** New Tire Review: Continental ExtremeContact DW, 315/35/20 ! **
06-15-2015, 06:45 PM
#1
Super Member
Thread Starter
** New Tire Review: Continental ExtremeContact DW, 315/35/20 ! **
New Tire Review of the ExtremeContact DW (Size 315/35/20, yes 315s)
The pros/cons have been provided up front, with the full indepth report after. Photo Comparison of the two tires also provided at the end for reference:
Pros:
Background:
Over the past few months I have been busy with other projects and have not been able to post my upgrades/mods in this sectionas much as I have loved doing in the past. Having updated almost everything humanly possible on the ML63, it became clear there weren't many options left on how to extract more of the cars performance potential. The one major Achilles heel left was Tires. With so many other upgrades done to the car, it became clear the 540 treadwear Continental DWS tires were simple outmatched.
Although the Continental ExtremeContact DWS are decent overall all season tires (not to be confused with the DW I am reviewing), they are predominantly an all weather tire with an emphasis on snow regions. This is not to diminish their performance, which were a massive improvement from the terrible stock OEM CrossContact UHPs that came on the car from the factory. However, I always felt like the car had so much more potential if the right set of rubber would be installed on the car.
After reviewing many possible options, I realized that there are no truly great tires in the 295/40/20 size range. Therefore, I began researching other viable options for drastically improving the performance of the ML. Since my car has 10.5" wide Forgestars on it (versus the stock 10" width) it gave me more flexibility to upgrade to a wider size. The 295 DWS tires always seemed to be a tad bit narrow for the 10.5" rim so I wanted to upgrade to a wider size to give the car the absolute maximum grip possible, while giving it a much meatier stance.
After more research, I came to the conclusion that the 315mm width would be ideal as long as I could confirm if they fit. After checking the clearances I took a gamble and order the 315/35/20s. Notice how I dropped down one tire profile size from 40 down to 35 to compensate for the higher width of the tire. This does make the tire slightly smaller overall diameter compared to the 295/40s, but its only 0.7" diameter change (barely noticeable with the meatier wider stance. A 315/40 would be WAY too tall, so the drop to 35 is a necessary one.
Fitment:
Surprisingly the tires fit perfectly. They sit flush on the wheels and have a perfectly vertical side wall. As continentals tend to run a bit narrow, the 315 is a perfect fit. Fortunately when I ordered my Forgestars I opted for a lower 40mm offset (versus stock 46mm offset). These tires probably would not have fit with the 46mm offset, 40mm is as high as I would go. There is about a 1.5x finger gap between the inside of the tire and the wheel hub assembly spindle arm. You don't ever want to go less than this as tires can deform under extreme performance situations so having some wiggle room is important. Remember, these will not fit on stock wheels, these for aftermarket wheels 10.5" with 40mm offset or lower (further out). Zero rubbing anywhere on fenders (no where near close to rubbing). Will post photos later when I get a chance to do a proper photoshoot.
Ride Quality:
I was expecting these 315/35/20 DW tires to run harsher than their all season brother DWS, but the opposite actually ended up being true. Not only is the compound softer (read: grippier), but the tires seem to absorb expansion joints much better and corners much better than before.
Weather/Wet:
One thing I never liked about the DWS (although still better than the stock UHPs), was the fact that they had a tendency to hydroplane in heavy standing water. Perhaps this is because of their snow-biased tread pattern. If you compare the DWS & DW tread patterns you can clearly see the DW has far superior wet channeling grooves than the DWS. Although 315s are a massive tire and it will be impossible to eliminate it all together simply because it is such a massively wide tire, the hydroplaning has been reduced by a good 80-90%.
These tires are simply fantastic in the wet. In fact, The Continental DW are the fastest tire in the wet for ANY max performance tire on the market (yes they are even faster than the Michelin Pilot Super Sports in the wet on lap times). So as far as it comes to wet safety... I would argue these are the best tires on the market.
Dry Performance:
I cannot express into words what a massive jump in performance these tires have given the ML63. Not only is the compound massively more grippy (340 vs. 540 treadwear of the DWS), but the overall contact patch with the road has grown by over 80mm in width!! I would argue the jump from DWS to DW is significantly greater than even the jump from the stock UHPs to DWS.
The absolute performance limit of the car has truly been transformed. The 315s at the front have completely wiped out all understeer, and the much larger contact patch at the rear has eliminated almost all lift-off oversteer at the rear. In essence, the massive jump up in raw mechanical grip has simply made it a much more stable platform. One of my concerns was the fear of tipping/rolling over would be increased with such a huge jump in raw grip, however so far these concerns have been unjustified.
Straight line braking is probably the biggest improvement given the extensive long list of brake upgrades I have performed on the vehicle. For the first time ever, I am finally able to use 100% of the braking power from my RacingBrake rotors/lines/fluid setup in addition to the massive weight reduction from the Forgestar wheels. It genuinely feels like you are throwing an anchor out the window at full max threshold braking. Before, ABS would kick in at higher speeds if you used too much braking power because the DWS tires simply could not handle the massive brakes at full force. In doing so it would cause to car to dart quickly in multiple directions as all 4 corners fought for grip. With the new setup, you can simply mash on the brake pedal and all 4 corners working together to bring you down to a stop in the most stable sure-footed way possible. By increasing the raw mechanical grip so much, the ABS window is now at a much wider margin so it interferes much less (if any at all).
Steering Feedback / Feel:
I never realized just how much steering feedback and feel was being robbed by the 40 series profile tire until I switched to these new 315/35s. The steering feel has improved so much, it genuinely feels like I put a tighter ratio steering rack & pinion in the car (no exaggeration). It almost feels like the CLK63 black series in some ways (although not extreme). Before, there would always be a bit of a dead spot in the steering at top dead center, however, now that has been completely removed. Even turning the wheel 1/2" in either direction will produce immediate feedback at the wheels. The turn-in is precise, sharp, and reactive. In some ways this can make the steering feel more "alert", though not to the point of being hyper sensitive or darty. This change alone has made me fall in love with the car all over again and I have decided to keep my ML63 longer. It really does feel like a whole new car now.
Price: Only a $22 price increase for everything I have listed, No-brainer
Weight:
Absolutely ZERO weight penalty also for all the benefits I have mentioned. Also because the tires are technically 0.7" smaller in diameter, these tires also give the car a slightly improved acceleration gearing which has actually produced a noticed result in acceleration. Its not drastic but you do notice it. I honestly though it would have zero effect, but I have noticed the car feels "peppier" since the upgrade.
Conclusion:
This tire upgrade is such a massive improvement that I would almost call it 100% mandatory. If you don't have upgraded lighter wheels yet, this is by far the best excuse to go ahead and get a set of Forgestars (or similarly light wheel). Not only will it give the car a MUCH more aggressive stance, but it will actually make your car ride smoother, perform & handle better, and actually make your car much safer as well.
Win-Win in every regard
The pros/cons have been provided up front, with the full indepth report after. Photo Comparison of the two tires also provided at the end for reference:
Pros:
- 80mm MORE tire contact patch width
- Insane grip in the dry
- Superior wet grip due to improved rain grooves in tread pattern
- Less susceptible to hydroplaning compared to DWS
- Ride quality much smoother b/c of softer compound
- ZERO weight penalty for 20mm wider tire (DWS 295 & DW 315 both weigh 35lbs each)
- Much sharper turn-in steering response, feels like totally new car!
- Stiffer Sidewalls for superior handling, but shockingly car rides smoother
- Understeer almost completely eliminated, even at the limit
- Lift-Off oversteer also reduced due to higher rear grip
- Zero wheels spin on launch, even with TC disengaged
- High speed braking massively improved (much more stable)
- Zero rubbing of any kind, fits perfectly (read cons below)
- $22 more per tire ($283 vs. $261, hardly a con given all the pros)
- Does not fit on stock wheels, only 20"x10.5"+ wheels (or wider)
- Must run 40mm offset or lower to fit these tires safely
Background:
Over the past few months I have been busy with other projects and have not been able to post my upgrades/mods in this sectionas much as I have loved doing in the past. Having updated almost everything humanly possible on the ML63, it became clear there weren't many options left on how to extract more of the cars performance potential. The one major Achilles heel left was Tires. With so many other upgrades done to the car, it became clear the 540 treadwear Continental DWS tires were simple outmatched.
Although the Continental ExtremeContact DWS are decent overall all season tires (not to be confused with the DW I am reviewing), they are predominantly an all weather tire with an emphasis on snow regions. This is not to diminish their performance, which were a massive improvement from the terrible stock OEM CrossContact UHPs that came on the car from the factory. However, I always felt like the car had so much more potential if the right set of rubber would be installed on the car.
After reviewing many possible options, I realized that there are no truly great tires in the 295/40/20 size range. Therefore, I began researching other viable options for drastically improving the performance of the ML. Since my car has 10.5" wide Forgestars on it (versus the stock 10" width) it gave me more flexibility to upgrade to a wider size. The 295 DWS tires always seemed to be a tad bit narrow for the 10.5" rim so I wanted to upgrade to a wider size to give the car the absolute maximum grip possible, while giving it a much meatier stance.
After more research, I came to the conclusion that the 315mm width would be ideal as long as I could confirm if they fit. After checking the clearances I took a gamble and order the 315/35/20s. Notice how I dropped down one tire profile size from 40 down to 35 to compensate for the higher width of the tire. This does make the tire slightly smaller overall diameter compared to the 295/40s, but its only 0.7" diameter change (barely noticeable with the meatier wider stance. A 315/40 would be WAY too tall, so the drop to 35 is a necessary one.
Fitment:
Surprisingly the tires fit perfectly. They sit flush on the wheels and have a perfectly vertical side wall. As continentals tend to run a bit narrow, the 315 is a perfect fit. Fortunately when I ordered my Forgestars I opted for a lower 40mm offset (versus stock 46mm offset). These tires probably would not have fit with the 46mm offset, 40mm is as high as I would go. There is about a 1.5x finger gap between the inside of the tire and the wheel hub assembly spindle arm. You don't ever want to go less than this as tires can deform under extreme performance situations so having some wiggle room is important. Remember, these will not fit on stock wheels, these for aftermarket wheels 10.5" with 40mm offset or lower (further out). Zero rubbing anywhere on fenders (no where near close to rubbing). Will post photos later when I get a chance to do a proper photoshoot.
Ride Quality:
I was expecting these 315/35/20 DW tires to run harsher than their all season brother DWS, but the opposite actually ended up being true. Not only is the compound softer (read: grippier), but the tires seem to absorb expansion joints much better and corners much better than before.
Weather/Wet:
One thing I never liked about the DWS (although still better than the stock UHPs), was the fact that they had a tendency to hydroplane in heavy standing water. Perhaps this is because of their snow-biased tread pattern. If you compare the DWS & DW tread patterns you can clearly see the DW has far superior wet channeling grooves than the DWS. Although 315s are a massive tire and it will be impossible to eliminate it all together simply because it is such a massively wide tire, the hydroplaning has been reduced by a good 80-90%.
These tires are simply fantastic in the wet. In fact, The Continental DW are the fastest tire in the wet for ANY max performance tire on the market (yes they are even faster than the Michelin Pilot Super Sports in the wet on lap times). So as far as it comes to wet safety... I would argue these are the best tires on the market.
Dry Performance:
I cannot express into words what a massive jump in performance these tires have given the ML63. Not only is the compound massively more grippy (340 vs. 540 treadwear of the DWS), but the overall contact patch with the road has grown by over 80mm in width!! I would argue the jump from DWS to DW is significantly greater than even the jump from the stock UHPs to DWS.
The absolute performance limit of the car has truly been transformed. The 315s at the front have completely wiped out all understeer, and the much larger contact patch at the rear has eliminated almost all lift-off oversteer at the rear. In essence, the massive jump up in raw mechanical grip has simply made it a much more stable platform. One of my concerns was the fear of tipping/rolling over would be increased with such a huge jump in raw grip, however so far these concerns have been unjustified.
Straight line braking is probably the biggest improvement given the extensive long list of brake upgrades I have performed on the vehicle. For the first time ever, I am finally able to use 100% of the braking power from my RacingBrake rotors/lines/fluid setup in addition to the massive weight reduction from the Forgestar wheels. It genuinely feels like you are throwing an anchor out the window at full max threshold braking. Before, ABS would kick in at higher speeds if you used too much braking power because the DWS tires simply could not handle the massive brakes at full force. In doing so it would cause to car to dart quickly in multiple directions as all 4 corners fought for grip. With the new setup, you can simply mash on the brake pedal and all 4 corners working together to bring you down to a stop in the most stable sure-footed way possible. By increasing the raw mechanical grip so much, the ABS window is now at a much wider margin so it interferes much less (if any at all).
Steering Feedback / Feel:
I never realized just how much steering feedback and feel was being robbed by the 40 series profile tire until I switched to these new 315/35s. The steering feel has improved so much, it genuinely feels like I put a tighter ratio steering rack & pinion in the car (no exaggeration). It almost feels like the CLK63 black series in some ways (although not extreme). Before, there would always be a bit of a dead spot in the steering at top dead center, however, now that has been completely removed. Even turning the wheel 1/2" in either direction will produce immediate feedback at the wheels. The turn-in is precise, sharp, and reactive. In some ways this can make the steering feel more "alert", though not to the point of being hyper sensitive or darty. This change alone has made me fall in love with the car all over again and I have decided to keep my ML63 longer. It really does feel like a whole new car now.
Price: Only a $22 price increase for everything I have listed, No-brainer
Weight:
Absolutely ZERO weight penalty also for all the benefits I have mentioned. Also because the tires are technically 0.7" smaller in diameter, these tires also give the car a slightly improved acceleration gearing which has actually produced a noticed result in acceleration. Its not drastic but you do notice it. I honestly though it would have zero effect, but I have noticed the car feels "peppier" since the upgrade.
Conclusion:
This tire upgrade is such a massive improvement that I would almost call it 100% mandatory. If you don't have upgraded lighter wheels yet, this is by far the best excuse to go ahead and get a set of Forgestars (or similarly light wheel). Not only will it give the car a MUCH more aggressive stance, but it will actually make your car ride smoother, perform & handle better, and actually make your car much safer as well.
Win-Win in every regard
Last edited by ML63 AMG; 06-15-2015 at 06:56 PM.
06-16-2015, 03:09 AM
#2
Super Member
Amazing thanks so much for the review.
These are the new tires I ordered for next week I can't wait to see the difference
The only difference is that the size I ordered are 315/30/22:-)
These are the new tires I ordered for next week
I can't wait to see the differenceThe only difference is that the size I ordered are 315/30/22:-)
Last edited by EVOII_Racer; 06-16-2015 at 04:09 AM.
06-18-2015, 11:30 AM
#3
Super Member
Thread Starter
Update: we have had a bunch of heavy rain here in Texas over the past few weeks and I must say I am more and more impressed with the wet westher capabilities of these tires. Now I actually aim for puddles when driving to see how well it can carve through the water versus before where I would try to avoid them.
Even more impressive, I did a full launch yesterday in the wet with no traction control on and in sport mode, and the car launched perfectly with zero wheel slip ... IN THE WET. I definitely love these tires, and they are the best tire purchase I have made in a long time (maybe even better than the PSS michelins).
Pics coming soon...
Even more impressive, I did a full launch yesterday in the wet with no traction control on and in sport mode, and the car launched perfectly with zero wheel slip ... IN THE WET. I definitely love these tires, and they are the best tire purchase I have made in a long time (maybe even better than the PSS michelins).
Pics coming soon...
Last edited by ML63 AMG; 06-18-2015 at 11:40 AM.
06-22-2015, 10:21 AM
#4
Former Vendor of MBWorld
We actually use the 335/25-22 Continental 5P on our ML63 and it's an amazing tire with a great ride.
06-22-2015, 07:28 PM
#5
Super Member
06-29-2015, 05:51 PM
#7
Super Member
ML63 AMG ,
I am looking forward your feed-back on the tire pressure this Will get very intersting no doubt
Currently I am using (according to the call of Lorinser to Conti) 3.0 in front and 3.4 at the rear
I am excited about this tread
I am looking forward your feed-back on the tire pressure this Will get very intersting no doubt
Currently I am using (according to the call of Lorinser to Conti) 3.0 in front and 3.4 at the rear
I am excited about this tread
Trending Topics
09-21-2015, 06:00 PM
#8
Super Member
Thread Starter
Long Term Update:
I have put a couple thousand miles on the tires now and finally broken them in past the initial rubber coating to get a much better idea of what the tire is truly capable of.
Dry Grip: In a word... Insane. 315 rubber all around has completely eliminate 95% of understeer. Only at the absolute limits is there a tiny hint of it on-throttle, but all you have to do is lift and the nose pulls right back in. NO MORE TIRE SQUEAL! Even at the limit the tires are almost completely silent. The steering response and grip have improved another 10-15% compared to when I first got them without any negative drawbacks (just as quick and comfortable as the day I put them on).
Wet: Now that the tire has reached max grip after wearing the initial smooth layer of rubber, the grip trip is honestly the best I have experience in any tire. Yes, even better than Michelin Pilot Super Sports. It may be a tad bit slower in the dry thank the PSS, but in the wet not even PSS can compete with these.
you can drive through standing water at freeway speeds (80+mph) and it will literally just drive right through it. The Continental DWS (and especially the cross contacts, had a tendency to hydroplane a bit just because of their tread pattern). However, these Continental DW tires, even at a much wider width, have far superior hydroplane resistance largely due to their much larger rain channeling grooves. So even though they are wider (usually worse for hydroplaning), they actually perform better.
Wear: Seems to be wearing at an excellent rate so far, 20k+ should be easy out of these tires, even if you drive aggressively.
Comfort & Noise: no degradation in either even though the initial soft layer of rubber is gone. Just as good as day one, I don't expect that to change any for the life of the tire. Did a couple of road trips with them, they performed flawlessly.
Hope that helps,
ML63 AMG
I have put a couple thousand miles on the tires now and finally broken them in past the initial rubber coating to get a much better idea of what the tire is truly capable of.
Dry Grip: In a word... Insane. 315 rubber all around has completely eliminate 95% of understeer. Only at the absolute limits is there a tiny hint of it on-throttle, but all you have to do is lift and the nose pulls right back in. NO MORE TIRE SQUEAL! Even at the limit the tires are almost completely silent. The steering response and grip have improved another 10-15% compared to when I first got them without any negative drawbacks (just as quick and comfortable as the day I put them on).
Wet: Now that the tire has reached max grip after wearing the initial smooth layer of rubber, the grip trip is honestly the best I have experience in any tire. Yes, even better than Michelin Pilot Super Sports. It may be a tad bit slower in the dry thank the PSS, but in the wet not even PSS can compete with these.
you can drive through standing water at freeway speeds (80+mph) and it will literally just drive right through it. The Continental DWS (and especially the cross contacts, had a tendency to hydroplane a bit just because of their tread pattern). However, these Continental DW tires, even at a much wider width, have far superior hydroplane resistance largely due to their much larger rain channeling grooves. So even though they are wider (usually worse for hydroplaning), they actually perform better.
Wear: Seems to be wearing at an excellent rate so far, 20k+ should be easy out of these tires, even if you drive aggressively.
Comfort & Noise: no degradation in either even though the initial soft layer of rubber is gone. Just as good as day one, I don't expect that to change any for the life of the tire. Did a couple of road trips with them, they performed flawlessly.
Hope that helps,
ML63 AMG
