, NV
2011 E350 Cabriolet..White and Almond Mocha
I hear you...
Well with three responses from such owners above, I will keep my air (or make that my tires air) just what it is now. Thanks guys...
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Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 435
Likes: 0
From: FRESNO CA
GL550
Has anyone found any advantage to using Nitrogen instead of air in their tires? The local dealer Fletcher Jones has a special on for 50% off to inflate them with Nitrogen (normally $69.95.) Also, how much longer and how well is the pressure maintained with Nitrogen?
Any input?
Any input?
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Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 183
Likes: 2
From: Louisville, KY
08 GL450 / 08 S550 4matic
i had it done for free at my dealer -- and i can tell a huge difference -- maybe 50-60 more horsepower -- no just kidding -- no difference at all --in fact it seems to fluctuate just like regular air accordinng to my tpms monitor. good thing i got it for free.......
the machine and the process by which it is put in is kinda cool though. and they give you these cool tire caps that say nitro on them:P makes it feel faster
the machine and the process by which it is put in is kinda cool though. and they give you these cool tire caps that say nitro on them:P makes it feel faster
Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 214
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From: FL 33325
2002 CLK 430
Junior Member
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 46
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G35 and Nissan Armada
I had it on my Nissan Armada for 3 years. Is there a difference? I wsould say yes/no. now i have it on my GL450 too. The advantage is there is no variation in air pressure. I haven't checked air for years. when i had air in my tyres, i used to check at lest 8-10 times in winter. I think there is small difference in ride, and dealer told me that it add more "life" into the tyres. Don't ask me how. Since 2005 I have done it in my all cars and trucks, and its free from MB dealer
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: SE PA
R350 / E320
For road cars, there is no advantage to using nitrogen. Once your hot pressures are set to your satisfaction, just check them periodically – hot meaning after you’ve driven for five to ten minutes or so.
I have skipped reading the article above, but I can tell you with confidence that the use of nitrogen in tires has its roots in motorsports where there is a small window of pressure and temperature to get optimal performance.
We're talking tire pressure fluctuations of less than 1 PSI that will make a significant difference in performance (in racing). Since most race tires only begin to work typically in the 180 degree F range (while some are ideally suited to as high as 210 or so), the temp has a big effect on the pressure.
BTW, for normal public road driving – these temps are never even close to being reached. Furthermore, in a road car 1 PSI won’t be noticeable.
In racing, we use nitrogen simply to make this pressure consistently predictable as it relates to the anticipated operating temperature. This high operating temp causes the air inside the tire to expand and therefore the pressure increases. With nitrogen, it grows predictably. The car’s handling is also effected by the tire pressure, but this effect varies with the car’s set-up, the nature of the track and the tire’s construction.
On the other hand, if you use the ambient air from the local compressor, the air in the tires will vary by things like how the ambient air varies in its density, its humidity level, by how much moisture has been built up into the compressed air system itself, when the last time the compressor tank was drained, and so forth.
This makes the pressure growth impossible to predict.
BTW, if you set your pressures on a hot day in FL, and then drive to New England where is very cold, you might want to re-adjust your pressures upward. The reverse holds true as well. Even if one side of your car has been sitting in sunlight, while the other side has been in shade, the pressures will vary. But how often to you actually feel THAT?
I'll also add that perhaps the lower the profile the tire is, the more pressure sensitive it could be. One reason is that there is not as much volume inside the tire...but we don't need to go there for the general nitrogen argument.
This is one of those cases that just because it is done in motorsports doesn't mean it applies to the public.
I have skipped reading the article above, but I can tell you with confidence that the use of nitrogen in tires has its roots in motorsports where there is a small window of pressure and temperature to get optimal performance.
We're talking tire pressure fluctuations of less than 1 PSI that will make a significant difference in performance (in racing). Since most race tires only begin to work typically in the 180 degree F range (while some are ideally suited to as high as 210 or so), the temp has a big effect on the pressure.
BTW, for normal public road driving – these temps are never even close to being reached. Furthermore, in a road car 1 PSI won’t be noticeable.
In racing, we use nitrogen simply to make this pressure consistently predictable as it relates to the anticipated operating temperature. This high operating temp causes the air inside the tire to expand and therefore the pressure increases. With nitrogen, it grows predictably. The car’s handling is also effected by the tire pressure, but this effect varies with the car’s set-up, the nature of the track and the tire’s construction.
On the other hand, if you use the ambient air from the local compressor, the air in the tires will vary by things like how the ambient air varies in its density, its humidity level, by how much moisture has been built up into the compressed air system itself, when the last time the compressor tank was drained, and so forth.
This makes the pressure growth impossible to predict.
BTW, if you set your pressures on a hot day in FL, and then drive to New England where is very cold, you might want to re-adjust your pressures upward. The reverse holds true as well. Even if one side of your car has been sitting in sunlight, while the other side has been in shade, the pressures will vary. But how often to you actually feel THAT?
I'll also add that perhaps the lower the profile the tire is, the more pressure sensitive it could be. One reason is that there is not as much volume inside the tire...but we don't need to go there for the general nitrogen argument.
This is one of those cases that just because it is done in motorsports doesn't mean it applies to the public.
Last edited by Flying CLR; Nov 20, 2008 at 09:33 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2007
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From: San Jose, CA
2007 E63 w/P30 and Eurotech CF Diffuser
Nitrogen or Air makes no difference for pressure control... BUT, the moisture content one usually gets with compressed air is the killer for tight pressure control required in motorsports.
Since dry air or nitrogen both cost about the same, nitrogen it is. Big ole 6000PSI bottle lasts a long time.
Since dry air or nitrogen both cost about the same, nitrogen it is. Big ole 6000PSI bottle lasts a long time.
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: SE PA
R350 / E320
Exactly right Jon.
Even very "wet" air won't make much of a difference on the public road...unless you can actually hear the water in your tire of course. (Another motorsports trick to make weight at the end of a race after faking a puncture)
For you - of more concern might be the tire spinning on the rim
, particularly the rears. Usually at 30psi and up it's not an issue, but it is still good practice to mark where your valve stem is on your tire. If the tire slips, your mark on the tire will no longer be right at the stem. This will quickly explain the resultant vibration. This is more likely to happen when they're brand new and the tire mounting solution is still fresh.
BTW, this mounting solution is a big source of the moisture inside the tire...further negating any benefit from nitrogen.
Even very "wet" air won't make much of a difference on the public road...unless you can actually hear the water in your tire of course. (Another motorsports trick to make weight at the end of a race after faking a puncture)
For you - of more concern might be the tire spinning on the rim
, particularly the rears. Usually at 30psi and up it's not an issue, but it is still good practice to mark where your valve stem is on your tire. If the tire slips, your mark on the tire will no longer be right at the stem. This will quickly explain the resultant vibration. This is more likely to happen when they're brand new and the tire mounting solution is still fresh. BTW, this mounting solution is a big source of the moisture inside the tire...further negating any benefit from nitrogen.
Last edited by Flying CLR; Nov 24, 2008 at 09:05 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,513
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C32 AMG
I'm not sure how these services purge your old air (and moisture). In a perfect world, the wheels and tires are sent into outer space to be mounted by an astronaut/mechanic, ensuring a dry vacuum. Then they can return to earth for filing with pure, dry nitrogen. ;-)
PS: I do some recreation track days, and once you establish your tires' "hot" pressures, you really do not care how they get there. I usually gain 10 to 12 pounds of pressure from cold to hot; but I just pick a target pressure and back into the cold pressure.
PS: I do some recreation track days, and once you establish your tires' "hot" pressures, you really do not care how they get there. I usually gain 10 to 12 pounds of pressure from cold to hot; but I just pick a target pressure and back into the cold pressure.
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: SE PA
R350 / E320
That's the idea. It's just sometimes difficult for the pressure to stabilize on the track if there's a lot of moisture in it.
By purging they usually mean the remove the valve core to drain the tire of the air used to bead it when it is mounted.
By purging they usually mean the remove the valve core to drain the tire of the air used to bead it when it is mounted.
