2014 ML63 Build Quality - Disappointed!
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ML63
Here is an update from yesterday.
I sent an explicitly clear 4-bullet point action plan to their Sales GM. The four actions proposed are intended to restore fairness and not only repair all the defects but also fix the broken 3-way relationship and trust between myself, the dealership and the manufacturer. I also set out the time frame in which I would like to receive a response.
Right after noon, I received the following reply:
Dear Mr. Xxxxxx,
The issues that you have raised are valid from your point of view but for a response before the end of this day is not one that I am willing to make.
I am afraid that I must inform you that at this point we will need additional time. If this is not acceptable to you then you must do whatever your feel is best.
We will respond in due time.
Txxxx Hxxxxx
General Sales Manager
Pre-Owned Manager
MERCEDES-BENZ OF XXXX
On my instant question "When should I expect your response?", no answer was received at all.
I’m currently preparing a letter to the MBUSA corporate office to make them aware of the ongoing situation with my vehicle. This is inline with "you must do whatever your feel is best" which I treat as a PFO.
I sent an explicitly clear 4-bullet point action plan to their Sales GM. The four actions proposed are intended to restore fairness and not only repair all the defects but also fix the broken 3-way relationship and trust between myself, the dealership and the manufacturer. I also set out the time frame in which I would like to receive a response.
Right after noon, I received the following reply:
Dear Mr. Xxxxxx,
The issues that you have raised are valid from your point of view but for a response before the end of this day is not one that I am willing to make.
I am afraid that I must inform you that at this point we will need additional time. If this is not acceptable to you then you must do whatever your feel is best.
We will respond in due time.
Txxxx Hxxxxx
General Sales Manager
Pre-Owned Manager
MERCEDES-BENZ OF XXXX
On my instant question "When should I expect your response?", no answer was received at all.
I’m currently preparing a letter to the MBUSA corporate office to make them aware of the ongoing situation with my vehicle. This is inline with "you must do whatever your feel is best" which I treat as a PFO.
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2008 CLK550 Cab
I'd like to see what you sent them as much as their response. No offense, but my sense from the way you have worded a lot of your posts is that you have made this more about you from their perspective than about your car.
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ML63
I do indeed understand the difference between vocabularies on social resources vs professional language in the business correspondence. I have also received some formal training and have real-life experience in the legal industry.
Consequently, and given the circumstances that have arisen, I have worded my proposal in a professional manner. The proposal is focused strictly on addressing the problems with the vehicle, not my personal issues with the dealership. When the right time comes, I may publish other relevant pieces pertaining to this story.
If you are really interested in what I sent to them, below was my communication to the dealership:
Txxxxx,
Upon detailed consideration taking into account the overall experience to date, I propose the following solution:
1. You take the vehicle you sold me back as its specification was misrepresented to me. The undisclosed substitution of the engine cover and its false representation on the paper (the sticker) is ethically unacceptable practice of a manufacturer misrepresenting or misleading a customer about the characteristics of their product.
2. You inform the factory about the serious failure in their quality control and bring the matter to their executive team for attention and appropriate action.
3. You order a new vehicle with the exact specification as the original one.
4. You will deliver the new vehicle and perform a full end-to-end inspection to ensure it has arrived with the correct specification as advertised and no defects.
You must understand that you are in the professional business where serious money and serious responsibilities come together. I find the whole cover-up scenario with the engine cover substitution and interior damages totally unacceptable. As such, I urge you to treat this incident as extremely serious and prevent escalating it to a legal issue.
I would also like to remind you that you owe me an official confirmation as to whether my vehicle does in fact have the P30 Performance motor.
Please respond within a reasonable time frame, preferably by end of day today.
FirstName
Consequently, and given the circumstances that have arisen, I have worded my proposal in a professional manner. The proposal is focused strictly on addressing the problems with the vehicle, not my personal issues with the dealership. When the right time comes, I may publish other relevant pieces pertaining to this story.
If you are really interested in what I sent to them, below was my communication to the dealership:
Txxxxx,
Upon detailed consideration taking into account the overall experience to date, I propose the following solution:
1. You take the vehicle you sold me back as its specification was misrepresented to me. The undisclosed substitution of the engine cover and its false representation on the paper (the sticker) is ethically unacceptable practice of a manufacturer misrepresenting or misleading a customer about the characteristics of their product.
2. You inform the factory about the serious failure in their quality control and bring the matter to their executive team for attention and appropriate action.
3. You order a new vehicle with the exact specification as the original one.
4. You will deliver the new vehicle and perform a full end-to-end inspection to ensure it has arrived with the correct specification as advertised and no defects.
You must understand that you are in the professional business where serious money and serious responsibilities come together. I find the whole cover-up scenario with the engine cover substitution and interior damages totally unacceptable. As such, I urge you to treat this incident as extremely serious and prevent escalating it to a legal issue.
I would also like to remind you that you owe me an official confirmation as to whether my vehicle does in fact have the P30 Performance motor.
Please respond within a reasonable time frame, preferably by end of day today.
FirstName
Last edited by Terminator2029; Dec 18, 2013 at 11:20 AM.
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CLK320, ML550, SL55, GL450
Wow, your dealership has not only dropped the ball, but they're so frigging irresponsible (to lie about the cover, scratch and chip your paint) and disrespectful that its almost unbelievable AMG would stand for this abuse of their brand.
I can only imagine if this is your first weeks of ownership, how frustrating it will be to keep the car in the long term with this dealer (assuming it will be your local service dealership in the long term).
I'd say, push for a refund. If it were me, there's no way in hell i'd rest knowing they profited from this sale at the end of the day. (Took your money, lie to you and ignore you after)
I wouldn't wait for their reply any longer. Escalate to regional/national level before your car gets too old/unreasonable for a refund.
G'luck!
I can only imagine if this is your first weeks of ownership, how frustrating it will be to keep the car in the long term with this dealer (assuming it will be your local service dealership in the long term).
I'd say, push for a refund. If it were me, there's no way in hell i'd rest knowing they profited from this sale at the end of the day. (Took your money, lie to you and ignore you after)
I wouldn't wait for their reply any longer. Escalate to regional/national level before your car gets too old/unreasonable for a refund.
G'luck!
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997 C4S; ML350
personally I would attempt to void the sale based on
a. car was misrepresented (no carbon engine cover and you cannot confirm the presence of the performance package)
b. car was sold as "new" yet had damage to the seats (attempted repair) and the paint.
I don't think there's merit to the argument that you should have inspected the car first or that you accepted it and therefore you were a willing party to the sale. After all, you purchased a new car and you shouldn't have to inspect something that is new.
OP, you seem to have a good handle on the legal system, keep us updated on your progress, or lack of
Subscribed!
a. car was misrepresented (no carbon engine cover and you cannot confirm the presence of the performance package)
b. car was sold as "new" yet had damage to the seats (attempted repair) and the paint.
I don't think there's merit to the argument that you should have inspected the car first or that you accepted it and therefore you were a willing party to the sale. After all, you purchased a new car and you shouldn't have to inspect something that is new.
OP, you seem to have a good handle on the legal system, keep us updated on your progress, or lack of
Subscribed!
Last edited by dk10438; Dec 18, 2013 at 01:54 PM.
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
Your leverage has been compromised, you excepted the vehicle in the first place and they received payment in full. The defects you now claim should be covered under ownership warranty with no questions asked. QC must be the pitts now in AL, probably "dippin" too much. Cutting wood, hunting and dippin now building MB vehicles, tell me I'm dreaming.
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997 C4S; ML350
to use an extreme example.
so you're saying that if you accepted a car that you thought was an AMG ML63 but you didn't look underneath the hood, and later you found out that it was a V6 and not the V8, you couldn't void the sale?
I'd agree it might be argued the damages to the seat and the rock chip were caused by the new owner but this was discovered shortly after the car was purchased and therefore that would be insufficient to void the sale. But on the other hand, if it were discovered shortly after the purchase then it would seem likely that this was caused by the manufacturer and subsequently repaired to be as close to new condition as possible. If that's the case, I don't think that it is appropriate to sell the car as new. How would that be in different than a car that had a scratch on a door that had to be resprayed? I certainly wouldn't pay a new car price that had a repair like that.
so you're saying that if you accepted a car that you thought was an AMG ML63 but you didn't look underneath the hood, and later you found out that it was a V6 and not the V8, you couldn't void the sale?
I'd agree it might be argued the damages to the seat and the rock chip were caused by the new owner but this was discovered shortly after the car was purchased and therefore that would be insufficient to void the sale. But on the other hand, if it were discovered shortly after the purchase then it would seem likely that this was caused by the manufacturer and subsequently repaired to be as close to new condition as possible. If that's the case, I don't think that it is appropriate to sell the car as new. How would that be in different than a car that had a scratch on a door that had to be resprayed? I certainly wouldn't pay a new car price that had a repair like that.
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
@DK, I take it you have not purchased many vehicles, all of the op issues will be covered under the warranty, the QC of the product is obvious as well as the lack of proper options, he should have little difficulty getting the car made right. The stone chip well that could happen on a round the block drive as the new owner, and if was spotted before excepting the car this too would have been rectified and probably will be touched up anyways as part of concern for good customer satisfaction.
Now as for your example, I understand it is extreme but in the case you stated that would be fraud, it would be similar to buying a badged E63 only to find out it is a E55 with bumpers and the dealer states and records it as such an E63.
You would be amazed at how many touch-ups are done to "new" cars before a buyer see them. One of the reasons most dealerships have an in house paint booth or one close by. A damaged "new" car is not sold with the dent or scratch in place at a reduced price, now is it. IMO
Now as for your example, I understand it is extreme but in the case you stated that would be fraud, it would be similar to buying a badged E63 only to find out it is a E55 with bumpers and the dealer states and records it as such an E63.
You would be amazed at how many touch-ups are done to "new" cars before a buyer see them. One of the reasons most dealerships have an in house paint booth or one close by. A damaged "new" car is not sold with the dent or scratch in place at a reduced price, now is it. IMO
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From: Alberta, Canada
'18 GLE63S AMG /'19 PORSCHE TURBO S / '09 CORVETTE ZR1 /'14 LEXUS RX350/'16 RAV4 Ltd
Unfortunately the jist of customer satisfaction thing is completely being missed here by the dealer...as we all know EVERY vehicle being a mechanical/material device has the potential of issues, problems...etc..
It's the people willing and acting to stand behind that device whether it be a ML63 or ...a hair drier...to make good the situation as to WHATEVER IS NEEDED no questions asked to satisfy the customer
I have successfully run my own business for over 30 years by using the exact situation Terminator is in as an opportunity to earn future business..word of mouth progression and use a crappy situation for my benefit. Of course I don't go looking for these circumstances but realize the potential gain from resolving such in a speedy manner with zero resistance. What a great opportunity to show your customer why they should come back to deal with you in the future and tell their friends, relatives etc why they should also....these guys are just totally missing it...and would be immediately be dismissed from my payroll........no problems.. only opporttunities
It's the people willing and acting to stand behind that device whether it be a ML63 or ...a hair drier...to make good the situation as to WHATEVER IS NEEDED no questions asked to satisfy the customer
I have successfully run my own business for over 30 years by using the exact situation Terminator is in as an opportunity to earn future business..word of mouth progression and use a crappy situation for my benefit. Of course I don't go looking for these circumstances but realize the potential gain from resolving such in a speedy manner with zero resistance. What a great opportunity to show your customer why they should come back to deal with you in the future and tell their friends, relatives etc why they should also....these guys are just totally missing it...and would be immediately be dismissed from my payroll........no problems.. only opporttunities
Last edited by Nanook; Dec 18, 2013 at 03:54 PM. Reason: edited due to dam poor grammar
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
Have never met you but would do business with you in a heart beat, it is no secret why you have been successful in business, yes customer satisfaction is near the top for continued success and the root for future business.
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997 C4S; ML350
@DK, I take it you have not purchased many vehicles, all of the op issues will be covered under the warranty, the QC of the product is obvious as well as the lack of proper options, he should have little difficulty getting the car made right. The stone chip well that could happen on a round the block drive as the new owner, and if was spotted before excepting the car this too would have been rectified and probably will be touched up anyways as part of concern for good customer satisfaction.
Now as for your example, I understand it is extreme but in the case you stated that would be fraud, it would be similar to buying a badged E63 only to find out it is a E55 with bumpers and the dealer states and records it as such an E63.
You would be amazed at how many touch-ups are done to "new" cars before a buyer see them. One of the reasons most dealerships have an in house paint booth or one close by. A damaged "new" car is not sold with the dent or scratch in place at a reduced price, now is it. IMO
Now as for your example, I understand it is extreme but in the case you stated that would be fraud, it would be similar to buying a badged E63 only to find out it is a E55 with bumpers and the dealer states and records it as such an E63.
You would be amazed at how many touch-ups are done to "new" cars before a buyer see them. One of the reasons most dealerships have an in house paint booth or one close by. A damaged "new" car is not sold with the dent or scratch in place at a reduced price, now is it. IMO
The OP purchased a car that had an option it was listed on the spec sheet and when he got home it wasn't there and he wasn't made aware that it wasn't there so how is it not "fraud"? The dealership then told OP that it was a different type of carbon fiber (yeah right). You're going to tell me that wasn't deceitful? The only difference is the degree of the discrepancy. In the OP case, it can be rectified whereas you can't really change an E55 into a E63. So that's not a warranty issue. It's a misrepresentation issue. Other stuff might be a QC problem or it might have been an active attempt to disguise some damage that occurred during manufacturing or delivery and I did say that it would be more difficult to void the sale based on that.
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
Well I guess that neither of us has seen the offending engine cover, so it will be up to MB to finalize the ops request for the "right" carbon fiber engine cover, for all we know a tech in AL put the wrong cover on the vehicle and the dealer does not know the difference, but this will be worked out. Maybe best to buy a German vehicle made in Germany, who knows. Personally if it goes much further the OP should find another ML and take a picture of the cover for further evidence if needed to prove it is in fact the wrong cover. No offense intended.
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From: Alberta, Canada
'18 GLE63S AMG /'19 PORSCHE TURBO S / '09 CORVETTE ZR1 /'14 LEXUS RX350/'16 RAV4 Ltd
I mean...come on..what could it really cost the dealer to make this situation good ?... a few hundred bucks maybe ?...disgusting people have such egos
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2013 ML550
Nanook has the right idea... The fact that the OP is having to deal with this attitude of indifference from the dealership is disgraceful regardless of the price of the vehicle. A perfect example is how I've been treated by my dealership. I've had far too many problems in the first 15 months of ownership with my ML550 but every time I go in I'm treated excellent, new loaner and an apology. Because of their treatment I would definitely consider another MB. The OP's treatment is deplorable.
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Joined: Oct 2011
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997 C4S; ML350
Unfortunately the jist of customer satisfaction thing is completely being missed here by the dealer...as we all know EVERY vehicle being a mechanical/material device has the potential of issues, problems...etc..
It's the people willing and acting to stand behind that device whether it be a ML63 or ...a hair drier...to make good the situation as to WHATEVER IS NEEDED no questions asked to satisfy the customer
I have successfully run my own business for over 30 years by using the exact situation Terminator is in as an opportunity to earn future business..word of mouth progression and use a crappy situation for my benefit. Of course I don't go looking for these circumstances but realize the potential gain from resolving such in a speedy manner with zero resistance. What a great opportunity to show your customer why they should come back to deal with you in the future and tell their friends, relatives etc why they should also....these guys are just totally missing it...and would be immediately be dismissed from my payroll........no problems.. only opporttunities
It's the people willing and acting to stand behind that device whether it be a ML63 or ...a hair drier...to make good the situation as to WHATEVER IS NEEDED no questions asked to satisfy the customer
I have successfully run my own business for over 30 years by using the exact situation Terminator is in as an opportunity to earn future business..word of mouth progression and use a crappy situation for my benefit. Of course I don't go looking for these circumstances but realize the potential gain from resolving such in a speedy manner with zero resistance. What a great opportunity to show your customer why they should come back to deal with you in the future and tell their friends, relatives etc why they should also....these guys are just totally missing it...and would be immediately be dismissed from my payroll........no problems.. only opporttunities
missed opportunity
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ML63
Folks,
Thanks for the continued healthy and interactive dialog. I wanted to comment on a coupe of things:
1. The stone chip was found when I inspected the car at the dealer’s premises. Me being reasonable and having considered the weigh scale on which major and minor issues constitute themselves, I pointed the sales rep to the deficiency and still accepted the car. I can repair it myself should this be needed; this is not a big deal.
2.The fact that the car is missing one component (which is, by the way, an extra cost option) may or may not be an indicator of a larger scale problem. Who can guarantee that something else is not misplaced/replaced/absent? I have asked for a confirmation last Thursday whether my engine is in fact a 550-hp power plant, and I received no acknowledgement to date.
I’m not b.i.t.c.h.ing about a chip or scratch. I don’t even need an apology from the AMG product management for the engine cover f…iasco. All I’m looking for is some common sense and some evidence of mature adults who sell exclusive MB AMG cars standing behind their words.
At the end of the day, we are all humans, people who understand the importance of a friendly conversation over a cup of coffee or something stronger. Did they offer me to come and discuss the situation in person? No, as they don’t seem to care.
PS: No response from the dealership as of 2.00pm local time.
Thanks for the continued healthy and interactive dialog. I wanted to comment on a coupe of things:
1. The stone chip was found when I inspected the car at the dealer’s premises. Me being reasonable and having considered the weigh scale on which major and minor issues constitute themselves, I pointed the sales rep to the deficiency and still accepted the car. I can repair it myself should this be needed; this is not a big deal.
2.The fact that the car is missing one component (which is, by the way, an extra cost option) may or may not be an indicator of a larger scale problem. Who can guarantee that something else is not misplaced/replaced/absent? I have asked for a confirmation last Thursday whether my engine is in fact a 550-hp power plant, and I received no acknowledgement to date.
I’m not b.i.t.c.h.ing about a chip or scratch. I don’t even need an apology from the AMG product management for the engine cover f…iasco. All I’m looking for is some common sense and some evidence of mature adults who sell exclusive MB AMG cars standing behind their words.
At the end of the day, we are all humans, people who understand the importance of a friendly conversation over a cup of coffee or something stronger. Did they offer me to come and discuss the situation in person? No, as they don’t seem to care.
PS: No response from the dealership as of 2.00pm local time.
Last edited by Terminator2029; Dec 18, 2013 at 04:59 PM.
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From: Alberta, Canada
'18 GLE63S AMG /'19 PORSCHE TURBO S / '09 CORVETTE ZR1 /'14 LEXUS RX350/'16 RAV4 Ltd
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From: Alberta, Canada
'18 GLE63S AMG /'19 PORSCHE TURBO S / '09 CORVETTE ZR1 /'14 LEXUS RX350/'16 RAV4 Ltd
Three quick pics...star is held in place with expoy adhesive looks like...not removeable..and a note when removing cover ensure you grasp directly under the clip locations and pull up as the clips can be difficult and locked into the slot as I had one pull away from the cover..I reattached with crazy glue
Last edited by Nanook; Dec 18, 2013 at 05:16 PM.
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ML63
Wow! I didn't realize that the AMG engineering Rock Star's badge is also attached to the cover. Not surprising why it is going to take weeks (if not months) before a replacement cover is available in my situation.
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From: Alberta, Canada
'18 GLE63S AMG /'19 PORSCHE TURBO S / '09 CORVETTE ZR1 /'14 LEXUS RX350/'16 RAV4 Ltd
Yes the cover is an actual REAL CF layup with a nice deep urethane finish..I heard they were hard to come by at one time with supply issues..I would bet replacement at our cost +300
