ZAMB

I am a 4 time Lexus owner...just ordered a GLS 450 and concerned about the maintenance costs and reliability posts I am reading, but offset is good reviews on power train and comfort. My other option was a LEXUS LX600 and am on a list for that as well. Any former Lexus owners with experience on the Benz side to comfort or support concerns. Delivery date not till the fall earliest of '22. Thanks

chassis

MB reliability is orders of magnitude lower than Lexus. It's not a fair fight or relevant comparison.

MBs look nice and have some other positives. Reliability is not one of them.

Do your due diligence on the MB. You may want to cancel your order, or not.

ZAMB

Why do you not think that reliability comps are not relevant in this case particularly the LX600 vs the GLS 450. Concur on the conclusion about reliability, but when you live on an island with access to MB service more challenging, it becomes more relevant. My due diligence continues but not a lot of data on the new GLS from it's 2019/2020 launch date. Thank you for your candid response.

chassis

Lexus and MB are not in the same league regarding reliability. This to me means they are not comparable. It's a figure of speech. Of course they are comparable.

What island are you referring to? Your profile provides no location information.

Psymac

How driven a Lexus GX470, GX460, 2016 Mercedes GLS 450, and now a 2021 GLS450. The Mercedes is a vastly superior car in every way, and the reliability for me has been the same or better than the Lexus. Definitely the Lexus has its own place, and is well designed and certainly a reliable luxury SUV. However, the incredible engineering,comfort, and solid feel of the Mercedes is amazing. Well worth the wait in my opinion. Besides, don’t you think the Mercedes looks much better than the Lexus? I’ve never been a fan of that front end spindle design, overwrought.

Dave Stough

I will second that. Having driven just about everything under $125k, either as a test drive, loaner, or rental, I think my GLE and GLS are well-handling, well-assembled vehicles. I wouldn't buy a Lexus over an MB.


But that's just me. There are a few people on these threads who don't like them.

ZAMB

Thank you for the response. Spot on.

ZAMB

San Juan islands in WA state. 1 hour ferry ride and at almost 2 more hours on the road to a dealership.

nc211

I've had two Lexus vehicles (LS and GS) in the past, both with the buttery smooth V8 engines. They're hard to beat, no argument there. They are smooth, quiet, comfortable, and about as bullet proof as they come. I've also had two Toyota SUV's in the past as well, (V8 4Runner, 2013 Highlander).

I came to the German side of the automotive world 13 years ago from my Lexus GS430. I traded it for a CPO 2007 VW GTI. I have less-than 0% regrets. Today I have two MB's in my garage. Why?

Mercedes has a way to communicate to you exactly what the car is doing without sacrificing ride comfort or refinement. Lexus, while ultra-plush, is just completely numb to communicate what's going on. Where this comes into play the most, at least for me, is in bad weather. I hated the fact that I could not tell the difference between driving in the pouring down rain or across a desert in a Lexus. It was always the same. I walked away from the brand for the GTI with my GS430 spun out on a cloverleaf in Chicago in a moderate rain storm. Had new tires, wasn't going fast, but out of nowhere, the rear end just broke loose. Thankfully didn't hit anyone or anything.

When our 2013 Highlander was due to be replaced, the GLS430 was the clear winner. My wife drives back/forth to NC from DC a lot. That Highlander was no different than all of the others we've had from Toyota - and she hated driving it in bad weather. After she drove my aging W212 one time back to NC in a downpour, that was it for her too, she wanted that sense of control and understanding on what the car is doing as well.

The GLS isn't going to be as "old school" plush riding as the Lexus you're used to. It'll be a bit more twitchy riding, and twitchy feeling. But the benefit is that you'll have FAR more confidence in driving it. It'll handle like a sports sedan in comparison, and it'll feel like one too.

MB engines aren't as quiet as Lexus. They tick like watches. They make some noises that you won't be used to, but it's normal. You won't hear it inside the car, but one day when you're standing next to it, you'll think something is wrong because it's a tick/click sounding engine instead of a purr. You'll also love the fuel economy too, especially when you realize it'll hit 60 inside of 6 seconds and still return to you north of 20mpg's on average!

I have a neighbor with a new Lexus LX470. The new style. She's had it for a few years now. She likes it, but noticed she never drives it in bad weather. Drives the BMW X5 instead. When asked why, she said the exact same thing I've said here. She hates driving it in slick conditions, feels like it's going to slide out of control, has no idea what's going on with it. She feels much better in the BMW in those conditions.

ZAMB

Thank you nc211, I can relate to the disconnect with Lexus and the road or driving experience. Super smooth, quiet, but connection to the machine and the road is totally numbed out by their technology. I love engine sounds too. Appreciate your perspective and experience here.

chassis

Do the due diligence. Trips to the dealer are not uncommon in the MB ownership experience.

nc211

I think you'll like the MB, but not if you compare everything about it to the Lexus. Just keep that in mind when you're driving it. It's also a hybrid setup, meaning when it comes to a stop, it's needing to use that motion to recharge the 48v battery and can get a little lumpy sometimes. In a Lexus, when coasting to a stop, it's like you're in neutral and able to control it with the brakes for a silky smooth stop. Not so in the MB, it walks back down the gears and uses the brakes as well to recharge the system. Takes a little getting used to. But the trade off is the electric influence in the powertrain, which is instant. That and the turbo, really lets it get up and run far quicker than you would think (or expect) a vehicle that size with a 6 cylinder engine could do. Surprises me still, and we're closing in on 50k miles on our 2020 already. It'll easily see 300k from us. The engine is also the straight 6, not a V6, which is all around a much smoother and more reliable arrangement. Merc is famous for some pretty bullet-proof I6 engines in the past.

I have a 2014 E350 4-matic sedan as well. I've had it for 5 years now, bought it as a CPO in 2017 with around 21k on the clock, now approaching 65k. It hasn't been perfect, but the overall satisfaction of driving it, being in it, and looking at it sitting in my garage, has made it easy for me to write some pretty hefty checks along the way. It's had some issues that are likely from pothole hits that the GLS won't suffer from. But even after spending probably around $5k on maintenance and repairs on it since I bought it, I still love it like crazy.

A properly maintained MB, can become like that favorite sweater you go for on that first cool day of fall, or the favorite pair of jeans. It's that feeling that makes the costs worth it to me. When we went car shopping to replace the Toyota, I told my wife to try and think along those lines. Find a car that a $4k repair bill is the option to take instead of replacing it with a $50k+ new car. In that context, I told her she can have whatever she wants. I had figured she would go for the Range Rover, as that's all I have heard her say she really wanted. Was willing to give it a shot (knowing it would bite me in the wallet) for her. But to my surprise, after one test drive of a new Mercedes GLS 450, she was in total love (and I was quite happy too). From there, it was finding the right one, right color (midnight blue / beige), and bench seating in the back instead of the captain chairs (had them in the Highlander). Found it in northern Baltimore and was brought in on a flatbed to the VA burb's of DC for us. Think we paid around $86k in August 2020 before the insanity hit the market. It's been good ever since.

If you got the 21' staggered wheels, know that it like to eat them around 25k on the rear. Ours came with the Pirelli's as standard, and switched over to the Michelins at 25k. We've probably got another 6k-7k left before they get too close for my own comfort on the wear bars, which would put us right around 53k miles before the 3rd set is needed. Good thing about that however - you never have to worry about rotating them or balancing, because they wear out before either of those aspects become a problem to deal with! Ha! Half full view point to help justify the $300/tire kick in the sack...

One more tip - next time you're at the gas station and see that older Mercedes that has obviously been well maintained, ask the person who they use for it. The other key to ownership satisfaction is finding that local mechanic who has the solid reputation for the brand. The dealerships in my experience are not very good at repairs. I've had bad luck with several of them on the E350, like impossibly bad, shockingly bad, "what the hell are you doing" kind of bad. Our GLS doesn't seen the dealership unless it's a warranty item on their dime. Otherwise it goes to my local Indi exclusively for service, which has saved me tons already. $200 oil changes on average, versus $700 at the dealership for the exact same thing with the exact same parts and oil.

nc211

In MB's defense - out of all of my cars, those two Lexus vehicles cost me more than any other with chasing out vibrations due to premature wearing of soft rubber bushings in those suspension arms. My LS was a nightmare chasing vibrations, from engine mounts down the driveshaft to the rear diff bushings, control arm bushings, and so on. My GS430 was starting to do the same at 65k miles with two worn out rear trailing arm bushings and a cracked driveshaft flex coupling, along with flattened engine mounts. They were far from perfect, and in Lexus-ville - it's not just the problem spot you replace, but it's neighbors as well to get it right. And this is coming from a guy who, until very recently, had VW's for a dozen years (3 GTI's in a row)!

But yeah, MB's aren't perfect by a decent shot. But not too many man-made machines are these days. I think my W212 has a bad driveshaft bearing somewhere in the front diff or on the driveshaft now. I'm thinking front diff. I didn't think much of it when I bought it, noticing the dealership had to physically replace 2 of the AMG rims and realizing the other two that were on the car were already bent when I bought it. I suspect previous owner hit something so hard that it cracked the front two and bent the back two. Probably a bridge expansion joint during the winter thaw. Anyone on here from Chicago knows exactly what I'm talking about! And I've hit my fair share of "squirrel jacuzzi's" myself in it.

SoCalBenzGuy

Lexus builds a great car no doubt. With Mercedes you can prepay for the first 4 years of service which is well worth it. Nothing drives like a Benz. I started with Honda then went to Lexus and after that have only driven BMW and Benz. To me the cost of maintenance is more than worth it for the driving feel. If you are on top of your maintenance and you take care of it Mercedes can be reliable. Lexus you can treat like a turd and it will still run. The Mercedes will cost you more as it gets older. I would say once it passes 100k that is when they get expensive. For example at 100k miles you can automatically assume the air suspension will need to be replaced and that is a $5k job minimum. I would recommend getting the extended warranty if you plan on keeping the car.

nc211

That’s the thing though, I personally don’t think they’re all that much more to maintain. The Lexus has air suspension too and I know a few folks who’ve come out on a cold day to find theirs sitting on the ground with around 100k miles too, and they’re just as pricey to fix, or at least close enough to not be that big of a difference to matter for those willing to spend nearly $100k on a car.

I do think however what you’ll find with MB over Lexus is probably a few more repairs in general along the way. Stuff like a center driveshaft bearing, or a differential bearing, that sort of stuff. I think you could drive the Lexus through Chornobyl without the check engine light coming on, whereas the MB would probably tell you the presafe function as malfunctioned, the passenger side mirror would only be operable from the drivers seat lumbar control, and whatnot. But the trade off is that driving experience differences. The Benz will nickel and dime you a bit more, but we’re not talking about the pistons going through the hood.

one of the things I really enjoy about the MB brand, is that it’s just that, a Mercedes’ Benz. Their are no copy cats, or different badge tiers and therefore different pricing tiers for maintenance (excluding AMG of course). For instance, the E350 isn’t a luxurious Maxima. The switchgear in the GLE isn’t the same from the Atlas. You’re not going to crawl under your GLS and see Toyota’s symbol like you do with a Lexus. It’s a Benz, and only a Benz. That, I like, a lot. Why? I have no idea, call it personal vanity (which goes with a Benz!) BMW is in that same category as well. I have to admit, it I spent $300,000 on a Bentley and an Audi Q8 pulled up next to me, I’d be a little irritated knowing there are similarities and shared parts to both under the skin.

darlop

Any conversation about reliability needs to include how long you plan on keeping the vehicle. My personal rule is not to keep any vehicle beyond 5 years and this most especially applies to German luxury cars.

Within those 5 years all cars have pretty much the same reliability. But if you are planning on keeping the car "until the wheels fall off" I definitely would not recommend a Mercedes.

I had a 2006 GL450 that I only sold 2 years ago and I spent over $20k on repairs over the years including replacing the entire air suspension system. It was not worth keeping that long and I would never do that again.