otoupalik

1st - Of course there is no PERFECT system - that one would make 1000 HP and cost nothing. Kleemann is the best we have seen, bar none. Yes, the V6 kit is not quite as nice as the V8 kits as we have seen after installing a bunch. However, the gains are representative % wise.

2nd - Adam IS the executive! That is the point! There is no one above him.

3rd - We really don't care if any of the problems are solved, that is HPS' business, not anyone elses!

Thanks

Brad

Mach430

This is not purely about PR, marketing and competition. This is about truth and reliability. Timster finally posted his experiences, which oddly enough are not what HPS stated. Obviously, they can't both be right, but who has more to lose?

I posted false information that has been recorded from HPS's messages, yet you don't stop to question them on it??? No business should get away with operating that way. Doesn't it bother anyone that the dyno they based their claims on was not a real dyno? Doesn't it bother anyone that they claim impossible acceleration times? And after Adam's statements to me saying that he would answer any legitmate question, he responds to my asking for an a/f ratio by saying he has it. What good does it do for the public if he has it, but won't tell anyone?

Thanks,
Ben

Sleestack

Uh no. I have stated that most of my problems revolve around their behavior. I have also stated that their dynos are unimpressive and offered to pay for a head to head dyno with a Kleemann SCed car. I just don't comment on HPS's SC system as much because I believe a) the dynos speak for themselves and b) I don't have the expertise of members like Lucas. Yes, most of the people commenting on HPS are Kleemann owners, however, perhaps thats because they have a real basis for comparison and support a product they believe in. Yes, it's not my responsibility, however, I am free to comment on topics that interest me, aren't I?

I keep attacking Adam? As i said, what you see as an attack I see as a response. Have you even read all the threads between me and Adam?

How is the dicussion we are having any different? Are you behaving like a kindergartener?

You might not feel that this thread has given you any useful information, however, when you buy a product costing thousands of dollars the practices of the company selling you that product are very important. While you might not find this thread useful, others might. If it bothers you that much, continue doing what you are doing (i.e. posting replies) or just ignore the thread. Is it that difficult?

You have an E430. Why don't you drop by Evosport and take a spin with Mach 430. Trust me, you will not be disappointed. Then drop by HPS for a comparison.

nubomb

Lucas - Very clear, to the point and not that boring! Thank You, and I really mean that. Now hopefully that wasn't to hard for you. I wish all your posts were filled with useful information like this along with your sarcastic wit. It makes the forum that much more enjoyable and helps validate the point you are making. Thanks again.

nukblazi

Please think about it this way-

In every industry there are elitists who got to the top or at least close the hard way. They will never share specific "how to get where we are" to competitors. And there will ALWAYS be competitive jawing. There is nothing really wrong with this. Adam would be all the wiser to analyze of this information and develop a road map to change utilizing a lot of these "freebies".

Despite the negative overtones, each and every one of us IS indeed helping HPS, intentionally or unintentionally, by sharing consumer and professional opinions about HPS's product, and Adam's conduct.

Part of the frustration is Adam's reluctance to do things the way that is considered "industry standard", or as requested by competitors and consumers. Another is Kleemann's and Evosport's condescending tones. But if either one of these company's reps wasn't somewhere down inside trying to help a "colleage/competitor/board sponsor", they just wouldn't bother to say anything.

If no one was trying to help HPS, Adam would've been blocked, HPS wouldn't have been aloud to sponsor the forum, and no one would respond to Adam's posts, or engage in these conversations which actually provide an inside into the product and business conduct that most companies would never get the benefit of without significant market specific experience.

blah, blah, blah


Thomas

As if my reply wasn't long enough; Sorry for the Edit.

Hank- If you STFF, you will find multiple C-Coupe SC failures on UNMODIFIED cars. Check out csportcoupe.com, there were more SC failures there. Some with multiple replacements. I understand you're trying to convey that Kleemann isn't perfect, but harping on a single vehicle mod'd by Evosport with a kleemann pulley kit over and over undermines your point.

Hopefully, I will be able to comment on my satisfaction with the Kleemann SC upgrade on my 4-cylinder, I can assure you that I am not expecting the same results as I would get from a V8 or V6, everything is proportionate.

Turbo][

[QUOTE]Originally posted by nukblazi
Part of the frustration is Adam's reluctance to do things the way that is considered "industry standard", or as requested by competitors and consumers. Another is Kleemann's and Evosport's condecending tones. But if either one of these company's reps wasn't somewhere down inside trying to help a "colleage/competitor/board sponsor", they just woundn't bother to say anything.

I agreed at the point that Evosport/Kleemann was being constructive in some ways. However the constant badgering from Kleemann customer is just straight out attacks. It some how, IMO, turns in to reduntant of posts that has no value or merits.

I have been reading the post for awhile from the side-line its just getting "old".

nukblazi

I agree with you, look at my earlier posts on this thread.

You have to understand that this thread is about Sleestack wanting to ask HPS questions. Adam accidentally deleted the old thread. The thread's technically dead.

However, what is important to note is that this IS between Sleestack and HPS. Sleestack being a Kleemann customer is incedental. Everyone and their mother gets dragged into this, including tuners, consumers, and distributors.

If I was continually being dragged into these threads, I would feel the need to respond passionately as well.

Turbo][

ACtually Timster was being dragged...Sleestack attacked HPS for claiming themselve for being "elite"...

Anyway, I think I am done for the day

Until we start seeing something more productive, this is the type of post thas is just an endless cycle of wasted bandwidth.

nukblazi

MBWorld has sponsors to pay for theirs, I pay for mine. Bandwidth is no reason to halt a discussion that you have been very active on lately.

The point remains that everyone has been a little wrong on this topic at one point or another, and these forums are here for my benefit. So long as everyone's usage remains within the TOS, this is a good topic.

This topic leaves the door open for HPS to disprove any and all alligations of falsifying Dnyo charts or intentionally providing false information to potential customers.

Adam and I spoke last week, and I still think it is a good idea to try to satisfy everyone's curiousity and alligations, despite how daunting of a effort it will be.

Sleestack

When someone asks a sponsor a difficult question why do you consider it an attack? Do you realize that a public company can be sued by its shareholders for using words like "elite" when there is no reasonable basis for doing so. Trust me , I know because I have spent countless hours in drafting sessions for IPO and other public company transactions. It is for the protection of shareholders who use such information to make decisions about buying and selling securities in that company. I understand that HPS is not a public company, however, don't you think the same concerns apply here? People make significant purchasing decisions based on information that is posted on this forum, especially information posted by sponsors. Some of those people don't know very much about MB tuning. Don't you think sponsors who advertise on this board have a responsibility to those members to promote their companies and products in a responsible manner? I happened to think HPS' use of the word "elite" (especially in the same sentence as Renntech and Brabus) was irresponsible marketing. HPS has neither the market share nor the experience to be characterizing themselves in that way. That is my opinion and I called HPS out on it. They disagreed. What's the big deal?

Does it not bother you that I (a consumer) have offered to pay for a comparative dyno, which would negate HPS' stated concerns about dyno manipulation and received no response. Does it not bother you that HPS tried to sell a SC system to a board member with the use of a 0-60 time of 3.8? Do you even realize how absurd that is? Have you even compared a Kleemann dyno to an HPS dyno? Does it not concern you that rather than dealing with difficult questions, HPS made an assinine attempt to shut me up by threatening to take legal action against me? You don't think I have reason to be upset by that? I'm not sure why you think these points are irrelevant or not important to the very purpose of these forums. Before you start criticizing me, why don't you answer these questions instead of repeatedly asserting that I am attack HPS with no reason.

You might not care about these matters (although by your posts, it seems that you obviously do), however, I believe there are members that are actually learning important things about HPS' business practices and product through these discussions. Obviously you don't. Nevertheless, you keep adding to this "endless cycle of wasted bandwidth"?

Sleestack

No disrepect, but is that what Adam told you? That he "accidentally" deleted the thread? How does one delete a thread accidentally when you have to check a box that asks you if you really want to delete the thread?

Lucas

Adam

Why would a lot of members want this thread deleted ?????.

The only one which is over his head here is you, so it must be wishfull thinking from your side to see it deleted, Sleestack will be the judge of that.

nukblazi

None taken. I think I've tried to be clear that I am trying to be non-bias in these threads. I had my chance to rip HPS and I did. It isn't my place to question the actions of a person regarding their ability to operate a computer. I just reiterated what I was told over the phone, and what was posted by Adam.

I still believe that there is equal opportunity to disprove the alligations as well as possibly confirm them. I encourage Adam to conceed to as many Dyno days and A/F ratio measurements as it takes, as I did on the phone with him. If the product doesn't meet consumer expectations, this is an opportunity to improve the product.

We're all acting a little immature but at least I have an excuse, I have nothing better to do. :-P

Sleestack

Ok, I'll buy that, however, it would have been helpful to give that information earlier in the thread, especially given the title of the thread. Based on the number of views and replies, I think there are more people who don't want this thread closed... a form of rubbernecking I guess.

nukblazi

Hey, I know we just got back on topic but I can't live with that.

Hey Sleestack, if I put a SLEESTACK sticker across my windshied would you sponsor my H&R coilovers?

Sleestack

I don't care about my credibility as I am only on this board as a member and don't really care what other members think about me. They are more interested in my car than me anyway... which is the way it should be. There were definitely a few members who disagreed with my position, however, I took the time to respond to each of them. That is the best that I can do. I think there are plenty of members, vocal or not, who understood what I was saying. I don't voice my opinion unless I actually believe in what I am saying. As for my tone, I'm from NYC, so I don't mince my words and throw a few insults in for good measure. Sometimes I may be wrong (although nobody in this thread has convinced me of that with respect to this thread), however, I'd rather leave the thread open for those who want to make their own judgment.

I appreciate the fact that you want to focus on your marketing activities. I think you know that it is my opinion that honing your marketing skills is something you need to do.

I still think you avoided some legitimate questions posed in this thread, however, it is certainly your right to do so and I'll try to refrain from making assumptions abnout why you chose to do so.

As for marriage and children... fortunately that has nothing to do with this. Fatherhood is wonderful. I have many automotive and golf related plans for my son. I only wish you the best of luck in your marriage and family.

Sleestack

Sleestack Motorsports... hmmm. Sounds nice, but I might get sued by Chakka.... if you are young, it's a Land of the Lost reference.

I have H&R coilovers on my Audi A64.2... they rock.

Brandon @ Kleemann

oggle

Not me.

nukblazi

Ha- I believe Motorwerks is the current trend.

Land of the lost. I've seen it, but not in so long as to remember it. Wish I had Photochop, I'd hook up a quick demo for Sleestack Motorwerks.

Windshield banner
side skirt stickers
trunk badging

I literally had enough cash in my hand for the Coilovers and new sways today. I figured rent was important though. Even would have had enough left over for Eisenmann race exhaust. Next unemployment check maybe

Sleestack

Once again, Adam is bobbing and weaving, avoiding answering questions yet happy to ask them.

Sleestack

Of course I can't. I think we all know that. I'm a customer, not a technician. What's your point? At least I have answered your question.

Sleestack

I can't speak for the particular car you were driving, however, anyone who has spent significant time with a Kleemann system can tell you that your description of the transition of power throught the RPM range is completely contrary to how a Kleemann system actually performs. Furthermore, it is not consistent with dyno results. Why don't you dyno one of your cars against a Kleemann car... we can all take alook at the power curves then. So you have successfully SCed an SL500 for a reasonable basis of comparison?

Sleestack

So you are dynoing your car against a Kleemann car on the same day and site?

otoupalik

So it takes 2-3 weeks for HPS to get A/F ratio's to post? hummm

Just post them!

Thanks