samdon

Adding insult to injury; my cluster went black yesterday. Flickered for about ten seconds and out she went.

The kicker is that my car is now about two weeks outside the ten year extended warranty. The folks in Montvale were of no help and, dare I say it, a bit rude. Funny thing is; my cluster was replaced under this warranty in early 2007 with the updated Vogt parts inside. The "Improved" electronic parts failed in significantly less time than the "faulty" originals. How's that for "New and Improved?"

I pulled the cluster and broke it down into its many pieces and everything is intact this time with no dangling electrtonic bits so I do not yet have any idea exactly which one failed. I'll pull out a multimeter tonight and check things out.

One of the earlier posts on this problem listed a number for Alpha Electronics. Called them up and ordered some Infineon 6ZUB102S MosFets. I ordered another round of Fairchild Semiconductor cross referenced MosFets from DigiKey. I'm going to do some destructive testing on these little suckers and see which one lives the longest...hopefully without electrocuting myself. I'll post the winner here. Maybe these Fairchild units will prove to be more robust.

I hope karma singled me out on this one but if you had MB replace your cluster you may not be out of the woods yet.

Quadcammer

you must have one of the very first 220s produced.

Sad to hear you had issues with the new cluster, but it seems you've got the electronics background to fix it up.

good luck.

samdon

It was made in 06/1999(In Service 09/1999) and I've had my share of the common problems. Airmatic has been completely replaced except for the lines. Reed valve in airbox got mucked up and tried to flood the car...caught it at the ultimate moment in space and time so no SAM destruction(did have to replace the blower motor due to slight water intrusion). Eats license plate bulbs like after dinner mints, etc, etc, etc.

But, I still love this car. It does just about everything better than just about anything out there.

The current cluster issue is the first thing that has threatened to stump me. The Mosfets tested OK but one 4.7OHM resistor looked suspect. It was still within spec but had puked a little so I soldered another one in and still have the problem. Maybe the neon tubes? I just don't know. I will fix this thing myself, though. The idea of paying MB's price or even the $425 to the nice folks down in Florida makes my skin crawl. Plus, half the fun is the hunt, right?

If all else fails, I will simply use the primary voltage pins on the PCB to power some stategically placed LED's and do away with the over engineered neon tube system. It's cool to have high voltage neon in a car but given the unreliable nature; it may not have been the best idea Ma-Benz ever had.

On a side note; the Fairchild Semiconductor MosFets will not work as I had hoped. Functionally, they are perfect but the form factor is unacceptable. They use the standard type bolt down mounting system which serves at their heat sink. To get them to fit, most of this mass has to be cut off so the stub can be soldered to a bare spot on the PCB. Even with the inherent heat evacuation capabilities of the board, they fry within minutes rather than years. If I were in the mood to monkey them around a bit and use the bolt through method with the bold used in pinch fashion to a small heat sink on the back of the board, they might just do the trick. Too much work for a possible negative outcome in my opinion. Is there even enough room back there. I dunno. Plus, there is a chance the board would be made into expensive junk.

The 6BUZ102S gems have not arrived from Alpha yet so I haven't put them on the test rig. Report on that issue is forthcoming.

Sam

Skylaw

Sam,

We may be splitting hairs on days in September, but the extended warranty on the clusters is effective 10 years from the initial date of service, not the date of manufacture. It may still be warranted, and I would press the issue. Even if you have missed it by a day or two, I'd still press it to the Area Rep or the Regional Manager if necessary.

And yes, MB records will show the exact date in September '99 the car initially entered service.

If you can restore the cluster to its original condition, perhaps you can pull it off.

samdon

Skylaw,

I did call my dealer about this issue and was treated pretty well by all standards. I'm still waiting for that "call back," though. The SA looked up my "in service" date and found 09/05/1999 so I'm just outside the extended warranty. His course of action was to call the area service rep and attempt to negotiate some "help" on my behalf. Maybe that will garner some results but we are already a week out and I haven't heard anything.

I would have zero problem reassembling the cluster if they agree to replace it at a reasonable charge. I could probably do it in under 5 minutes with all the experience I've had lately. You'd need a 10x loupe to discern my soldering from the original so that shouldn't be an issue.

On a further note; I finally got the Infineon MosFets from Alfa. Slapped them in there and still.....flicker, flicker, black. If you've ever torn one of these jewels down; you can certainly appreciate the huge number of possible failure points. The compexity is staggering when you think about it's intended purpose.

I'll keep the updates coming until this issue is resolved. I'd be happy if MB threw me a bone but I really can't hold out much hope for that.

Skylaw

A reasonable bone would be for them to realize the problem likely existed prior to the 3 days after the warranty expired, and replace it altogether. An alternative would be to provide the part, and you pay labor (they will have to program the new unit).

Honestly! You reported in your original post (4 days after expiration) that it had gone out the day before. I'd really harp on that 3-day thing. Most folks see the cluster flicker occasionally, just briefly, for some time (often weeks or months) before the thing finally goes. Did you see any of that?

Thanks for your updates.

samdon

I did finally hear back from the SA and despite being told that MB USA is "pretty much done" with this issue as each car falls outside the 10 year window; I am fairly happy with the way he seemed to make every attempt to secure assistance. He always has been one of the "good ones." I completely understand their dilema...replace cluster, file for reimbursement from MB.....Denied! That's too big of a chunk for most any high end dealer to eat right now. Even though I have a fleet of MB's I don't use them for service often enough for them to justify taking that hit as a dealer.

What he did offer was a decent discount on the replacement. $1,200 installed and coded/married. That's over $400 less than any reported amount I could find. I buy the part and they do the work. Not too bad as a last resort, I guess.

I'm still tinkering away on the original and if the towel has to be thrown in; I'll bite the bullet. Hey, their detailing crew is top notch and the old girl could use a good bath.

The fat lady has not yet sung on this issue, though. I have way too much free time right now to let it go so easily.

Thanks for the encouragement, Skylaw. There was no prolonged flickering at all. A few blinks then "Goodnight Moon."

Sam

samdon

OK, here's where we are. I must have the car ready to go by Wednesday of next week to drive to the Petit LeMans. No way am I going to conclude my investigation and possible repair in time to trek to the race.

I've heard from a score of people that you cannot install a used cluster. It simply won't work due to coding/programming issues. Wrong! Well, mostly anyway.

As a temporary measure to get the car on the road safely; I bought a used cluster out of a wrecked car which matches my car in almost every respect. Built in the same month, same options, same color inside and out...if that could even matter. The mileage is off by 933 miles.

I reset the service interval and seeing that I don't use the FSS information anyway; this won't cause me any anguish. No codes were thrown. Not even "Display Defective" which I was sort of expecting.

As a side benefit; the used cluster has all of the features I lost when MB replaced the first defective one in 2006. It shows the radio station and preset as well as navigation info in the MFD. I'd forgotten how much I missed the station readout.

I do not intend to keep the used replacement in there....just until the proper one is repaired. The mileage can't be corrected. Plus, the used one has a scratch. I do like the proper MFD info, though.

Updates coming.

Sam

samdon

It is not what I expected nor is it going to provide further motivation to discover a lower cost fix for these ever failing clusters. Ray from MB USA called yesterday to apologize and offer whatever necessary to ensure my complete satisfaction. My cluster will be replaced by Mercedes-Benz of Athens next week....gratis. I guess having six examples of MB's craftsmanship registered with MB USA may have been discovered during their "exhaustive" inquiry into my case. I really do appreciate their attention even at this late date. I was told to call roadside service and ask them to transport my car the the dealership....."your VIN should authorize this expense." Can't beat that.

I won't be able to keep my inoperative cluster to continue troubleshooting as they do not allow that. However, the used cluster that I bought will get the treatment as soon as I find the time and motivation.

I guess good things do happen if you approach the right people and present your case properly.

Many thanks to Skylaw for the encouragement. I doubt I would have persued it further had you not offered the "three day bone" defense as a valid option....worked like a charm.

Sam

Skylaw

Really glad it worked out for you.