linh

Ben,

How about this next bet since you're not going to take on the last bet. I'll give you $100 if your car can do 13.0s or less in a 1/4 mile. You can use any trick you want to achieve this 13.0s or less contest. Here's some idea to help you collect my money, slick tires, racing gasoline...etc. If Kleemann S/C is so BAD ***, then take on this BET !!!

LowRydeR

No offense, but Linh, the only reason you're even offering money is because you know that you aren't worth Ben's time to go down there. Why don't you like Kleemann SC? Is it because you can never have one? I think that's the best SC available for Mercedes, and if I had the money I would buy one in a second. Try offering $300 for anything faster than 17 seconds. That still probably wouldn't be worth it to him.

-Bruce

otoupalik

Linh,

You never fail to surprise me. This is the SAME offer, 12's or less then 13 = the SAME THING!

Of course with drag slicks, 110 octane, etc., the car can do it. However, why in the world would anyone spend $500 to win $100. That must be the new math!

Thanks

Brad

tango

hahah good job ben! keep your cool and dont reply him so he will get even more pissed

linh

My friend, you got it all wrong !!! I'm having fun, don't you see it. If anyone is pissed off about this, that would only be Ben because he wouldn't dare to take on the challenge and that obviously show his Clk43k is not all that !!!


Do you think that we would know about it, if there's a drivetrain failures, Ben? We wouldn't know and the customer wouldn't dare to discuss the problem on this forum if they want Kleemann/Evosport to help them. Don't you remember Evosport instructed me not to discuss my over boost problem anymore in this forum..?? I would suspect you guys do the same with other customers with problem.

Petie

my middle school brother can make a better argument than this....this is like a 3rd grade threat, why do you care so much?

HigHal320

Hey Linh why don't you sure us what your 01' CLK 430 can do??

stephens

linh
Are you seriously suggesting that the Kleemann SC isn't the real deal?? I have previously read with interest your SL230K upgrade, but really, equating your experiences with what is essentially a home grown power upgrade, with what a customer could expect from a complete Kleemann kit is a bit out there.

linh

It can do what ever Mercedes said on their "brochures booklet" and nothing more or less. Btw, it said 0-60 in 6.1s. I wouldn't called it a 6.0s just to make it feel a little bit faster...lol.






ABSOLUTELY NOT !!! I admired Kleemann S/C. I read extensively about Kleemann S/C articles of each model in the "BENZO Magazine" and i beleive everything Kleemann said about their products. It Ben Claimed that i don't believe and that's why i offer the $100 challenge.

Sleestack

Linh,

You know Ben is giving real HP and torque numbers because he has posted his dynos on this board. Granted, all Kleemann users could benefit from a wider tire setup, however, why is it so difficult for you to believe that a car pumping out as much hp and torque as his could post a sub 13 1/4 mile? Sure it probably pisses alot of people off that someone at the age of 20 (i.e. Ben) could have such a sweet ride, however, the kid works his butt off and his girlfriend is a sweetheart so he can't be all that bad. As for your $100 bet, maybe if you raised the ante by adding another 0 he would take you up on the bet... it would help him buy the new seats he has wanted. I know you don't think the Kleemann SC is that "badass," however, have you even had first hand experience with one yet. In the world of psycho-autoanalytical armchair psychology, you have a classic case of Kleemann envy coupled with latent Mach430 disdain that can only be cured by having your head knocked back against your headrest repeatedly as you thrust forward in a Kleemann supercharged automobile.

Larry Sonsini

I own a CLK55, and Ben was kind enough to allow me to experience his 430k. My 10 sec appraisal of it? It is "all that," and then some. Your attempts to start a fire will in the end-- mean nothing. Message board chatter is one thing....sitting in Ben's clk is quite another experience all together. In this case, I'll trust what I have seen, felt, smelled and tasted in the flesh.

BrabusCClass

I love my KLEEMANN.

linh

Sleestack,

I have no problem his car can do sub 13, now that's a more realistic number. because Kleemann also claimed that in the "BENZO Magazine".

E55 KEV

BrabusCClass, where can I view pics of your car?

Petie

are we still on this 12s means twelves and not 12 seconds thing???? come on, get over it....

Lucas

So HPS, what you are saying is :

You shouldn't try teaching an old *** to **** ????.

What does your 300 years help you, when you are far behind
in supercharging technology.
What you have created at HPS, many has done before you, there is nothing new under the sun.

Vadim @ evosport

This is starting to become another name-calling thread.

Lets look at facts.

There are three systems on the market.

ESS, HPS and KLEEMANN. All use different superchargers (SC) to make power. The difference lies in SC efficiencies.

SC/Turbo efficiency: SC/Turbo efficiency is essentially the ratio of useful work produced by the SC/Turbo from the work required to drive the SC/turbo. An increase in temperature is of course a by product of compressing air and is unavoidable. A higher SC/turbo compressor efficiency value means lower charge air temperature. Naturally, lower charge air temperatures assists in improved engine durability with the potential to achieve even higher power and torque output. The efficiency is measured in percentages. Where 100% is an ideal number. The closer you are to this number the less heat SC/Turbo generates.

Lets look at each indiviual system:

ESS:
They use Vortech, centrifugal SC, no intercooler, no EPA/CARB certification.
It is basically half of a turbo mechanically attached to the crankshaft. The unit is fairly efficient around 70%. Personally, I have a lot of experience with it, as it is used extensively in FORD and CHEVY late-model aftermarket. The problem with a VORTECH, is that it builds boost with RPMs. So maximum boost is not reached until redline, leaving midrange and lowend - soft. Most customers who install VORTECH systems end up trying to make up for soft bottom end by increasing SC pulley ratio. Eventually end up with damaged engine as there is now too much boost on the top end, leaning car out.

HPS:
They use EATON M90 roots SC, no intercooler, EPA/CARB certified. This SC is not really a compressor, it a positive displacement SC. It simply grabs air with it's lobes and compresses it inside the intake manifold. Because of this, it's efficeincy is fairly low, in 50-60% range. In my personal experience, EATON, at low boost levels 4-6 psi can make decent power. Anything above will increase air charge temperature dramatically, resulting in detonation. Lack of intercooling is a big concern, since 91 octane gas that we currrently "enjoying" in CA is coming to all states within next several years. Also on bigger engines like 500 and 55 M90 is too small. It is only 1.5L in displacement, so to make equal to smaller engine's (430) boost it has to be turned faster, thus creating more engine damaging heat.

KLEEMANN:
They use Lysholm screw compressor, intercooled, EPA/CARB certified.
Compressor is sized to engine displacement from 1L for V6 models to 2.2L for 55 models. Lysholm has efficencies in the range of 70-80%. KLEEMANN also uses LAMINOVA intercooler cores that are very efficient (80-90%). What it means is that on their kits, air charge temperature is only around 20-30F higher than ambient at full boost. One of the first kits we installed was in the summer with outside hitting high90s, yet charge temperature never rose above 120F. Knock sensors were happy and DME was giving the car full timing advance. CLK55K made 420HP/420TQ at the wheels and ran like a proverbial "bat out if hell", with perfect driveability and throttle response.

If you add proven track record in Europe, very well engineered and integrated compressor/intercooler/water pump assembly and factory appearance, it is easy to see why we sell only KLEEMANN.

Cory @ Kleemann

VERY well said Vadim.

Sleestack

Damn Vadim.... I knew there was a reason I trusted you with my car.

Tezta

Are there any other superchargers on the market for BMW or audi/VW that offer more performance gain than kleemann offers for MB? example, E500 comes with 306hp +Kleeman= 500hp. I think the 540 has 282hp, is there a company that can tune them to over 500hp?

BrabusCClass

Please check the W203 section. I have many threads with pics of my car, blower, etc.

Mach430

We will have the first HIOP superchargers in the country at the end of the year for testing. They are similiar in design to the Kleemann, as both use a twin-screw SC, however they do not yet come with an intercooler.

Lucas

Ben

I hope you not are paying for the HIOP system, untill you have tested it.

I have seen these systems i Singapore some years ago
for MB 4 cyl.
They used an off the shelve Autorotor, but there the quality stopped. Poor casting, fitting quality and no fuel system components.
I don't know if one of the owners still is Cliff Simpson ????, if it is
he will promise you the world, but what they deliver is another story.

See what's in the box and test it before any transfere.

shtatc

Ben or Vadim,

Both AMG and Carlsson uses the Ogura clutch system with their SC systems. I dont know if Carlsson's system is out for public purchase yet. However, are there significant benefits for having the Ogura clutch? Or is it a "nice to have" feature and not a "need to have" feature? When comparing to the intercooler, which I believe is a "need to have" feature. Thanks.

Vadim @ evosport

Yes, Ogura clutch is standard on C32. It is used to disengage kompressor under light load conditions. Kleemann uses a bypas valve for the same purpose.

The problem with clutch is that you can not make it smaller. There is not enough "meat" left on it. This why you have to make crankshaft pulley larger to increase the boost.