Hill Holder?
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From: San Jose area
'19 E63S sedan
Hill Holder?
I was stopped at a light going up a moderate hill recently in the W220, and when I let off the brake the car started to drift backwards. I'm pretty sure that it used to hold pretty much in place while I moved from brake to gas, but now it rolls back like it's in neutral.
Am I remembering wrong? If it is supposed to hold, what does it? Is it a transmission function? Torque converter? The idle seems to be the same as always.
Am I remembering wrong? If it is supposed to hold, what does it? Is it a transmission function? Torque converter? The idle seems to be the same as always.
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From: Sydney, Australia
190D 2.5 (x2), 190E 2.6, W202 C240,W202 C43 (C55), W210 E55, W212 E250CDI
In a W220 the hill hold function is performed by the transmission (5 speed, but not the 7 speed).
The hill hold is "activated" when the transmission mode selector is in position "W" or "C" depending on what you have (they are the same thing).
It's something that is a by-product on the 5 speed transmission design, not a specific function of the vehicle.
Most current models have this fuction automaticly and electronicly perfromed by the ABS pump regardless of transmission type
The hill hold is "activated" when the transmission mode selector is in position "W" or "C" depending on what you have (they are the same thing).
It's something that is a by-product on the 5 speed transmission design, not a specific function of the vehicle.
Most current models have this fuction automaticly and electronicly perfromed by the ABS pump regardless of transmission type
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From: San Diego, CA & San Jose, Costa Rica & Stuttgart, Germany
1959 220S / 1979 230 G / 2002 A210 AMG / 2003 C320 SC / 2004.5 C320 SS / 2005 ML350 SE / 2008 smart
interesting, because in both my C-Classes - 2003 and 2004.5 w/ auto 5-speed transmission - I get this roll-back every time. I just assumed it was a Mercedes-Benz quirk.
If this is not normal, will warranty work fix this ????
Carlos
Saprissa@aol.com
If this is not normal, will warranty work fix this ????
Carlos
Saprissa@aol.com
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 4,278
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From: San Jose area
'19 E63S sedan
In a W220 the hill hold function is performed by the transmission (5 speed, but not the 7 speed).
The hill hold is "activated" when the transmission mode selector is in position "W" or "C" depending on what you have (they are the same thing).
It's something that is a by-product on the 5 speed transmission design, not a specific function of the vehicle.
Most current models have this fuction automaticly and electronicly perfromed by the ABS pump regardless of transmission type
The hill hold is "activated" when the transmission mode selector is in position "W" or "C" depending on what you have (they are the same thing).
It's something that is a by-product on the 5 speed transmission design, not a specific function of the vehicle.
Most current models have this fuction automaticly and electronicly perfromed by the ABS pump regardless of transmission type
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,152
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From: Sydney, Australia
190D 2.5 (x2), 190E 2.6, W202 C240,W202 C43 (C55), W210 E55, W212 E250CDI
Does it still roll back when in W or C mode?
Thread Starter
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From: San Jose area
'19 E63S sedan
I'll have to see. I'm in S 95% of the time. The other 5% I use M. I don't think I've used C on this car once. I have used it briefly on my previous S55 in bad weather, but our roads are dry 10 months a year and I just feather the throttle if the roads are wet.
Why would it matter? Does starting in second affect the operation of the hill hold function?
Perhaps I missed the first time that you're saying it's not an S-mode feature. That's odd because I'm sure it's held hills before and I only use S.
Why would it matter? Does starting in second affect the operation of the hill hold function?
Perhaps I missed the first time that you're saying it's not an S-mode feature. That's odd because I'm sure it's held hills before and I only use S.
Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 110
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From: irvine,ca
09 E350 ,
does it have a 722.6 or 722.9?,the 722.9 doe's not have free wheel units so they do roll back ,if it is a 722.6 they have two freewheel units, (sprag gears) that hold from rolling back,do you have any harsh engagement in any gears? if so it probably is the freewheel units going bad,slipping on the hollow shaft .
I'll have to see. I'm in S 95% of the time. The other 5% I use M. I don't think I've used C on this car once. I have used it briefly on my previous S55 in bad weather, but our roads are dry 10 months a year and I just feather the throttle if the roads are wet.
Why would it matter? Does starting in second affect the operation of the hill hold function?
Perhaps I missed the first time that you're saying it's not an S-mode feature. That's odd because I'm sure it's held hills before and I only use S.
Why would it matter? Does starting in second affect the operation of the hill hold function?
Perhaps I missed the first time that you're saying it's not an S-mode feature. That's odd because I'm sure it's held hills before and I only use S.
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Sydney, Australia
190D 2.5 (x2), 190E 2.6, W202 C240,W202 C43 (C55), W210 E55, W212 E250CDI
When a 722.6 is in second gear then the arrangement of the sprag clutches prevent the transmission from turning backwards. When in first gear the transmission can turn backwards but if there is sufficient input torque then the vehilce is held still by the force being generated by the engine.
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New S-Class (W221)
W221 rolling back, too
I have the same issue on a W221, the car rolls back like it would be in neutral when I stop on a moderate hill. This happens in C mode as well as in S mode. I spoke to my Mercedes dealer and they claim it's normal (!). They told me this would not happin in S-mode, but it does. They also showed me the Hill Assist (pressing the break down further while standing on the hill activates the "Hold" function).
Obviously the "Hold" function is a work-around for the problem, but I have a hard time believing that it is notmal for the car to roll back on a hill (e.g. makes it really difficult to drive up-hill in a crowded parking garage).
Is this really a "quirk" of the "best luxury car in the world", or is my dealer trying to avoid having to repair this under warranty?
I am inclined to place a call into Stuttgart to find out, but wanted to check if anybody that has experienced the same issue went to the bottom of it.
Obviously the "Hold" function is a work-around for the problem, but I have a hard time believing that it is notmal for the car to roll back on a hill (e.g. makes it really difficult to drive up-hill in a crowded parking garage).
Is this really a "quirk" of the "best luxury car in the world", or is my dealer trying to avoid having to repair this under warranty?
I am inclined to place a call into Stuttgart to find out, but wanted to check if anybody that has experienced the same issue went to the bottom of it.
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'17 Jaguar XF
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From: Sydney, Australia
190D 2.5 (x2), 190E 2.6, W202 C240,W202 C43 (C55), W210 E55, W212 E250CDI
No, The 722.9 (7 speed) has no sprag clutchs (one way freewheels) so the transmission can turn in the opposite direction.
Remember that the idle speeds of the modern engines are only 500-600rpm in gear to help save fuel so there isn't much force to counteract the weight of the vehicle on a hill. rolling back with a 7 speed in normal. Thats why some have brake hold function and some has the delayed brake release (1-2 seconds before releasing the brakes) when on hills.
Remember that the idle speeds of the modern engines are only 500-600rpm in gear to help save fuel so there isn't much force to counteract the weight of the vehicle on a hill. rolling back with a 7 speed in normal. Thats why some have brake hold function and some has the delayed brake release (1-2 seconds before releasing the brakes) when on hills.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2003
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From: San Diego, CA & San Jose, Costa Rica & Stuttgart, Germany
1959 220S / 1979 230 G / 2002 A210 AMG / 2003 C320 SC / 2004.5 C320 SS / 2005 ML350 SE / 2008 smart
