makris0000

So I am at the point where I may need to consider a different car. My GLE 53 AMG Coupe was delayed yet again and they took away the red interior and stuck me with all black. On top of that, the dealership is giving a very low discount of 2% and they are low-balling my current GLE trade in. Right now I have my 21 GLE 350 with 25K miles and the lease is up in about 4 months. The last car I ordered from them (my 21 GLE 350) was delayed by about 3 months, but that was at the end of 2020 when Covid was starting to impact the factories. I am starting to consider alternative options because I don't think it is reasonable to take delivery of a 100K car that is not exactly how I ordered it and to have the dealership not even give a good discount and trade in value for my current car. Sure they can maybe throw in a service package or something, but I am not able to see the justification.

So my question is, what are good alternatives to the GLE 53 AMG SUV and Coupe? I checked out a few contenders like the X6, Q8 and the Cayenne and Cayenne Coupe, but I have been mostly Mercedes and I do not know enough about the other brands and have never driven them/owned them before. I would like to get some info from people who have owned these before along with their GLEs for some real world insight.

chassis

2023 Cayenne S coupe or SUV. Awesome car and better interior than the 2024 facelift. Plus you have no drama of ordering and waiting for a car, or dealers selling the car out from under you.

2.9TTV6 makes nice power and sound, especially with sports exhaust. Air suspension is a game changer for ride comfort, and sportiness when you want it. Very spacious and luxurious interior when optioned with full leather, and even better with club leather.

If you want a V8, go for the GTS or Turbo. Almost zero owner complaints about the GTS, but it's a sports car with 4 doors, so you need to want that. The Turbo is a beast and has a commensurate price tag

CPO 2023 units are available in the $100k price range. You get 3 more years of manufacturer's warranty plus 2 additional CPO warranty years. So 5 years coverage, better than if you purchased it new.

CPO 2022 would be more price and option attractive, with 4 years of warranty remaining (2 years original manufacturer's warranty + 2 years CPO).

Porsche CPO is as trustworthy as the retail auto industry can deliver.

Porsche option flexibility means each car is a one-off special. With Porsche there is almost no "packaging" of options than almost all other non-exotic brands. Therefore when shopping make sure to find a car with all of your important boxes checked.

Here is a list of suggested "must-haves":
- air suspension
- sports exhaust
- sport chrono
- club leather
- SportDesign (exterior trim/appearance package)
- Burmester audio
- HUD

PDCC (active stabilizer bar) and rear axle steer are fun gadgets but many people report they are not noticeable unless driving at the limit. I would skip these.

finder.porsche.com

petee1997

If you compare the the Cayenne S option for option with the GLE53, expect to pay considerably more money. Everything is optional on the Porsche. The V6 is not comparable with the light hybrid63 I-6. 429 HP engine. Electronics in the MB are superior. A loaded GLE53 is worth the wait.

chassis

EA839 2.9TTV6 is a 440hp engine and is mercifully not afflicted with a failed 48V system.

The Cayenne is furthermore blessed with a ZF transmission and mercifully not afflicted with a junk MB balky clunky 9G box.

No Porsche model will ever be equivalently priced, or cheaper than, MB or BMW in any segment. To expect otherwise would be to seek the unfindable.

makris0000

I’m playing with the Porsche configurator and so far I’m building it close to the price of my ordered GLE coupe. I’m trying to keep it under 110K and it is doable. The only thing I am not a fan of is the exterior color options. They have a 13K color option which lets me pick almost any color, but it’s 13K!

I don’t think the BMW X6 is nice enough compared to the GLE and the Cayenne from what I’ve been seeing online.

mikapen

In general I agree with those option recommendations.

But for a significant improvement in ride and handling over a GLE 53, PDCC and probably rear steer are necessary.

And without at least PDCC, I think the Sport Chronos is a waste.

2022 and newer Cayenne's have dropped one of my favorite engines, the 2.9 TT V6, and replaced it with a V8 of about the same power.
The V8 sounds better but I don't think it's as playful. (Only limited drive for me, though.)

That said, I'd look for a CPO 2021 Cayenne S with that 2.9 TT.

chassis

If you are willing to consider CPO, your option content opens up, combined with a good chunk of warranty coverage.

stktyz33

There are delays on 2024 deliveries too. Now, it looks like there is stop sale on it with no ETA on a fix (yet).

When I was talking to a dealer, the ETA was at least three months, no accounting for possible delays or other factors.

HotRodW

I'd have the Range Rover Sport Dynamic SE P400 on the consideration list for sure. I personally think it's slightly overpriced for the performance, but the market seems to disagree.

makris0000

I’ve been playing with the Cayenne configurator for a little while now and kind of narrowed down a build. I did see the stop sale on the cayenne due to something with the fuel line or something. I drove my sister in law’s 24 Cayenne and it is the complete opposite of my GLE 350. The cayenne feels heavy where my GLE feels light, the cayenne takes more effort to brake whereas the GLE you tap the brakes and it stops, and the acceleration in the cayenne is super smooth and doesn’t throw you in your seat whereas the GLE it’s jerky and throws you in your seat. The ride is even smoother than my GLE and her cayenne doesn’t have the air suspension on it. Very surprised!

I would have considered the Range Rover Sport and it would have been my top option because I used to love them, but the redesign has the looks only its mother can love. The big body Range Rover would end up running me way more than what I feel like spending and I don’t want to pay any market adjustments.

HotRodW

I don't find it homely, but I do think the Range Rover Sport's styling took a step backwards. Next up on my list would be the SQ8. Sharp styling with a stellar chassis and powertrain. Genesis is launching the sportier GV80 Coupe soon, but even with a power boost it won't offer the level of performance you're looking for.

Ron.s

Tye ZF strike may be the reason for the delay on your GLE 53. That was settled last week but might have pushed back production a few weeks.
As far as Porsche having a superior transmission I beg to differ. Having owned both a 2021 GLE 53 & a 2023 Cayenne GTS I have mixed feelings.

My Porsche was close to $50k more money and superior in many ways optioned with all the goodies.I’ve driven several loaners and there is a big difference…not “53” equivalent except for price. Build quality and club leather interior materials on Porsche is generally better…not sure closer to $100k. My Porsche (V8) was smooth as silk and handles better than the Merc. It sits lower, rear wheel steer and has active sway bars that are currently unavailable on the 53. The Tech is awesome (updated mid 2022) but has numerous issues. Doors unlocked, hatch opened on return, blank screens, frozen screens, headlights on daytime, voice commands sketchy-almost every issue is random making diagnosis impossible. Supposedly a PCM update is coming soon but doubt it addresses all issues.
ThevPorsche transmission is an engineering marvel but has one flaw. It appears that the “hang on” transfer case attached to the transmission can’t take aggressive use of paddle shifting and engine braking. If you drive casually the issue won’t become severe. Mine went from a soft sounding whisper to a deep rumble over 7,000 miles and is the primary reason I am having Porsche repurchase the vehicle. Excess oil consumption is also all too common with Porsche vehicles. Mine became progressively worse going about 3k, 2k, 1k per quart. Low tension rings (upper, lower) might be the culprit since it seems like oil consumption is much better on longer trips vs short daily’s in town.
Long term ownership cost of Porsche will be higher…the Service work/parts are overpriced. Going to an Indy or DIY is an option but not without drawbacks of convenience, loaner…
The GLE 53 is kind of the sweet spot for a mid size SUV…Looks, Utility, Price, Handling. Mercedes Quality is questionable! They don’t seem able to differentiate a 350 from an AMG SUV in the US.

de31p5

II just went something very different, picked up a Rivian R1S, it lacks refinement and German Highway feel, but size, efficiency, and power is all there. Plus if you ever considered a Tesla, its just better in my opinion. Objectively better in size and practicality, subjectively better in looks and "feel".

chassis

Rivians aren’t bad. BIL has an R1T and it’s good for a vinyl interior car. Style/design is nice but this is subjective. BEV needs to be a workable use case solution, and it isn’t for many.

mikapen

I suppose that's a candidate, but as you say it's very different.

I think my 5300 lb 53 is already too heavy. A 7300 lb Rivian might be quick, but I think it's more equivalent to an S class sedan than a sporty SUV.

Is it fun to drive?

de31p5

I'm at work right now, going to just throw this down as a train of though so excuse the grammatical errors and all over the place sentences.s

I have a 6month old daughter and the GLE was starting to feel cramped with how large strollers are now. I made the switch for that reason plus I do like EV's. The rear seat has less leg room, but the 3rd row is very usable. I can sit behind myself in every row and I'm 6'3. Compared to the 53, the R1S suspension has much more travel, as such it absorbs large bumps much better than the GLE. My GLE did not have ARC so that might be the reason but going over speed bumps or dips at an angle threw you left and right a bit, I'm going to guess due to the stiff swaybars not allowing left and right to compress independently.

The suspension feels looser more truck based, its very comfortable still. I have the off road package so I have all terrain tires which again very different from even the all seasons on the GLE. Trunk space with the 3rd row down is huge, swallows up even my full size stroller with plenty of room. In the GLE i had to place it in a very specific way or else it wouldn't fit under the cargo cover and allow the trunk to close. speaking of cargo cover, I don't have one in the Rivian, thought i would want it, but anything i need out of sight goes in the powered frunk. Coming from Tesla's and Porsche's the powered frunk makes you actually want to use the space.

IT is definitely fun to drive, 835hp is addicting. And being silent you can get up to speed around town without attracting attention. It definitely floats more, hence the "not as refined/German highway feel" remark.

Price is similar between the two, but the Rivian just feels like it can take a beating more or feels like I don't have to take care of it as much. With the GLE I was always compelled to keep it clean and shiny. Not so with the Rivian "truck". Since picking it up, my wife and I have been panning more "adventures", while the GLE may be capable for light off roading, again it always just "felt too nice" to really go "adventuring". This post has a lot of quotations and mentions about feel. between the two and my use case either could have been fine, its just an unquantifiable "feel" that makes one better than the other for the current circumstances.

In summary:

GLE = Luxurious, Nice, German fun
R1S = Adventurous, Quick, Offroad fun

edited to plug some pics

mikapen

Good summary of a different type of vehicle. I'm sure the acceleration is addictive.😁

The GLE is more off-road capable than most. One of my favorite things is to "play through" gaggle of Jeeps, strategizing their next attempt, in and around Ouray Colorado.
First they snicker, then avert their eyes as I just drive up.

Sold my FJ45 Land Cruiser because the GLE is better off road. Just got back from an Aspen tour last week. I don't think I'd want anything bigger on those trails.
Or at the track.

I can see a Rivian suits your needs a lot better, and that's a good thing.

chassis

Rivians have standard air suspension, which I find impressive, especially for the R1T in the truck segment. F-150 Lightning has standard steel coil springs. I have spent time under BIL's R1T and the suspension execution is impressive. Air ride + leveling + adjustable dampers allow low spring rate which is the principal phenomenon responsible for ride comfort.

Crito

The F-Pace also comes in a I6 with 48V mild hybrid trans version. The SVR is beautifully old school though, no electronic supercharger on this one. Even the suspension looks like something the boneheads at Midas could probably handle. I think maybe they've gotten a bad rap because of the I-Pace EV which was a buggy disaster but the 5.0L is really the last of a dying breed so I had to buy one. They depreciate fast and there's a special 1988 Edition for 2023 but 2024 model comes with new infotaiment system that does wireless Android Auto and that was the one piece of modern tech I just had to have.



.. and British Racing Green always looks green unlike Emerald Green Metallic which typically looks black

Ron.s

Long term viability of Rivian-will they make the cut in the future? Less than 50% probability!
Jaguar/Land Rover vehicles are consistently the least reliable, near the bottom. I like the F-Pace a lot but never would buy one. I know the local JLR Service Manager who took a lateral move to Acura over frustration with QC.

Crito

Reliability of the I6 with turbo, electric supercharger and 48V mild hybrid transmission is completely different that the reliability of the 5.0L they've been making for decades. But anywhosies, I almost went with a Porsche for all the great color choices but the SVR is truly an "old school beast" and it makes all the appropriate noises too. The noises that come out of electric AMG sound comical in comparison. Like cartoon car noises.



Seriously though, that's my neighbors black car between my green Mercedes and green Jag. I want a green not black car.

makris0000

I have not driven the SVR, but my sister in law used to have the Jag SUV (F Pace, F Type, whatever the F one is called). It wasn't bad but I am not a huge fan. Also I am 6'4 and the Jag SUV felt cramped on the interior.

On a side note, anyone ever heard of a "EPA/Carb Certification"? I made a seperate post about it just now, but wondering if anyone has heard of that before and that being a reason for delaying delivery?

Crito

F-Pace is the SUV. The "SVR" thing is like AMG in Mercedes speak. It has way more cargo capacity than my EQE but even at 5' 7" I've already whacked my head a couple time getting in and out so I can see how the front might feel cramped to you. To me it fits like a glove though.

I'm pretty sure it was the look on this guy's face that made me do it.. that "it's almost as good as sex" expression:

makris0000

After doing some test drives and whatnot I’ve decided to either order a new cayenne coupe or find one that is one year old with low miles as a CPO. I just got new tires for my GLE so I am probably going to buy it at the end of the lease and not have a car payment for a little while, then look to get a cayenne coupe. Here’s my consensus of the cars that were mentioned:

X6M & X6 50iM - seats were uncomfortable, had the most headroom out of the suv coupe models I’ve sat in.
SQ8 - zero headroom
Cayenne Coupe - love it! Easy to drive compared to the cayenne, firmer ride than the cayenne, and the road noise is more noticeable.
Cayenne - like it. Feels big, comfy ride, don’t really hear road noise.
Range Rover Sport - sat in it, then the sales guy said there is a $30K market adjustment, got out and walked away. Ugly AF.
GLE Coupe - saw one at the dealership that was almost exactly my build (without the red interior and the carbon fiber steering wheel), buttons up top for the map lights and interior lights were BROKEN! Loved the looks tho.

Ron.s

Similarly optioned there isn’t much difference in driving dynamics between a Cayenne Coupe or Cayenne SUV. I have owned a well equipped CGTS SUV for a year and test drove both a Coupe and a base Cayenne loaner. The Base feels like driving a different car from mine with a V8 and suspension/handling goodies. Seats come 8/14/18 way and make a huge difference in comfort. Club Leather is another + option.
The Coupe comes standard with more options than the SUV and is a little lighter with the CF roof, swept rear but not enough to notice the weight difference, IMO. The Coupe has a different (smaller) look and if that appeals to you that should be the reason to go Coupe.
The customization options on a Cayenne are almost mind boggling at first but they can make a difference in comfort and driving dynamics. At some point it’s personal preference when selecting Porsche options but with Porsche they aren’t always for looks…you get what you pay for as the saying goes. Porsche Options, Maintenance and Service are not cheap, some might say overpriced.