KCMOjuju

Hi. My names Catherine and I’m new here. But I feel like a veteran after spending my entire evening reading these threads lol…. I’ll tell you guys my horror story and I’m hoping to get some good advice and or hear stories from others who can relate.

In Spring of 2021 I bought a GL550 from a guy (well, sort of, but I’ll get to that part in a minute) in Texas. I bought the car at 60,000 miles “with no known problems”. As of today, Spring of 2022, the car has 70,000 miles on it and Mercedes Benz has told me that I have scoring inside the fifth cylinder and the car requires a new engine, priced at $26,000 not including taxes and fees.

WTF?

That’s basically my situation. I have called Mercedes’ headquarters in Atlanta and was told very politely that there was not jack **** they are going to do, or ever going to do, to help me.

So back up. This is the part that REALLY bothers me. This guy (THIS GUY) who I bought the car from. He had it listed online as a private party sale. He’s in Texas, I’m in Missouri. We talked back and forth and I drove down to Dallas to buy the car. As I left Missouri to go to Texas to meet him, he told me he was going to meet me at X dealership in Dallas and we’d do the transaction there, because there was a technicality/loophole in TX property tax rules whereby he would save a significant amount of money on tax for the car if he sold it to a dealership who would in turn sell the car to me. Fine, I didn’t care. That being said, it ended up being a very long day, very annoying at the dealership, slightly annoying they charged me a fee for the paperwork (and the other guy wasn’t willing to pay for it &#128580. The guy selling the car was there all day, we both did all our paperwork, etc. Fine. Whatever. We did the deal, I left with ownership of the car. Done.

NOW. Since then. Almost immediately, I had to replace the front left air suspension for about $3500. Fine. I did it. Shortly thereafter I had to replace the front right air suspension, another $3500. I also had to replace the compressor, that was about $1000. Fine fine fine. From my reading online, it seemed pretty normal to have to replace the air suspension by 70K. I figured the seller was just a savvy guy……


Now. About six months ago I started hearing knocking, the car would slip upon shifting gears, and then eventually smoke came out the tailpipe (good Lord). I just stopped using the car during this time, kept it in my garage, and drove another. My friend, a mechanic, changed the spark plugs, oil separator, and some coils/line. The smoke stopped but the knocking and slipping persisted with zero improvement.

IMPORTANT: when my friend the mechanic changed the oil separator, he told me that he was absolutely positive this car had been looked at for this same issue before. I am NOT a mechanic, I know nothing about cars, but my friend the mechanic is very knowledgeable and upright, so I believe him. I asked him if he was positive, he assured me he was and that someone had been fiddling around exactly where he was.

Fast forward to this week. Finally bit the bullet and dropped the car off with MB for them to officially DiAgNoSe it. ($600 my ***). Anyway. This is how I found out about scratching inside the 5th cylinder and that I am screwed.

MY QUESTION: first of all, what is going on????!!! Second of all, this hit me today, did this guy I bought the car from, know about the problem, and sold it to the dealership to sell it to me, as a way to shield himself from any liability for prior knowledge????? If so, what can I do????? Thirdly am I just completely wasting my time asking MB HQ to give a **** about this? Fourthly, (lol fourthly, I promise I’m almost done) how can my mechanic be so sure the prior owner was aware of this problem? I’m imagining the mechanic who looked at it previously left an ancient scroll in the engine like “Toby was here, 2020” LMAO but that’s probably not the case…..lol. So, how? I’m truly curious.

Okay car guys. Help me out here. Thank you!!!!!

not2fast

Sorry for your headaches.

I would cut my losses at this point. Buying a 10 year old MB is not a good investment for a person that can't maintain the car themselves. I don't care how good of shape it is in or how low miles it has you need vehicle history and prefer a low number of owners.
Honestly I worry when a car has extremely low miles for its age.

The example you listed with the airbags if you have time/skills/location/tools you could have done both yourself for less then 2k. That makes sense on a vehicle worth less then 20k. 8k doesn't.

KCMOjuju

Hi. Thanks. Yes I am 100% done with the car. My secondary car currently is a Lexus and I’ll be replacing the MB with a Lexus LX570.

Do I have any recourse to sue the original owner, in the event I discover that he was aware of the bad engine? I am calling Dallas Mercedes’ to ask.

Also, can you explain to me how it is that my mechanic can be so sure that the previous owner had the engine looked at for precisely the same problems?? I’m really curious about that.

not2fast

It was fine for 10k and a year. I highly doubt the previous owner would have know about any engine issues you are experiencing. I do regular flushes and oil changes at 5k or less intervals and have had good luck.

A mechanic usually can tell if something has been taken apart. I know I can tell by little bread crumbs and hints.

How long did the previous owner have it? The Lexus LX570 is a good choice. I was in the market for that, but fell in love with the driving dynamics of the Benz.

As for the fix. That price is crazy high. I would shop around. Used engines with 70k on them at 4-5k in my area.

Try car-part.com.

KCMOjuju

The previous owner bought the car new in 2013.

The little knocking noise was present very shortly after I bought the car but I didn’t care because I didn’t know and my CEL wasn’t on.

i just talked to MB Dallas and they said they are legally not allowed to give me any information on the service history of the vehicle while it was under the previous ownership. Is that really so????

KCMOjuju

Also about the air suspension- can I go back to my MB and argue with them for replacing more than they had to do which was likely only the airbags?

not2fast

I have heard that, but usually it is how they ask. I made the dealer give me it before purchasing. Did you buy it through them? Sounds like the previous owner might have done this as a trade-in to avoid sales tax on new car. If this was at a MB dealer they must have been confident in the car to do it because they would become liable.

not2fast

I doubt it. I would replace both as the other side is likely to fail shortly after. If you don't correct it quickly it will damage the pump.

KCMOjuju

Okay. Thanks.

I’m just so disappointed. Regardless of warranty or recalls, etc, as a business, I’m disappointed MB hasn’t even show an interest in making this right. I am a business owner, I can say for a fact that were I in their shoes, I would financially support the customer to make this right. The bottom line is that they are at fault for making a car that needs a new engine at 70,000 miles. It shouldn’t happen. I’m just so disappointed.

E55Greasemonkey

You're in the wrong forum. You have a 166. Anyhow...cylinder scuffing is becoming a common problem with your engine. The engine block is ruined, and the only practical solution is to replace the engine. If you continue to drive it the engine with seize. With the value of a used GL450/550 that often costs more to fix than the car is worth, even with a used engine plus labor it's going to be a lot. Unfortunately, unless your state laws are different, you bought a used car, and there is no implied warranty. The dealership does not have to give you the service history, and MB corporate will do nothing to help you, they don't care, as you have found out. Generally they will only offer assistance to the original owner IF the car was serviced exclusively at a MB dealer. Even then, they don't offer much these days. Sorry for your trouble. The Lexus is a good idea.

KCMOjuju

Yeah sorry. I don’t know what 166 means. I just know GL. Lol.

Everything you said sounds right. Just sucks. I got the car appraised at Carmax yesterday. $18,000. It’s less than what I still owe on the car. Eyeroll. I’ll just have to eat it. I’ll probably sell it to them though and be done with it. It just sucks because I don’t think I’ll ever buy a Mercedes’ again because of this. I really really really want a G Wagon and was going to get one when I get older. Now I just don’t know. Sounds like I would have to buy it new with a warranty so basically hope I become a millionaire sometime soon. 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

not2fast

I didn't catch the year. We ran into something similar with my wife's 2016 Honda Pilot last spring. We bought it new she maintained it at the dealer majority of its life and the motor went out at 115k.

She called Honda and they offered no assistance. Motors are extremely cheap for them and we replaced it with one with 3k on it for less then 5 grand installed.

KCMOjuju

Again. I know nothing about cars.

But why, just because the cylinder(s) are scored, does that mean the entire block has to go? Why isn’t it possible to fill and sand or whatever the interior of the cylinder?????

And why did they score? Was it the fault of the coating used inside the cylinder? Was it the fault of the piston(s)? Was it that **** got inside there?????

not2fast

What year is it?

KCMOjuju

Sheesh. For $5K I’d repair my car no doubt. I’ll be out more than that just on the financing once I get rid of this car.

Id a motor the same thing as an engine?

Mines a 2013. Im regretting I didn’t listen to all the people who said “don’t get a MB, the repairs are too expensive”. I just thought “that won’t happen to me”.

I had a Honda Crosstour years ago and super loved it. I didn’t have a single issue.

KCMOjuju

Now that I’m thinking about it…. My sipping started way before the knocking. The slipping was the first problem. I thought it was the transmission. That’s why I took it in first. That’s when they told me about the one air suspension. So when I fixed that I hoped maybe it would fix my slipping, even though that didn’t make sense. Of course it didn’t effect the slipping at all and the slipping just got worse, then the knocking started.

I don’t want to hear **** about it, but when I first got that car I could almost floor it and take off so fast, it was so fun. But that hardly lasted long at all. It just slowly got slipper and slippier. If I took it out today, I would have to wait like a turtle just to get up to the second gear (or third whatever) like when you leave a neighborhood speed. Even if I really press the gas, I just have to wait wait wait for the car to go.

not2fast

Yeah you have an "x166". It is the chasis code.

Motor=Engine

I really think the biggest thing with MB/BMW/Audi is that less people work on them so they charge more labor and parts are more expensive. Certainly not something I recommend if you can't do some of the repairs yourself.

I love that generation and like how they drive, but the x164 seemed to be more reliable model and I got the last year built vs first year in your case.

My wife wants me to get a GLS580 next, but I am thinking new Toyota Sequoia.

KCMOjuju

I didn’t know my car was the first year for anything. Great.

Yeah BMW/MB/Audi. I had a BMW X6 before this. It was so fun and like a space ship. I could turn on a dime and take off. That’s before I had my daughter lol. I had to get rid of that because the computer system was bad and the entire car would shut down middle of driving. After my tenth time being towed, I got rid of it. Now I regret not fixing it instead of buying the MB. But I don’t think I’ll ever buy BMW or MB again. Like you said, I can’t fix anything.

The GLS580 is cool. I like Toyota. If you’re consider the MB and Sequoia, why aren’t you considering the Lexus SUV’s kind of in the middle? I’m thinking about the LS570.

Can you work on your car yourself? If I could I guess it would be different.

QUOTE=not2fast;8550252]Yeah you have an "x166". It is the chasis code.

Motor=Engine

I really think the biggest thing with MB/BMW/Audi is that less people work on them so they charge more labor and parts are more expensive. Certainly not something I recommend if you can't do some of the repairs yourself.

I love that generation and like how they drive, but the x164 seemed to be more reliable model and I got the last year built vs first year in your case.

My wife wants me to get a GLS580 next, but I am thinking new Toyota Sequoia.[/QUOTE]

KCMOjuju

Can you explain to me why the cylinder can’t just be repaired???

KCMOjuju

Is there any Lexus that can really take off? (Not a crazy car, just normal). That’s what I like.
I have an SC430 right now and it’s fun but even it can’t take off. Not really.
Do Lexus just not take off?

Max Blast

MB could have helped you out with a Pre-Purchase Inspection, but not surprisingly are they not obligated to help you in any way now.

you’re also approaching this a lot less pragmatically than I would - why does the car need a NEW ENGINE NoW??? It sounds more like the tranny is going out.

there are many alternative solutions to explore before sucking up the most costly one, which is a new engine for a 10 yo car. A good known used engine and or tranny from a similar vintage x166 is way more economical.

sorry you got took, but the right thing here is to dump and run.

KCMOjuju

What do you mean “why does the car need a new engine now?”? Mercedes diagnosed that the fifth cylinder has scoring inside, and probably more cylinders do too.

I’ve had Mercedes and my own mechanic look at the transmission and it’s fine.

I’m not going to buy a used engine for the car given the age of the car and it’s value and all the other problems I’ve had with it.

I’m definitely selling the car.

I would just like to understand why repairing the cylinder(s) is not possible???

not2fast

It could be cost issue. I would be super labor intensive pulling apart the engine and do the work.

They would end up doing everything an engine builder will do. When you get an engine they will have a core charge that gets given back when they provide you engine.

chassis

Sorry to hear of the difficulties. Moving away from this vehicle seems the best option.

Mercedes is cementing for themselves a reputation for engines that catastrophically fail before 100k miles.

The M274 four cylinder (piston cracking) and the M278/M157 (cylinder scoring) are two examples. These two engines were used in nearly the entire MB model range in the mid-late two thousand teens.

C-, E-, S-, SL- and G/GL*- classes are all affected. It’s a pity for the manufacturer and its customers.

The current M264 4 cylinder is descended from the M274. M177 V8 is a fairly clean sheet of paper design. It’s too early to say if either newer engine will make it to 100k miles without major repair or replacement needed.

Max Blast

What do you then mean by the transmission seems to be slipping? Unsure here of what the real basic problem is… Yes there could be scoring on the cylinder walls but how bad is it? is the car smoking? is it down on power? Is it making clicky clacking noises?

if you factor in the labor needed to pull an engine, disassemble it, fix it with new parts and reassemble it to a specification, you’re right out the $26,000 cost of a new engine from Mercedes, inclusive of the labor to reinstall it. Unfortunately these engines aren’t really rebuildable in the sense that there are a lot of parts available for them in the aftermarket, so you’re stuck selecting from the dealers inventory which is always going to be new, or you’ll have to source a good known used engine from a crashed one through a reseller, and that engine may or may not have the same issue is the one you’re pulling out.