Twin Screw Compresser on a C230K?
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 592
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento
AMG C43, 1999
Twin Screw Compresser on a C230K?
Would a Whipple Supercharger or another twin screw compressor work to the advantage of a C230K motor?
Would this type of supercharger install without too much difficulty and what type of percent change in effiecency could be gained. Also would the compressed air out of a twin screw compressor be cooler?
Thanks
Jeff
Would this type of supercharger install without too much difficulty and what type of percent change in effiecency could be gained. Also would the compressed air out of a twin screw compressor be cooler?
Thanks
Jeff
Super Member
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 988
Likes: 0
From: Encino
2002 C230K
kleemann was recently working on a screw-type setup. they should be ablke to answer your questions. but yes, it should work to the advantage of the c230 because it of lower parasitic loss, less heat generated, and higher boost potential.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,012
Likes: 1
From: Abingdon, MD
lysholm conversion
KLEEMANN USA was prototyping a lysholm conversion as a feasibility test on their C230K.
KLEEMANN- Is there any status on the likelihood of this as an addition to your product line?
C230K owners- This might be a good time to either acknowledge or denounce interest in this modification for your vehicle.
I'm saving my pennies just in case it does pan out.
KLEEMANN- Is there any status on the likelihood of this as an addition to your product line?
C230K owners- This might be a good time to either acknowledge or denounce interest in this modification for your vehicle.
I'm saving my pennies just in case it does pan out.
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 930
Likes: 0
Yes- we will make this a product IF.....
The conversion is not cost prohibitive to the market segment.
Power gains are at least twice that of a pulley upgrade.
Installation is not overly complicated for the DIY owner.
The conversion can be made to be possible without modifying any original parts.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then.
Also under development and production at this time is a light weight flywheel (sorry automatics) and clutch disk/pressure plate combination that will drop 30lbs off of the 51lbs stock unit. This shoul also really wake up the stock powerplant. Target price for the complete clutch package (flywheel,disk, pressure plate) is under $1900. Very high clamping pressure and Kevlar disk will with stand 350+ HP forever.
The conversion is not cost prohibitive to the market segment.
Power gains are at least twice that of a pulley upgrade.
Installation is not overly complicated for the DIY owner.
The conversion can be made to be possible without modifying any original parts.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then.
Also under development and production at this time is a light weight flywheel (sorry automatics) and clutch disk/pressure plate combination that will drop 30lbs off of the 51lbs stock unit. This shoul also really wake up the stock powerplant. Target price for the complete clutch package (flywheel,disk, pressure plate) is under $1900. Very high clamping pressure and Kevlar disk will with stand 350+ HP forever.
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 592
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento
AMG C43, 1999
I would also be interested in a twin screw supercharger, as it appears the stock Eaton Supercharger is running out of air flow capacity during the last 1000 rpm causing both a loss in torque and Hp.
Lets have more power. A good solid 225-240 at the wheels in a 230k would make a pretty good sleeper and with the lighter 4 cylinder up front, the potential for a well balanced handling sedan or coupe.
Jeff
Lets have more power. A good solid 225-240 at the wheels in a 230k would make a pretty good sleeper and with the lighter 4 cylinder up front, the potential for a well balanced handling sedan or coupe.
Jeff
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,012
Likes: 1
From: Abingdon, MD
Originally posted by KLEEMANN
<snip>These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then. <snip>
<snip>These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then. <snip>
Would it be ok to do a pulley upgrade then IF this came out move to it?
Last edited by nukblazi; Mar 12, 2003 at 09:49 PM.
Trending Topics
Super Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 591
Likes: 3
From: Mid-Atlantic USA
W203 & W204 3.0L 4matics & MR2 Supercharger
Originally posted by speedybenz
I would also be interested in a twin screw supercharger, as it appears the stock Eaton Supercharger is running out of air flow capacity during the last 1000 rpm causing both a loss in torque and Hp.
Lets have more power. A good solid 225-240 at the wheels in a 230k would make a pretty good sleeper and with the lighter 4 cylinder up front, the potential for a well balanced handling sedan or coupe.
Jeff
I would also be interested in a twin screw supercharger, as it appears the stock Eaton Supercharger is running out of air flow capacity during the last 1000 rpm causing both a loss in torque and Hp.
Lets have more power. A good solid 225-240 at the wheels in a 230k would make a pretty good sleeper and with the lighter 4 cylinder up front, the potential for a well balanced handling sedan or coupe.
Jeff
NP
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
Thread Starter
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 592
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento
AMG C43, 1999
We are routinely getting approx. 200 Hp per Liter on our normally asperated race engines, however we are using lots of rpm. Lots of rpm.
Example: 600 cc engine with 118 hp@ 12,500 rpm. Using 91 octane fuel.
And these motors would be good or 60,000 plus miles of street riding.
I would think that a twin cam 2300cc engine with good engineering and consideration of solid assembily procedures and attention to internal friction, oil pressure, bearing clearance, and air flow through the cylinder head should be able to achieve 100-130hp per liter normally asperated. So with a Supercharger the process is helped tremendously.
Now if someone had the 230k engine spec's that would be great. Things like rod length, crank main and rod bearing diameter, pics of the cylinder combustion chamber, valve sizes. Valve spring hts, both installed and free. Intake and Exhaust cam lift and duration specs, both total and at 0.40". Bore and Stroke.
Pics of the top and side of the piston. etc.
Man, how I like a new challenge!
Jeff
Example: 600 cc engine with 118 hp@ 12,500 rpm. Using 91 octane fuel.
And these motors would be good or 60,000 plus miles of street riding.
I would think that a twin cam 2300cc engine with good engineering and consideration of solid assembily procedures and attention to internal friction, oil pressure, bearing clearance, and air flow through the cylinder head should be able to achieve 100-130hp per liter normally asperated. So with a Supercharger the process is helped tremendously.
Now if someone had the 230k engine spec's that would be great. Things like rod length, crank main and rod bearing diameter, pics of the cylinder combustion chamber, valve sizes. Valve spring hts, both installed and free. Intake and Exhaust cam lift and duration specs, both total and at 0.40". Bore and Stroke.
Pics of the top and side of the piston. etc.
Man, how I like a new challenge!
Jeff
Last edited by speedybenz; Mar 12, 2003 at 11:54 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 1
From: The blue white rock, third out.
2002 C230 Coupe(M111)
Originally posted by speedybenz
We are routinely getting approx. 200 Hp per Liter on our normally asperated race engines, however we are using lots of rpm. Lots of rpm.
Example: 600 cc engine with 118 hp@ 12,500 rpm. Using 91 octane fuel.
And these motors would be good or 60,000 plus miles of street riding.
I would think that a twin cam 2300cc engine with good engineering and consideration of solid assembily procedures and attention to internal friction, oil pressure, bearing clearance, and air flow through the cylinder head should be able to achieve 100-130hp per liter normally asperated. So with a Supercharger the process is helped tremendously.
Now if someone had the 230k engine spec's that would be great. Things like rod length, crank main and rod bearing diameter, pics of the cylinder combustion chamber, valve sizes. Valve spring hts, both installed and free. Intake and Exhaust cam lift and duration specs, both total and at 0.40". Bore and Stroke.
Pics of the top and side of the piston. etc.
Man, how I like a new challenge!
Jeff
We are routinely getting approx. 200 Hp per Liter on our normally asperated race engines, however we are using lots of rpm. Lots of rpm.
Example: 600 cc engine with 118 hp@ 12,500 rpm. Using 91 octane fuel.
And these motors would be good or 60,000 plus miles of street riding.
I would think that a twin cam 2300cc engine with good engineering and consideration of solid assembily procedures and attention to internal friction, oil pressure, bearing clearance, and air flow through the cylinder head should be able to achieve 100-130hp per liter normally asperated. So with a Supercharger the process is helped tremendously.
Now if someone had the 230k engine spec's that would be great. Things like rod length, crank main and rod bearing diameter, pics of the cylinder combustion chamber, valve sizes. Valve spring hts, both installed and free. Intake and Exhaust cam lift and duration specs, both total and at 0.40". Bore and Stroke.
Pics of the top and side of the piston. etc.
Man, how I like a new challenge!
Jeff
That is not to say that the M111 or M271 does not have plenty of headroom. The M271 already makes over 100HP per litre. The M111 is loafing. I wouldn't be eager to mess with the cam lift and duration on these cars, both engines employ variable valve timing. More boost is the way to go.
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 450
Likes: 0
what is the ballpark of the S/C upgrade kit?
will you offer a tage 1 upgrade just to lighten the flywheel? i heard the stock clutch is good for about 300hp
will you offer a tage 1 upgrade just to lighten the flywheel? i heard the stock clutch is good for about 300hp
Originally posted by KLEEMANN
Yes- we will make this a product IF.....
The conversion is not cost prohibitive to the market segment.
Power gains are at least twice that of a pulley upgrade.
Installation is not overly complicated for the DIY owner.
The conversion can be made to be possible without modifying any original parts.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then.
Also under development and production at this time is a light weight flywheel (sorry automatics) and clutch disk/pressure plate combination that will drop 30lbs off of the 51lbs stock unit. This shoul also really wake up the stock powerplant. Target price for the complete clutch package (flywheel,disk, pressure plate) is under $1900. Very high clamping pressure and Kevlar disk will with stand 350+ HP forever.
Yes- we will make this a product IF.....
The conversion is not cost prohibitive to the market segment.
Power gains are at least twice that of a pulley upgrade.
Installation is not overly complicated for the DIY owner.
The conversion can be made to be possible without modifying any original parts.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone. The project car is for competition, by early summer it will have seen some heavy track abuse. We will know by then.
Also under development and production at this time is a light weight flywheel (sorry automatics) and clutch disk/pressure plate combination that will drop 30lbs off of the 51lbs stock unit. This shoul also really wake up the stock powerplant. Target price for the complete clutch package (flywheel,disk, pressure plate) is under $1900. Very high clamping pressure and Kevlar disk will with stand 350+ HP forever.
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
what is the ballpark of the S/C upgrade kit?
For KLEEMANN - Will current kleemann pulley owners be able to retain the pulley if the s/c upgrade is done?
Last edited by DaBeze; Mar 31, 2003 at 03:35 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,860
Likes: 3
From: Jacksonville Florida
209/W210 Estate /W211 modded by MBENZNL
.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone.
Kleemann....Are YOU Looking for a REAL World Shakedown...
Let me Drive IT!
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone.
Kleemann....Are YOU Looking for a REAL World Shakedown...
Let me Drive IT!
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 450
Likes: 0
Originally posted by DaBeze
I believe that in an earlier statement KLEEMANN said it would be under $3k.
if Kleemann can keep the price I think there is a market for it,
considering a lysholm superchager can be had with 1K or less
For KLEEMANN - Will current kleemann pulley owners be able to retain the pulley if the s/c upgrade is done?
I believe that in an earlier statement KLEEMANN said it would be under $3k.
if Kleemann can keep the price I think there is a market for it,
considering a lysholm superchager can be had with 1K or less
For KLEEMANN - Will current kleemann pulley owners be able to retain the pulley if the s/c upgrade is done?
I'd happy if I can take my coupe to 270hp for under 3K
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 930
Likes: 0
Originally posted by MARK CUMMINS
.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone.
Kleemann....Are YOU Looking for a REAL World Shakedown...
Let me Drive IT!
.
These questions will all be answered shortly- it is impossible to tel know as the parts are being designed, manufactured, tweeked, retweeked etc. Once the car is complete it will have to undergo a severe real world shakedown before Im willing to sell it to anyone.
Kleemann....Are YOU Looking for a REAL World Shakedown...
Let me Drive IT!
Former Vendor of MBWorld
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 930
Likes: 0
Originally posted by DaBeze
I believe that in an earlier statement KLEEMANN said it would be under $3k.
For KLEEMANN - Will current kleemann pulley owners be able to retain the pulley if the s/c upgrade is done?
I believe that in an earlier statement KLEEMANN said it would be under $3k.
For KLEEMANN - Will current kleemann pulley owners be able to retain the pulley if the s/c upgrade is done?
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Yes they will.
Off Topic - Hey KLEEMANN, my family and I go to Steamboat Springs every summer for a week. How long of a drive is it to your shop from there? I would kill to come out and see one of your beasts!
Regards,
Matt
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,744
Likes: 1
It is about 260 miles from Steamboat Springs to Colorado Springs with more than half of it on two lane mountain roads. You will cross Rabbit Ears Pass, Muddy Pass and Berthoud Pass (11315 feet in elevation). You will pass through the town of Fraser, which was the coldest town in the US until they closed the weather bureau office. Considering you will spend half the distance behind some flatlanders herding their RV's down the road at 30 mph, you should plan on the trip taking all day, one way.
Last edited by Lynn; Apr 1, 2003 at 12:08 AM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 1
From: The blue white rock, third out.
2002 C230 Coupe(M111)
Originally posted by Lynn
It is about 260 miles from Steamboat Springs to Colorado Springs with more than half of it on two lane mountain roads. You will cross Rabbit Ears Pass, Muddy Pass and Berthoud Pass (11315 feet in elevation). You will pass through the town of Faser, which was the coldest town in the US until they closed the weather bureau office. Considering you will spend half the distance behind some flatlanders herding their RV's down the road at 30 mph, you should plan on the trip taking all day, one way.
It is about 260 miles from Steamboat Springs to Colorado Springs with more than half of it on two lane mountain roads. You will cross Rabbit Ears Pass, Muddy Pass and Berthoud Pass (11315 feet in elevation). You will pass through the town of Faser, which was the coldest town in the US until they closed the weather bureau office. Considering you will spend half the distance behind some flatlanders herding their RV's down the road at 30 mph, you should plan on the trip taking all day, one way.
Worst part of the drive will be avoiding snowboarders trying to hitch a ride to the top of Berthoud :p Drove that switchback into the valley in an Audi TT one time...nice! The turbo makes the car a blast in the mountains...everyone else is weezing at that altitude.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,744
Likes: 1
I can't type. The town is Fraser. It is that cold there. Before the weather bureau closed, Fraser had the national low on a daily basis more than anywhere else in the continental US. Now International Falls, MN gets to claim that.
