GL350 vs Navigator
10-27-2013, 06:31 AM
#1
Newbie
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Volvo XC70
GL350 vs Navigator
Has anyone here owned both a GL and a Lincoln Navigator? Just wondering how you'd compare these two beasts. I'm expecting to do 30,000 miles per year over the next few years of mostly highway driving going to and from various sporting practices and events -- probably 600 miles per week on average. To me the GL350 has the clear advantage in terms of fuel costs, but I'm worried that the maintenance costs of the GL will be much higher than the Nav. If anyone has any insight, I'd appreciate it. Also any general feelings on GL vs Navigator would be appreciated.
10-27-2013, 11:32 AM
#2
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
6 Posts
2005 ML350, 2008 GL320, 2013 Gl350
Navigator= Garbage, same goes with the current and upcoming Escalade, the GL is light years ahead in all aspects, from comfort to fuel economy to reliability.
10-27-2013, 07:37 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: City of Angels, CA
Posts: 270
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
C55 / S550 / Lexus IS300 (sold) / C63 (Sold) / SL500 (Sold) / Lambo Gallardo (RIP)
True. We had a navigator was a piece of crap u could tell it was a ford. Rattled on bumps and cheap material inside. We just sent it to Mexico since they love em over there. Gave it to our friends. I had an Escalade EXT and was a good car but still felt chea. Rattled and I could never understand why anyone (including me) would pay for a Chevy or ford with different body panels (unless it was used). The GL feels solid. Doors don't rattle when u close em. Doesn't shake or rattle on bumps. I will never get any ford product and wouldn't bother with another Cadillac if I can pay a bit more and get the Benz. Benz has really cleaned up their act after leaving Chrysler. Very dependable cars. I have had many many many Mercedes 07 and up and not one problem with any of them as long as you maintain them. And ya maintenance will be more but you will have a better all around quality and ride. Oil changes last longer. Gas will pay for itself. Almost everything standard. Better leather quality. I mean, apples to oranges. But most of all ask yourself when walking out the door if the car you buy will put a smile on your face every time u get in it. Whatever can you picture giving u that is the car for u.
10-28-2013, 11:53 AM
#4
Common sense time
Has anyone here owned both a GL and a Lincoln Navigator? Just wondering how you'd compare these two beasts. I'm expecting to do 30,000 miles per year over the next few years of mostly highway driving going to and from various sporting practices and events -- probably 600 miles per week on average. To me the GL350 has the clear advantage in terms of fuel costs, but I'm worried that the maintenance costs of the GL will be much higher than the Nav. If anyone has any insight, I'd appreciate it. Also any general feelings on GL vs Navigator would be appreciated.
Let's see:
Every 10,000 mile you get to spend at least $100 for an oil change (IF you do it yourself). Costs in parts: $9.00/quart * 9 quarts for oil + $10 oil filter element.
At 20,000 miles you not only get to change the oil, but you also have to change the fuel filter. Oh, you didn't know that MB changed the filter design to a non-removeable water sensor mid 2012? Neither do most dealers. Who cares right? You should. The fuel filter is now $135.00 as opposed to the older fuel filter that re-used the sensor and only costs around $50.00 at any parts store (you can NOT find the new fuel filter anywhere but at MB). Oh, you also should be flushing your brake fluid at this interval too (funny how I have NEVER done that with other cars, but hey MB is "special).
So at 20,000 miles you "only" spent 2 oil changes + a fuel filter + brake flush which is ONLY $317.00.
Oh wait....you do know at 40,000 miles you need to have the transmission fluid and filter changed right? That's $300-$400 depending on who does it and IF they actually drain the torque converter as well (most shops are too ignorant to know that your GL DOES have a drain in the TQ that can and should be drained...hence you may see low ball quotes but I can assure you it's due to not changing all the fluid).
Air filters? Kill me now, worst design I have ever seen working on cars and a nightmare in hell to remove/replace.
What's that? You don't work on cars? TRIPLE the costs I just quoted. Not to mention I forgot to mention DEF fluid (aka MB's cute "ADBlue" fluid) which is $12.00 for 2.5 gallons (you need about 7 gallons) that needs refilling every 10,000 miles<---Or having fun getting raped at the dealer for over $250.00 if they do the same thing.
Tires? Ahhhh....it's no big deal right? It's not like they placed the DEF tank where the spare would have went so now you are left with the choice of "Do I spend $500+ a tire to replace runflats every 30,000 miles OR do I roll the dice and replace with non-run flats for $250 a piece and have no spare tire in the event of a flat".
GREAT CAR! Everyone should get one......or not.
Couple more data points: Enjoy the leaking oil coolers (they still have the issue), crap control arms (ever had to replace all control arm bushings at 50,000 miles? I did), slow windows, ignition issues (there is a recall on the ignition switch that I had done twice due to the car not starting at all), crap electronics (we use our cell phones instead of the outdated GPS), and the worst dealer diagnosis methods I have ever witnessed (it's not the dealer, it's MB's "expert" methods in general that are brain melting.
Last edited by jasonjeross; 10-28-2013 at 11:58 AM. Reason: More food for thought
10-28-2013, 11:59 AM
#5
True. We had a navigator was a piece of crap u could tell it was a ford. Rattled on bumps and cheap material inside. We just sent it to Mexico since they love em over there. Gave it to our friends. I had an Escalade EXT and was a good car but still felt chea. Rattled and I could never understand why anyone (including me) would pay for a Chevy or ford with different body panels (unless it was used). The GL feels solid. Doors don't rattle when u close em. Doesn't shake or rattle on bumps. I will never get any ford product and wouldn't bother with another Cadillac if I can pay a bit more and get the Benz. Benz has really cleaned up their act after leaving Chrysler. Very dependable cars. I have had many many many Mercedes 07 and up and not one problem with any of them as long as you maintain them. And ya maintenance will be more but you will have a better all around quality and ride. Oil changes last longer. Gas will pay for itself. Almost everything standard. Better leather quality. I mean, apples to oranges. But most of all ask yourself when walking out the door if the car you buy will put a smile on your face every time u get in it. Whatever can you picture giving u that is the car for u.
10-28-2013, 12:31 PM
#6
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,425
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
2015 Ram 2500, former 2013 GL350, 2007 GL450
Good luck with the diagnosis on that, ALX is a smart cookie, I'd bet with him on a fuel issue.
Last edited by JimBarnhart; 10-28-2013 at 12:58 PM.
10-28-2013, 12:32 PM
#7
Super Member
GL350 will eat you up in maintenance costs and reliability.
Let's see:
Every 10,000 mile you get to spend at least $100 for an oil change (IF you do it yourself). Costs in parts: $9.00/quart * 9 quarts for oil + $10 oil filter element.
At 20,000 miles you not only get to change the oil, but you also have to change the fuel filter. Oh, you didn't know that MB changed the filter design to a non-removeable water sensor mid 2012? Neither do most dealers. Who cares right? You should. The fuel filter is now $135.00 as opposed to the older fuel filter that re-used the sensor and only costs around $50.00 at any parts store (you can NOT find the new fuel filter anywhere but at MB). Oh, you also should be flushing your brake fluid at this interval too (funny how I have NEVER done that with other cars, but hey MB is "special).
So at 20,000 miles you "only" spent 2 oil changes + a fuel filter + brake flush which is ONLY $317.00.
Oh wait....you do know at 40,000 miles you need to have the transmission fluid and filter changed right? That's $300-$400 depending on who does it and IF they actually drain the torque converter as well (most shops are too ignorant to know that your GL DOES have a drain in the TQ that can and should be drained...hence you may see low ball quotes but I can assure you it's due to not changing all the fluid).
Air filters? Kill me now, worst design I have ever seen working on cars and a nightmare in hell to remove/replace.
What's that? You don't work on cars? TRIPLE the costs I just quoted. Not to mention I forgot to mention DEF fluid (aka MB's cute "ADBlue" fluid) which is $12.00 for 2.5 gallons (you need about 7 gallons) that needs refilling every 10,000 miles<---Or having fun getting raped at the dealer for over $250.00 if they do the same thing.
Tires? Ahhhh....it's no big deal right? It's not like they placed the DEF tank where the spare would have went so now you are left with the choice of "Do I spend $500+ a tire to replace runflats every 30,000 miles OR do I roll the dice and replace with non-run flats for $250 a piece and have no spare tire in the event of a flat".
GREAT CAR! Everyone should get one......or not.
Couple more data points: Enjoy the leaking oil coolers (they still have the issue), crap control arms (ever had to replace all control arm bushings at 50,000 miles? I did), slow windows, ignition issues (there is a recall on the ignition switch that I had done twice due to the car not starting at all), crap electronics (we use our cell phones instead of the outdated GPS), and the worst dealer diagnosis methods I have ever witnessed (it's not the dealer, it's MB's "expert" methods in general that are brain melting.
Let's see:
Every 10,000 mile you get to spend at least $100 for an oil change (IF you do it yourself). Costs in parts: $9.00/quart * 9 quarts for oil + $10 oil filter element.
At 20,000 miles you not only get to change the oil, but you also have to change the fuel filter. Oh, you didn't know that MB changed the filter design to a non-removeable water sensor mid 2012? Neither do most dealers. Who cares right? You should. The fuel filter is now $135.00 as opposed to the older fuel filter that re-used the sensor and only costs around $50.00 at any parts store (you can NOT find the new fuel filter anywhere but at MB). Oh, you also should be flushing your brake fluid at this interval too (funny how I have NEVER done that with other cars, but hey MB is "special).
So at 20,000 miles you "only" spent 2 oil changes + a fuel filter + brake flush which is ONLY $317.00.
Oh wait....you do know at 40,000 miles you need to have the transmission fluid and filter changed right? That's $300-$400 depending on who does it and IF they actually drain the torque converter as well (most shops are too ignorant to know that your GL DOES have a drain in the TQ that can and should be drained...hence you may see low ball quotes but I can assure you it's due to not changing all the fluid).
Air filters? Kill me now, worst design I have ever seen working on cars and a nightmare in hell to remove/replace.
What's that? You don't work on cars? TRIPLE the costs I just quoted. Not to mention I forgot to mention DEF fluid (aka MB's cute "ADBlue" fluid) which is $12.00 for 2.5 gallons (you need about 7 gallons) that needs refilling every 10,000 miles<---Or having fun getting raped at the dealer for over $250.00 if they do the same thing.
Tires? Ahhhh....it's no big deal right? It's not like they placed the DEF tank where the spare would have went so now you are left with the choice of "Do I spend $500+ a tire to replace runflats every 30,000 miles OR do I roll the dice and replace with non-run flats for $250 a piece and have no spare tire in the event of a flat".
GREAT CAR! Everyone should get one......or not.
Couple more data points: Enjoy the leaking oil coolers (they still have the issue), crap control arms (ever had to replace all control arm bushings at 50,000 miles? I did), slow windows, ignition issues (there is a recall on the ignition switch that I had done twice due to the car not starting at all), crap electronics (we use our cell phones instead of the outdated GPS), and the worst dealer diagnosis methods I have ever witnessed (it's not the dealer, it's MB's "expert" methods in general that are brain melting.
I agree with you though maintenance does cost a lot but hopefully you can find a fair dealer. I just paid $180 for the 30k service on my E BTC and feel that's fair because as you mentioned the oil change its self would cost $120 plus they rotate the tires and the other easy stuff. I do the DEF myself, but have also had the dealer throw it in before for me on another vehicle.
The 2yr/20k brake fluid flush also seems excessive to me, though I have bought into doing it...
Definitely maintenance is something to consider but I still wouldn't go for the Navi or Escalade even if maintenance was free, but that is just my opinion.
Trending Topics
10-28-2013, 01:55 PM
#8
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,313
Likes: 0
Received 7 Likes
on
6 Posts
2005 ML350, 2008 GL320, 2013 Gl350
GL350 will eat you up in maintenance costs and reliability.
Let's see:
Every 10,000 mile you get to spend at least $100 for an oil change (IF you do it yourself). Costs in parts: $9.00/quart * 9 quarts for oil + $10 oil filter element.
At 20,000 miles you not only get to change the oil, but you also have to change the fuel filter. Oh, you didn't know that MB changed the filter design to a non-removeable water sensor mid 2012? Neither do most dealers. Who cares right? You should. The fuel filter is now $135.00 as opposed to the older fuel filter that re-used the sensor and only costs around $50.00 at any parts store (you can NOT find the new fuel filter anywhere but at MB). Oh, you also should be flushing your brake fluid at this interval too (funny how I have NEVER done that with other cars, but hey MB is "special).
So at 20,000 miles you "only" spent 2 oil changes + a fuel filter + brake flush which is ONLY $317.00.
Oh wait....you do know at 40,000 miles you need to have the transmission fluid and filter changed right? That's $300-$400 depending on who does it and IF they actually drain the torque converter as well (most shops are too ignorant to know that your GL DOES have a drain in the TQ that can and should be drained...hence you may see low ball quotes but I can assure you it's due to not changing all the fluid).
Air filters? Kill me now, worst design I have ever seen working on cars and a nightmare in hell to remove/replace.
What's that? You don't work on cars? TRIPLE the costs I just quoted. Not to mention I forgot to mention DEF fluid (aka MB's cute "ADBlue" fluid) which is $12.00 for 2.5 gallons (you need about 7 gallons) that needs refilling every 10,000 miles<---Or having fun getting raped at the dealer for over $250.00 if they do the same thing.
Tires? Ahhhh....it's no big deal right? It's not like they placed the DEF tank where the spare would have went so now you are left with the choice of "Do I spend $500+ a tire to replace runflats every 30,000 miles OR do I roll the dice and replace with non-run flats for $250 a piece and have no spare tire in the event of a flat".
GREAT CAR! Everyone should get one......or not.
Couple more data points: Enjoy the leaking oil coolers (they still have the issue), crap control arms (ever had to replace all control arm bushings at 50,000 miles? I did), slow windows, ignition issues (there is a recall on the ignition switch that I had done twice due to the car not starting at all), crap electronics (we use our cell phones instead of the outdated GPS), and the worst dealer diagnosis methods I have ever witnessed (it's not the dealer, it's MB's "expert" methods in general that are brain melting.
Let's see:
Every 10,000 mile you get to spend at least $100 for an oil change (IF you do it yourself). Costs in parts: $9.00/quart * 9 quarts for oil + $10 oil filter element.
At 20,000 miles you not only get to change the oil, but you also have to change the fuel filter. Oh, you didn't know that MB changed the filter design to a non-removeable water sensor mid 2012? Neither do most dealers. Who cares right? You should. The fuel filter is now $135.00 as opposed to the older fuel filter that re-used the sensor and only costs around $50.00 at any parts store (you can NOT find the new fuel filter anywhere but at MB). Oh, you also should be flushing your brake fluid at this interval too (funny how I have NEVER done that with other cars, but hey MB is "special).
So at 20,000 miles you "only" spent 2 oil changes + a fuel filter + brake flush which is ONLY $317.00.
Oh wait....you do know at 40,000 miles you need to have the transmission fluid and filter changed right? That's $300-$400 depending on who does it and IF they actually drain the torque converter as well (most shops are too ignorant to know that your GL DOES have a drain in the TQ that can and should be drained...hence you may see low ball quotes but I can assure you it's due to not changing all the fluid).
Air filters? Kill me now, worst design I have ever seen working on cars and a nightmare in hell to remove/replace.
What's that? You don't work on cars? TRIPLE the costs I just quoted. Not to mention I forgot to mention DEF fluid (aka MB's cute "ADBlue" fluid) which is $12.00 for 2.5 gallons (you need about 7 gallons) that needs refilling every 10,000 miles<---Or having fun getting raped at the dealer for over $250.00 if they do the same thing.
Tires? Ahhhh....it's no big deal right? It's not like they placed the DEF tank where the spare would have went so now you are left with the choice of "Do I spend $500+ a tire to replace runflats every 30,000 miles OR do I roll the dice and replace with non-run flats for $250 a piece and have no spare tire in the event of a flat".
GREAT CAR! Everyone should get one......or not.
Couple more data points: Enjoy the leaking oil coolers (they still have the issue), crap control arms (ever had to replace all control arm bushings at 50,000 miles? I did), slow windows, ignition issues (there is a recall on the ignition switch that I had done twice due to the car not starting at all), crap electronics (we use our cell phones instead of the outdated GPS), and the worst dealer diagnosis methods I have ever witnessed (it's not the dealer, it's MB's "expert" methods in general that are brain melting.
10-28-2013, 02:06 PM
#9
I thought the new fuel filter was 40k instead of 20k? Transmission fluid is now 70k vs. 40k? And new GL350s do have a spare tire.
I agree with you though maintenance does cost a lot but hopefully you can find a fair dealer. I just paid $180 for the 30k service on my E BTC and feel that's fair because as you mentioned the oil change its self would cost $120 plus they rotate the tires and the other easy stuff. I do the DEF myself, but have also had the dealer throw it in before for me on another vehicle.
The 2yr/20k brake fluid flush also seems excessive to me, though I have bought into doing it...
Definitely maintenance is something to consider but I still wouldn't go for the Navi or Escalade even if maintenance was free, but that is just my opinion.
I agree with you though maintenance does cost a lot but hopefully you can find a fair dealer. I just paid $180 for the 30k service on my E BTC and feel that's fair because as you mentioned the oil change its self would cost $120 plus they rotate the tires and the other easy stuff. I do the DEF myself, but have also had the dealer throw it in before for me on another vehicle.
The 2yr/20k brake fluid flush also seems excessive to me, though I have bought into doing it...
Definitely maintenance is something to consider but I still wouldn't go for the Navi or Escalade even if maintenance was free, but that is just my opinion.
I put this in the wrong section...my comments were directed at the previous generation. I will say the revisions on the transmission fluid and fuel filter are generous at best. The filters are likely identical fuel wise. As for the transmission, I know tons of people with trashed transmissions in these cars and that was with changes at 40,000.
At any rate, these trucks are a bit of a marketing gimmick. I hope the current generation is a bit better as I can say for a fact the previous were boat anchors.
10-28-2013, 02:07 PM
#10
Wow, doesn't look like you are very happy with your GL350. I just read your post on your X164 GL350. Sounds like you have a dealer pulling your chain. Sorry I couldn't resist the pun.
Good luck with the diagnosis on that, ALX is a smart cookie, I'd bet with him on a fuel issue.
Good luck with the diagnosis on that, ALX is a smart cookie, I'd bet with him on a fuel issue.
It ended poorly with the dealer. I'll post more about it later.
