Sauerkraut

Hello everyone!

found some brandnew pictures of W164 completely modified by Carlsson. Wheels are brandnew design 3/12 Ultralight 3-pcs in 22'!!!

Paul Le Corre

If I remember well, they exist in 19 inches too. I wonder how it looks with this size.

Sauerkraut

Bonjour Paul, ca va?


I think you are aiming at the Carlsson wheel 1/12 BE which is a cast wheel in 19'. This is a completely different story because 3/12 UL is forged and 3-pcs. I saw this ML at IAA in Frankfurt and the wheel is made extremely well, perfect polish and, most important for this wheel size, very light! The advantages of a forged wheel do not need to be discussed further, it's simply the best you can buy for your money.

Birger

Paul,

If you want to have a look at the 19" Carlsson wheel, take a trip to Luxyland. The Mercedes dealer has a ML350 in the showroom with stock 17" wheels on the right side and the 19" Carlsson wheels with 295/45-19 Dunlop 9000's on the left side. They look definitely OK, although I personally prefer the AMG Type VI wheels. Bring 4.959 EUR and you can take home a nice welcome gift for your ML to Troyes......

Cheers,
Birger

GregW / Oregon

They come in 10x22 and 11x22. Here's a close-up view:


Full view here:

http://www.carlsson.de/en/tuning/m-k...er/3_12_ul.php

BoBcanada

Those rims are sex on wheels.

Sauerkraut

you're damned right! But also the very low weight is a big advantage when you ride this car with more than 20'!

vraa

That car is surreal.
What kind of finish is on those rims?

Sauerkraut

what's surreal on this car? Seems to be a normal photo in my eyes. According to Carlsson it's a forged and high-polished finish, for me it looks very real!

Got some more pictures from Carlsson ML, this time with another new wheel called 3/11 Ultralight in 23' inches.

GregW / Oregon

It also come in 10x21, et60 front & 50 rear.



The 1/12 comes in 10x19 et45:



The 2/5 comes in 9.5x20 et45:

Paul Le Corre

Thanks for all the answer guys.

Does anyone has a picture of the car with the 19 inches version?
Really I'm a little confused by those wheels. They are so differents from the rest of the tuners' production. But in the same time I like the look.
BTW, the ET is very big for the 19 inches version. 45 is something so you need huge tyres. Do think it requires wheel arche modifications?

I'm hesitating to take rims in huge dimensions since it will slow down the car and will probably ruin the ride. the ML 320 CDI won't be a fast car so I don't want to turn it into a slow camel (since I'm working in Egypt now, the image is well chosen)

Birger

Paul,

if the Carlsson-equipped ML350 is still sitting in the dealer's showroom when I get back to Luxyland in the week after Nov 7, I'll take my camera along.

I see you're still working in Egypt, so my advise to go see the car by yourself was maybe slightly irrelevant

According to MB, both Carlsson and AMG wheels with 295/45-19 or 295/40-20 tires need some modifications. MB also have a 20" wheel with ET 60 and 265/45-20 "MO" tires, but you can't use it with Airmatic. The 19" AMG Styling III wheel that's already offered from the factory in 8.5 x 19 ET58 for the stock 255/50-19 tire will also from first quarter 2006 be offered in a 9.5 x 19 ET56 for a 285/45-19 tire (which is an exact match for the 255/50-19's), but for some obscure reason only for the rear axle.

No doubt that the 295 tires will need more power to go fast - the difference compared to the skinny 235's is stunning. But the good people at Carlsson wil be happy to sell you a C-Tronic that will give your 320CDI 275 horsepower, which should largely compensate for any drag loss due to the wider tires.

Cheers,
Birger

MJ1133

It's alright...

BoBcanada

what sucks is that the rubberl is low profile if you hit a pot hole your rim goes bye bye and a tyre too...

GregW / Oregon

I agree, and I just don't think anything larger than 20s looks right, let alone function right, unless you are going for bling. I tend to like a high degree of functionality on my rides. I had 18s on my W163 in 1998, which was avant-garde back then, but still functional.

I think my current 19s are at the limit of truck functional, though I would like something wider. Seems like the aftermarket companies are going for the big numbers at the expense of some of the rest of us who don't want to look like an NBA player rolling down the street. I may just get the 19 or 20 AMG 63 wheels when they are out if there are not good alternatives in that size range.

amb9800

Hmm...rims in second pic look ok, but the ones in the first pic... maybe it's just me, but they seriously resemble the stock alloys on our old W124 E-class lol. Besides the size (and weight for the size), how is that an improvement?

Edit: here's what I mean:

Bipasha493

yup

Paul Le Corre

Thankyou very much for the info.

I'm a little disturbed by the wheel arche modification. It will raise the price tag and I'm not sure about the effect. Now concerning the loss of acceleration with such big tyres, I know that Carlsson can do something with the C-tronic but I would like to avoid engine tuning. The ML 320 CDI is good as it is (I mean with stock rims) and french dealers are really tight on this issue.

I will think about this.

Birger

Hi Paul,

Sorry, but the lopsided ML350 had gone from the dealer's showroom when I got back - but I'll ask the Carlsson specialist where he's taken it, because next to where it stood, there was still the pile of four wheels, two stock and two wide ones. So the ML is still sitting somewhere on the premises with it's "special" tires.

I forgot the camera anyhow which was annoying, as they just unloaded the very first R-Class. Quite different from the ML, but not unattractive "in the flesh". This one was black with the Alpaca Grey interior and sports package - and yes, you could probably make it do double duty as a hearse

I'm still thinking about C-Tronic, too - but if it gives the already excellent W164 the same boost as my W163, it's certainly worth thinking about. I have recently sold my C-Tronic, and you REALLY notice the difference now it's gone. Incidentally, they now have both "power" and "economy" versions.

Cheers,
Birger

Paul Le Corre

Hi Birger,

So you installed the C-tronic in your car. Have you ever experienced troubles with the car or with the dealer during the maintenance?

Birger

Hi Paul,

This is slightly OT, as I had the C-Tronic in my W163, but never mind.

I got it back in 2001, and software may have evolved since. The first unit wasn't very well matched to the engine control module in my perticular vehicle - when travelling @ 150 kph indicated (which I did back then on the motorways), it kept fluctuating. Ever so slightly, but a little irritating, and also a little conterproductive to fuel economy. I exchanged it for another unit which I used with zero problems, improved performance and better economy until this summer.

I then experienced a number of mysterious, and rather annoying problems: The engine might sometimes be hard to start, and sometimes unexplicably died - mostly when going very gently, so you might not even realize that the engine's died. Annoying! I was advised that this might be "cured" by removing the C-Tronic from the vehicle for some time and then reinstalling it - apparently some components may need a rest after nearly 100,000 kms, or the connectors may simply need a bit of exercise. Seeing that the arrival of the W164 was nearing, and because I had a buyer, I didn't reinstall the C-Tronic (and it works perfectly in the other W163). And believe me, the difference is noticeable!

The C-Tronic was bought from and installed by my Mercedes dealer, and I have never had any problems in this. In their system the C-Tronic is flagged, so they know that for some diagnostics the C-Tronic must be removed.

Would I buy another C-Tronic for the W164?? Well, yes, I think so - the power and torque gains are considerable (225>273 HP; 510>±590 Nm - and the torque is probably kept low to save the transmission), and they now offer both "power" and "economy" versions:

I was advised by my dealer that if I had to take it to another dealership it might be advisable to take it out - it's a 5-10 minute job, so no big deal.

Hope this helps in your decision.

Best greetings to Egypt,
Birger

Paul Le Corre

Hi Birger,

Thanks for those very interesting inputs.

To be honest, I'm still sceptical concerning the "issues" you mentioned. As you said, it's nothing very important but it's annoying. Plus, I don't know how the engine/gearbox will handle such a big increase of torque/power. If it was +30HP/+50NM I wouldn't be so worried but 50 HP just from the electronics without any reinforcement is a lot (same for the torque).
I think I will wait for the end of the running period, after the first thousands kilometers.
I will see:
-If the car didn't have any problems (I'm concerned about the gearbox)
-If it feels underpowered or not (sorry to mention it but I drove the W163 270 CDI in many occasions and it always gave me this impression, so an engine upgrade is understandable in this case)

If everything went well and if I feel like it needs more, then I will see what we can do (because an other question is, does the C-Tronic is the best?)

Birger

Hi, everyone

I found the lopsided W164 again - and as it was marked as "sold" I quickly got a couple of shots at it wiht my mobile phone camera. Sorry, the results aren't excellent, but it gives you an idea of what a W164 with 19" Carlsson wheels and 295/45-19 Dunlop SP9000 tires looks like.

The [****tail] (mixed beverage ) is concocted with the following ingredients:

One stock W164 ML350:

Add a set of Carlsson 1/12 BE wheels with Dunlop SP9000 tires in 295/45-19 (cost: ± 5,000 EUR):

Their ET is 45, so they stick out a bit more:

than the stock 17" wheels:

At the rear, I guess there will be no problems, even without the AMG or other fender flares:

but at the front it could be tricky:

as the tires are quite visible compared to the stock version:

Here's another shot of the front Carlsson wheels:

I like them - kind of classic MB look - and they should be very easy to keep if not clean, then at least decently looking. I would consider, though, reducing the tire size to 275/45-19 which should be an exact match for the stock 17", 18", and 19" tires.

Kind regards,
Birger

GregW / Oregon

275/45s are 0.2-0.3" smaller OD than stock, 285/45s are 0.1-0.5" larger. I think I'd go for the 285s.

Birger

Hi Greg,

Sorry, I got the tire sizes mixed up - I meant to write 285/45-19 and not 275/45-19, and according to the miata.net tire size calculator, 285/45-19 is 0.2% larger than stock (at an indicated 100 kph, you're going 100.2 kph), whereas the 295/45-19 is 1.4% over (100 indicated corresponds to 101.4 kph) - still nothing too frightening, but I think that the 285 would be a better match, at the same time as avoiding possible issues with "visible" rubber. Anyhow, at least over here, if the tire size is not in the manufacturer's "OK" list, it's not possible to put the tires on, unless you want to look for trouble. But the 285 should be OK in that sense - it's part of an AMG combo.

Cheers, and enjoy your Sunday
Birger