Long story, but shopping for a vehicle for my father. Trying to replace his Escalade that was stolen. Currently looking at a 2013 ML550. About 80k miles. Priced a bit under book. From a dealer but only 90 day warranty.

I'm concerned about reliability, cost of ownership and longevity. I've never owned a Mercedes before. Have had VW and had catastrophic failure. Leery about German engineering.

I do all my own work/service and that won't change with the MB if we get it. I know parts are much more expensive than the American luxury I'm used to. I know service intervals will need to be more frequent with less room for deviation on schedule.

The thing has so much power. Drives really nice. Seems like a solid machine.

I figured no better place to get an honest opinion than a forum

 

Hi and welcome!

You've pick a great community to start asking questions. I'm going to move your post to a forum for opinions from current owners. Good luck!

Bob

 

I think if these are your top three concerns, you might be better off with another non-German brand. Perhaps something from Lexus?

Mercedes reliability is average, at best - this varies across model lines - but the cost of ownership tends to be well above average. I've loved Benz for my entire life and have owned 5, but that doesn't mean I will recommend them to just anyone.

 

You are right the 550 V8 has outstanding power. They quit make the 550 model in 2014 but still have a V8 in their top performance models. I would love to have a 550 just for the sound and engine. I have a ML350(2015) and it has the V6. It has over 60,000 miles and has been trouble free ( still on original brakes/pads and battery) Of course I would like to have the 550 but long term cost will be less for the V6 and it has plenty of power, just not sexy like a rumbling V8. Even the V6 has approx 7,000 towing capability.

If you are mechanically incline either would probably work for you but I can vouch for a ML350.

Cost will be more for German but if you do the work yourself it manageable . Good luck

 

What he said, exactly. Be aware that routine maintenance at the Dealer is expensive.

 

@Jbtyson Welcome! If operating cost and reliability are concerning to you, don't buy a Mercedes. I agree with @LILBENZ230 . I would rate Mercedes' reliability as "below average". Maybe even "far below average".

If that doesn't scare you away, stick with the gasoline V6 engines, as new and low mileage as your budget allows. The M276 3.5L gasoline V6 naturally aspirated (non-turbo) is one of the more reliable engines from Mercedes in the past 5-10 years. The M276 3.0L gasoline V6 twin turbo is also good, although more complex because of turbo hardware and potentially shorter lifespan because more power is coming from the engine.

Under no circumstances buy a diesel Mercedes, because of reliability. Google is your friend on this.

 

I have been trying several vehicles and the luxury suv market is blah without spending big money.

Lexus is so ridiculously overpriced used. And they're small. I've driven a couple.
2015 Nx200t - tiny little non impressive turbo car with 80k miles for over $20k.
2010 Rx450h - ugly, but functional boring machine. 135k miles for $15k.
2007 rx400h a number of problems with 117,000 miles for $7500.

Audi I like because of familiarity with the VW platform. But they always seem to be selling $3-5k over book value.
2010 q7 TDI with 63k miles for $19k. I like this one, but feel it's overpriced, and frankly not as nice looking as the ML550.
2015 q5 2.0 turbo with 75k miles for $20k. Surprisingly underpowered compared to my 08 passat 2.0t.

Porsche - have tested 3 cayennes. All priced $2-4k over book. They all ride terrible and are a little tight inside. So these have been removed from the list.

2012 ml350 bluetec and wasn't impressed. I won't be looking at diesels. I haven't tried any of the v6 gas motors but I think likely they'll be underpowered for expectations.


We are big people. The ML550 is about as small as I'd like to go cab wise.

 

Be careful with the Q7 TDI. It has the VW Dieselgate powertrain. Problematic and costly like the Mercedes Bluetec. If you find a "fixed" Q7 (they exist), beware that the performance will not be what it was when new. If you don't have a reference point for the original performance, and find the "fixed" performance acceptable, then it might be OK for you.

If you need/want interior space, have a look at the GL/GLS. The V8 is available up to model year 2014, if I am not mistaken.

 

The GL would work, I just haven't found any that are in the budget and reasonable here.

We don't have diesel emissions where I live and I have zero qualms about tuning away the DPF and EGR if I were to buy a TDI. I wasn't impressed with the Bluetec enough to keep looking for those. I personally have driven diesel trucks exclusively for the last decade and frankly am unimpressed by 90% of the gas vehicles I drive compared to my tuned diesel trucks. My current truck is less impressive performance-wise, but economical. 2015 Ram 1500 Ecodiesel. I average about 22mpg with 50/50 town/highway driving. On road trips I can get 27-28mpg at 65 mph. I am GDE tuned and deleted. I have the Laramie with all the options, including air ride. My truck rides smoother than all of the luxury SUVs we have tested, performs as well as all of them other than the ML550 and has MUCH more cargo space and still carries 5 people. I would like to give my dad my truck and buy myself another Cummins Mega Cab, but he doesn't want a truck.

My dad is older and mostly uses his vehicle to take care of his mom who is almost 90. So comfort and accessibility are ultimately the main function. A mini van would make the most sense....but he worked hard his whole life, drove terrible beater work trucks and only in the last 5 years started buying some nicer things to try to enjoy. He wants a Mercedes, Porsche, Lexus, Audi, Cadillac because they are names. After having nothing good for so long, when he was forced to retire being disabled, he wanted a nice vehicle that he could be proud of, but had pretty limited funds. So we found him the Cadillac which was a bit higher mileage, needed a couple things, but after I spent some time on it, was the treat he wanted for himself. When they stole it a couple weeks ago, it just tore him up. And financially, he can't afford anything more than a few thousand dollars, so I'm trying to step in and see what I can do within my financial ability to get him another something to be proud of.

I know German vehicles are troublesome sometimes and costly. But I don't pay anyone to do any work on anything other than charging A/C as I don't have that license or machine work as I don't have a full machine shop. But beyond that, I do all work to all of my vehicles, so I don't worry about maintenance items being expensive at dealers. I don't like parts being terribly expensive or lack of availability, but I can work with it if I have to, to appease him in his later years. I need something I can count on for him to drive to the gym, take to doctors appointments, and maybe once or twice a year drive a couple thousand miles for a family road trip.

I guess I'm amongst the minority, as people that buy Mercedes can typically afford to pay someone else to do everything else for them. That isn't me. So are there any other wrenches that can attest to the difficulty of owning one of these ML550s? Availability of parts either NOS or second hand? And for those who just drive them, what sort of miles do you start seeing significant problems? In my world, 80k miles is nothing. I sold my last truck at 315k and still got almost $10k for it. But, a Mercedes isn't a Duramax.

 

Do you have emission test in where you live? If not, i will recommend ml350 diesel with dof delete. Lots of power, super fuel efficiency. Check out my build thread ultimate family hauler. I got for around 20k CAD and put approximately 40k km on it so far

 

Emissions on gas vehicles, but not diesel...currently. We did for a bit, but they took it away strangely enough. I'll try and find your build thread. The ML350 Bluetec I drove was nice other than the price/mileage value. Power wise it was not even remotely comparable to the 3.0TDI though, and not even remotely comparable to the ML550 with the bi-turbo V8

 

The build thread is like 2nd one on the main page. Mine has 330hp and 520 torque. It not too far from your ml 550.

 

Found your thread. Reading through. I wish there were a tuned bluetec for sale nearby to test and see how I feel about it. Unfortunately, there are only a handful of bluetec vehicles for sale at all that I can find.

 

@Jbtyson I do as much maintenance and repair work DIY as possible. Parts availability is good, no problems there. Parts prices are higher than average, because of the three pointed star. Mercedes have a few major issues that can occur, and they are not 100% predictable on mileage or model year. Things like piston scuffing, valve guide failure, timing chain tensioners, and transmission conductor plate (electro hydraulic control unit) failure. These things, which are DIY-able, are expensive, time consuming and require significant effort. The issues I mentioned above have been known to happen on the M157/M278 4.7L and 5.5L V8 gasoline engine. They aren't guaranteed, but they happen. Search this site as part of your due diligence.

If you are open to a V6 gasoline powertrain, have a look at an ML350 or ML400. These engines have above-average reliability for a Mercedes.

 

Most plp that did the tune probably wont sell the vehicle. We get such a good mpg and amazing power. From i read, ml 550 have 402 hp and 440 torque. I honestly don't think you can dust me if we r a drag race. Plus, the fuel cost for the vehicle will be like half. I did a mpg test today. My computer show i can do another 1470km after i drove 100km. I doubt i will get that, but 1200km a tank shouldn't be an issue if i don't drive like an idiot

 

And man, if you think 300k miles is a lot, most of the sprinter can do way more. I am bias , but people trash BlueTEC it because the emission bs. Once the emission are off, and there are only few problems to look after. I currently own 2 BlueTEC, and both of them have dpf deleted done. They work amazing with exceptional mileage. Personally, i hate paying for a thirsty engine. If you go with 550, the amount of money to spend on fuel will be unreal. In terms of maintenance, use fcp euro, they offer life time replacement for all parts they sell.

 

I’ve been an ML owner for a short time but I’ve driven two C-class sedans for the past 7 years. I religiously took them to a Euro specialist and save for one broken fanbelt at 190k, they’ve been dead reliable.

if you’re worried abt maintenance and reliability, I would suggest the NA 350. It has a more powerful version of the the motor in my C300, which has been great. My mechanic also recommended the 350 as being simpler and stout.

I believe the 550 has the airmatic suspension which adds to the complexity.

 

I REALLY appreciate this answer. Specific items for me to look into. After some reading, seems some of those issues are specific to certain engine numbers so I need to find that out and match to the TSB. I would expect parts to cost more due to brand.

Frankly don't think he would be drag racing his SUV, but I guess if I ever spin it around I could give someone a run lol. Seriously though, I have a soft spot for diesel myself, and if the Bluetec is less problematic outside of the emissions system issues, I'd be more inclined to consider them. In my experience with diesel trucks, parts are twice as expensive, and fuel costs/MPG savings aren't as much as people would like to think if they actually log everything.

I am obsessive about tracking efficiency and costs with my vehicles. In 21 months of owning my current truck, I've driven 73,245 miles and spent $12,301 on fuel, repairs and maintenance. Not a penny of that has gone to any shop fees so I save a lot there. 30% more if I paid a shop to do all my work if I had to guess. But if I were to be driving the exact same truck but in the gas model, I wouldn't have had to spend thousands on deleting it to take care of emissions failures (Chrysler did the same as the VW auto group here), and I could have been paying $0.30 less per gallon for fuel, but probably using 20% more fuel, costing me about $600 more over the course of 21 months - so a savings of about $30/month...or less than I spend on coffee in a week. Lots of factors go into deciding the worth of a diesel, and frankly, if you aren't using them to tow there isn't much of a practical reason for them. But...I still enjoy mine and thoroughly miss the fun factor of the trucks I had before. This little 3.0L Ecodiesel I have now has taken much of the joy of driving away. I'm all about SMILES PER GALLON, not MILES PER GALLON. I spend too many hours in my vehicles to not enjoy it. My father isn't me, but if it is my money, same principles apply.

With that rant I come to my point that I wouldn't pick a Bluetec over a 4.7 Bi-turbo for the efficiency factor. If the reliability were better, fun were similar or the same, and longevity better, then sure why not. But not to save a Jefferson every couple weeks.

I've been searching on here and another forum and find mostly people that are really happy with the ML550. A handful with the catastrophic issues mentioned above, but overall happy and say that the m278 is one of the best motors they've had in a MB. Talking me into it, but I'm cautiously optimistic.

I'd love Camry Reliability and Lamborghini performance with a Rolls Royce ride, but I am trying to be reasonable with my expectations!

From what I've been reading, most 550's don't have the airmatic suspension. And I don't see a button for it in the pictures, so I'm guessing this one doesn't that I am looking at. Frankly though, I'd be happy if it did. Those shocks can be sourced reasonably second hand, and don't seem any more complex to replace than any suspension component. And I'm not opposed to a custom aftermarket bagging if that were a better option anyway.

 

plus two with this post. I had a ML350 W4 for 3 years, it was trouble free, but it was my daily driver for 3 years, relatively was trouble free. The only thing i would recommend is dont make it your daily driver

 

I've been driving Mercedes vehicles for 25+ years and I drive them for their safety and comfort.

I get a chuckle from people who drive Mercedes and complain about the cost.

A bit like buying a Rolls Royce and complaining about the cost of services.

I can do my own work if I wish but I have better things to do with my time so send the ML out for service. Same with my wife's SLK55.

It's simple suck in the cost of ownership and enjoy the car. You can't take your money with you when you fall off the perch.

 

I'm not sure the ML550 is good for you. I'm not convinced I would buy one myself. I've seen a few with oil in the engine wiring harness, damaged valve seats, and timing chain issues. All require the powertrain to be dropped from the bottom, a lot of work, and some serious money for new cylinder heads, and under 90k miles. The ML350 (gas) is very reliable in comparison. Stay far away from any MB diesel built after 2006...even with a delete. It's just not worth it. There is the older ML550 which is a great SUV, but hard to find and now getting old since 2011 was the last production. The 2008-2011 ML350's are also great, I own 2 of them, but it's a V6. Power is "ok" with the 7 speed transmission. They come in 2wd or AWD versions. They mostly have spring suspension too. I really get the feeling the ML550 is gonna be a gamble for you, and certainly wouldn't expect to see one ever reach 300k miles.

 

@Jbtyson This is the best post so far.

You seem to have a penchant for diesel vehicles. Do not under any circumstances by a Mercedes diesel, even with a tune and delete. It's throwing good money after bad, plus the time and headache factor. I can speak to the V6 gasoline reliability, it's above average for Mercedes. Mercedes is, on average, far below average in the reliability arena.

 

This would be his daily driver. His only vehicle. Now honestly, he is retired so it isn't like he's going to get fired for not showing up if a vehicle is giving him trouble, but ultimately, I'd like to not be getting calls to come tow the thing on the regular.

Sounds like your time is worth more than mine. Care to share any secrets there? Or is the secret not to share? I'd love to be able to send my vehicles out to have someone else deal with problems. On my last Duramax, transmission case split on me. I ordered a used unit from eBay, swapped them out with help from a buddy in about 10 hours. My cost - $800 and a weekend. Had I dropped it at a shop when I saw some strange fluid leaking from underneath the middle of the truck - I'd have been out $4k. I'm not worth $400/hr. I'm not worth $400/day unfortunately. So I make decisions to try and dabble in your world with used vehicles and working on my own stuff. You know, get a taste of how the other half lives.

Appreciate the info. Yeah, I wouldn't expect for it to see another 220k miles without issues. My old man is in his early 60s. I'd say realistically he probably has about 10 years of driving left in him, give or take a few. At an average of 10k a year which is probably a bit high of an estimate. So could it make it to 180k without massive failure? That is my hope. I've found several replacement power plants for around $3-5k. I don't like that number, but I don't hate it. Sure it isn't a chevy 6.0L that I can grab at a junk yard for $300 bucks, but it isn't astronomical. I don't currently have a vehicle lift, so if it has to be dropped out the bottom, then I guess that would be an excuse to buy a new toy, but another $2k expense.

The used market is rough here. Price for a ML350 with a v6 and 80k miles is the same or more than this ml550 with the v8 bi-turbo. So trade a little more reliability for the benefits...I don't know if that is worth it.

You're right. My preference is diesel. But I'll take the advice and not look at them. There are a handful of bluetec ML350 with about 120k miles in the $10k range in the area. Half the price, but if they really are that bad, then I'll leave them alone. I was supposed to go check out a 2007 ML350 CDI today, but the guy never got back with me.

I guess reliability is probably somewhat subjective too. A typical Mercedes owner might pull over and get towed for an unknown engine light and leave it at a shop for a week to the tune of a thousand dollars for something like a failed MAF and some fluids being swapped in the name of maintenance. Where I'd be getting it home and fixing it myself for $60. I wonder if more handy people owned them if their perceived reliability would be considered better. Not a Toyota, but better.

 

Get a 2015 ML350. Engine size is enough and the car has plenty of space. With proper tires this suv rides great and is very quite going down the road. No air suspension to worry about. Does not cost a fortune to run and will last. Mine has been 100% reliable.

 

That particular year, I've only found one for sale and it is 3 hours from me and about $3k more than the ML550 which is already at the top of my budget.

The car dealer that has the ML550 let me know that it went to the MB service shop for a check engine light I guess. Underboost code. They didn't give me a specific number. Dealer said bad battery and replaced that and they're seeing about diagnostics after that to see what else it may be. Honestly, I'm still considering it. I know everyone is beating me here for it, which I expected to some extent. If I were able to find another nice cadillac or a lexus that fit the bill, I'd move on from it, but frankly, in my market, nothing else is priced reasonable in the luxury SUV market within my budget.