Loose nuts on Upper Control Arm ball joint
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 70
Likes: 2
From: Qatar
2002 S320L
Loose nuts on Upper Control Arm ball joint
Hi,
For 2 weeks i am trying to install new struts on my w220 but unfortunately i have some obstacles. For the left side when i try to remove the nut from the upper control arm ball joint it started to spin but only spins, it is not moving. I tried to install another M10 there put steel epoxy between wait 1 day and try yo remove both together, no luck. only way is to cut the nut i think?
Yesterday i tried the other side, while the nut is on the half, ball joint's bolt is started to spin with the nut also. I dont know do i need to change whole upper control arm? Can someone help?
By the way i tried to install strut without removing the upper control arm, i could put the new one inside but i couldnt get the bottom part over spring control arm, may be strut is 2 cm longer, thats why i am trying to remove upper control arm. i hope i am in the correct way.
Thanks
For 2 weeks i am trying to install new struts on my w220 but unfortunately i have some obstacles. For the left side when i try to remove the nut from the upper control arm ball joint it started to spin but only spins, it is not moving. I tried to install another M10 there put steel epoxy between wait 1 day and try yo remove both together, no luck. only way is to cut the nut i think?
Yesterday i tried the other side, while the nut is on the half, ball joint's bolt is started to spin with the nut also. I dont know do i need to change whole upper control arm? Can someone help?
By the way i tried to install strut without removing the upper control arm, i could put the new one inside but i couldnt get the bottom part over spring control arm, may be strut is 2 cm longer, thats why i am trying to remove upper control arm. i hope i am in the correct way.
Thanks
Last edited by engindin; Mar 1, 2015 at 06:58 AM. Reason: Uploading a picture
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From: Clifton, NJ
96 and 08 911 turbos
Are you doing this with the suspension hanging? If so, you may want to compress the suspension so that the ball joint stud taper fits tighter into the spindle.
Stupid design without an allen hole on the stud
Stupid design without an allen hole on the stud
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 70
Likes: 2
From: Qatar
2002 S320L
Yes, suspension hanging but i tried every combination;
- Hanging freely
- Compressing the suspension little with jack
- Putting tire back and getting car down
no luck, and i can not find small cutting saw fitting there to cut the nut. i will find something for that but mine concern is the ball joint, it is embedded to control arm, if it is damaged i think i need to change whole arm. i didnt forced it that much, i am suprised how this fragile ball joint is holding that much force on it.
- Hanging freely
- Compressing the suspension little with jack
- Putting tire back and getting car down
no luck, and i can not find small cutting saw fitting there to cut the nut. i will find something for that but mine concern is the ball joint, it is embedded to control arm, if it is damaged i think i need to change whole arm. i didnt forced it that much, i am suprised how this fragile ball joint is holding that much force on it.
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
Take a hammer and hit the top of the ball joint to reseat it into the taper it fits into.
Support the bottom control arm before doing the impact. So the ball joint does not spring back out after seating.
You can also use a large C clamp to hold the ball joint into the spindle support, give the Ball joint a tap then tighten the c clamp to hold into the taper.
Support the bottom control arm before doing the impact. So the ball joint does not spring back out after seating.
You can also use a large C clamp to hold the ball joint into the spindle support, give the Ball joint a tap then tighten the c clamp to hold into the taper.
Last edited by Critter; Mar 2, 2015 at 01:56 PM.
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From: Ball Ground, GA (N of Atlanta)
2003 S500 2007 GL450
A nut-breaker is a standard tool, available at auto parts stores, Sears, Harbor Freight, etc., etc.
Crude description: a frame that will go around the nut; a hardened wedge facing the nut from inside one end of the frame; a strong bolt threaded into the opposite end of the fame facing the nut. When the bolt is tightened against the nut, the hard wedge is forced into the nut from the other side, and the nut is eventually split. The split nut can easily be unscrewed from the threaded fastener.
Crude description: a frame that will go around the nut; a hardened wedge facing the nut from inside one end of the frame; a strong bolt threaded into the opposite end of the fame facing the nut. When the bolt is tightened against the nut, the hard wedge is forced into the nut from the other side, and the nut is eventually split. The split nut can easily be unscrewed from the threaded fastener.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 70
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From: Qatar
2002 S320L
Thanks wallyp,
I bought 1/2" - 5/8" nut breaker-splitter, before doing that i was afraid for control arm to come loose suddenly so i put one additional nut there. But things were not as my imagination. For 20 minutes i tried to remove that small but powerful nut. anyway after damaging some, i could loosen it and removed it.
I have installed new Arnott Strut and new relay but could not tighten that ball joint properly because it was loose.
While installing the new strut, i put too much force(max:my weight) to lower arm and tierod, i hope i did not damage something there. So after everything i leaved the car for night then next day she was down again, from same wheel side.
I suspected that seal ring where the air hose connects to strut was damaged, i get the old mirror seal which was damaged already, opened a hole in it, cut to the shape and put around hose connector. Installed everything again and raised the car.
To check that there is a leak again, i removed relay and fuse and waiting for tonight. I hope it will work.
Critter,
i hit the ball joint to re-seat into control arm but unfortunately it did not work and i was afraid to make any damage to another part. How is ball joint assembly? If i can be sure that it has seat there, i will try harder.
But i am afraid i need to change upper control arm, i could only attached the control arm and hold it with the nut. only 3/4 of nuts threads holding the ball joint to spindle. To change the upper control arm, I need to put car over the ramps. Do you think that is safe to move the car like this?
I bought 1/2" - 5/8" nut breaker-splitter, before doing that i was afraid for control arm to come loose suddenly so i put one additional nut there. But things were not as my imagination. For 20 minutes i tried to remove that small but powerful nut. anyway after damaging some, i could loosen it and removed it.
I have installed new Arnott Strut and new relay but could not tighten that ball joint properly because it was loose.
While installing the new strut, i put too much force(max:my weight) to lower arm and tierod, i hope i did not damage something there. So after everything i leaved the car for night then next day she was down again, from same wheel side.
I suspected that seal ring where the air hose connects to strut was damaged, i get the old mirror seal which was damaged already, opened a hole in it, cut to the shape and put around hose connector. Installed everything again and raised the car.
To check that there is a leak again, i removed relay and fuse and waiting for tonight. I hope it will work.
Critter,
i hit the ball joint to re-seat into control arm but unfortunately it did not work and i was afraid to make any damage to another part. How is ball joint assembly? If i can be sure that it has seat there, i will try harder.
But i am afraid i need to change upper control arm, i could only attached the control arm and hold it with the nut. only 3/4 of nuts threads holding the ball joint to spindle. To change the upper control arm, I need to put car over the ramps. Do you think that is safe to move the car like this?
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Canada
07 E63 + 07 CLK63CAB
My friend, the top ball joint should be checked for looseness, I have a feeling that the tapered shaft of the ball joint will spin freely by hand. A new ball joint will have considerable resistance to spinning. IT IS THE TAPER OF THE BALLJOINT SHAFT THAT HOLDS IT IN PLACE WHEN YOU GO TO TIGHTEN IT, SO IT MUST BE SEATED AND HELD INTO THE SPINDLE SUPPORT ASSEMBLY UNTIL THE NUT IS TIGHTENED.
DO NOT MOVE THE CAR WITH THE SPINDLE ASSEMBLY HANGING LIKE THAT,
DO NOT MOVE THE CAR WITH THE SPINDLE ASSEMBLY HANGING LIKE THAT,
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MBWorld Fanatic!
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From: Ball Ground, GA (N of Atlanta)
2003 S500 2007 GL450
It can be difficult to seat the ball joint stud in the spindle taper enough to tighten the nut. The problem is that the nut is a self-locking type that requires a lot of force to turn. One thing that you can try is to find a standard (non-self-locking) nut that fits the stud threads. Make sure that the threads are clean and lubricated with engine oil. Use that nut to pull the stud firmly into the taper. The stud should lock into the taper firmly enough for you to remove the standard nut and replace it with the proper locking nut.
While you should not drive the car with the stud loose in the spindle, I would not hesitate to carefully move the car at walking speed onto the ramps with the nuts on the stud as shown in the photo.
While you should not drive the car with the stud loose in the spindle, I would not hesitate to carefully move the car at walking speed onto the ramps with the nuts on the stud as shown in the photo.
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Joined: Sep 2012
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From: Montreal, Quebec
2009 E350 4M Avantgarde;mistress 2002 S600; wife 2014 C300 4M
It can be difficult to seat the ball joint stud in the spindle taper enough to tighten the nut. The problem is that the nut is a self-locking type that requires a lot of force to turn. One thing that you can try is to find a standard (non-self-locking) nut that fits the stud threads. Make sure that the threads are clean and lubricated with engine oil. Use that nut to pull the stud firmly into the taper. The stud should lock into the taper firmly enough for you to remove the standard nut and replace it with the proper locking nut.
While you should not drive the car with the stud loose in the spindle, I would not hesitate to carefully move the car at walking speed onto the ramps with the nuts on the stud as shown in the photo.
While you should not drive the car with the stud loose in the spindle, I would not hesitate to carefully move the car at walking speed onto the ramps with the nuts on the stud as shown in the photo.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 70
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From: Qatar
2002 S320L
Sorry to all, finally i understood how it works. I used a 3" C Clamp as Quadcammer mentions. One side was smooth and okay but the other side was difficult so i followed wallyp, used 10mm normal hex nut, tighten it, removed it but could not tighten self-locking nut. So i put again normal nut then i did not remove that one, just put another self-locking type nut and tighten it to the normal nut.
I already got new Mapco upper control arms, i will do the job when i get time.
I already got new Mapco upper control arms, i will do the job when i get time.
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From: Ball Ground, GA (N of Atlanta)
2003 S500 2007 GL450
If the parts are correct, the tapered stud is clean, dry and undamaged, the tapered hole is clean, dry and undamaged, and you apply sufficient torque to the plain nut, the tapered stud should firmly lock into the tapered hole. Your fix should probably work, though, if there are enough threads in the locking nut to hold it in place.
